So this mark, Would it be something everybody would be REQUIRED TO HAVE no matter what, and if so what could be the punishment of refusing to accept the mark. I think if the mark was '666' then even non christian people would be kiiiiiinda suspicious, and does the AntiChrist KNOW he is the AntiChrist because I have read that Vladamir Putin the Russian President is the AntiChrist on http://www.revelation13.net
Oh and does this mark necessarily have to be a literal mark, would it not be more likely to be some sort of identity card or maybe some kind of implanted chip, for example?
And if all this is predicted in the bible then how do people have free will if the future is basically predetermined?
Preterism
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Dan
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It is not determined, it is predicted. God knows all the variables and how they interact, He knows what people do, He doesn't force them to do that.
Free will != uncertainty in your actions
Free will = your actions being carried out due to your own vocation
The antichrist will know who he is because he will be sent by the great enemy. He hasn't arisen to power yet as I see it, give it a few more years and we'll see how it turns out.
The mark can be a chip or what have you, in fact that will probably be what the mark is.
If you don't accept the mark you'd probably be killed.
Nonbelievers who do not accept the mark are basically swearing allegiance to God, only the good will refuse the mark. They will be converts to christianity and they will be martyred and be sent to heaven.
Free will != uncertainty in your actions
Free will = your actions being carried out due to your own vocation
The antichrist will know who he is because he will be sent by the great enemy. He hasn't arisen to power yet as I see it, give it a few more years and we'll see how it turns out.
The mark can be a chip or what have you, in fact that will probably be what the mark is.
If you don't accept the mark you'd probably be killed.
Nonbelievers who do not accept the mark are basically swearing allegiance to God, only the good will refuse the mark. They will be converts to christianity and they will be martyred and be sent to heaven.
Last edited by Dan on Sat May 21, 2005 6:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
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jerickson314
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jerickson314
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Are you challenging my math skills? Don't make me recite pi! (OK, that works better in person. Most people don't like wasting 2-5 minutes of their life listening to random-sounding numbers.)Dan wrote:Pfft, I read up on C++, I know in computer talk its !=, but in mathematics, it's an equal sign with a slash through the middle. =/=
So nyah!!!
I am completely familiar with the "not equals" operator in mathematics. How else would I have known what you meant? I just think that "=/=" is a really weird way to express it in plain text. For that reason, I prefer != online. I guess ≠ always works. (Unicode character 2260)
If you want a math excercise, integrate e^(i*x) from 0 to pi. Then, if you want another challenge, integrate 1/(x^2 + 1) from 0 to infinity without using any trigonometric functions, not even inverse ones. (Hint: factor x^2 + 1 into (x+i)(x-i).)
If that's not hard enough for you, sorry. I'm only a high school senior.
BWA HA HA HA HA!
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Anonymous
I JUST LEARNED SOMETHING THAT SHOCKED ME
READ THE FOLLOWING, TAKEN FROM A WEBSITE I WAS JUST READING....
Every Christian who is seriously looking for the return of Yahshua is looking for this number to begin showing up. Some segments of Christianity have turned this prophecy into a bit of a superstitious joke, but in spite of this, the prophecy is non-the-less valid. It may surprise some to learn that the number 666 is already here and the prophecy is beginning to be fulfilled. You handle it every day! When it comes to retail merchandise, it is almost impossible to buy anything today that doesn't have the number 666 encoded on it. It is found in the UPC bar code that checkout scanners use. If you would like to clearly see the 6-6-6 sequence in the bar-code for yourself, see my article in the appendix at, 666 in UPC bar-codes The question is, of all the numbers that could have been selected for the purpose that the sequence 6-6-6 is used for in the bar-code, why does it happen to be three sixes? Any other number could have been assigned to the particular sets of bars in question. It even could have been four sixes. Why did it have to be three sixes? Then add to this the fact that this number is inextricably and exclusively tied to the practice of buying and selling and it becomes more obvious this has to do with what is prophesied in the book of Revelation. It can't be just coincidence. The bar code is obviously a precursor of things to come that will be further developed from it. There is technology coming on the scene that might replace this bar code with a chip. But a logistical fact that chip manufacturers must deal with is that all scanners are already programmed to first scan for this 6-6-6 sequence before deciphering the product code. Considering that for some time while the transition from bar-code to chips is completed, retail outlets will be required to have the capacity to scan both chips and bar-code, it is inconceivable to think that the basic format will change. It would cost billions to change the format now. It would mean requiring retail outlets to have two separate types of scanners at each checkout. It won't happen because the 6-6-6 format is workable for both. So in the future, the bar-code might be gone and you won't be able to see the 6-6-6 in it with your eyes, but it will still be there in the chip.
Here is were it starts getting too close to home. In an effort to thwart terrorist activity since the 9-11 terrorist attack, there has been much political talk being reported in the news about governments requiring everyone to have some sort of personal identification. A number of the proposals coming forward have included chip implantation in a person's right hand, and for those few who don't have a right hand there is the proposal to implant the chip in their forehead. It only stands to reason that this chip must also be able to be scanned by the same computers that scan bar-code and other chips. So it will undoubtedly be designed similarly within the same basic 6-6-6 format. As terrorism increases in the world there will be further development of this technology as well as more political endeavors to implement this identification system. When Yahshua made this prophecy in the first century, it was absolutely inconceivable that man would ever have the power, the technology, or the reason to carry it out. But we have it all today... with the number 6-6-6 being firmly established in the process of buying and selling. Considering that there is no prophetic reference made in the Tanach to the number 666, what should these facts indicate concerning Yahshua's credibility?
I am personally of the persuasion that it is very unlikely the implementation of this identification system will come about without the general population understanding exactly what it is all about. As I mentioned in the previous chapter, there will come a time when everyone will be glued to the television watching the news unfold that Yahshua is alive, returning, and in a bad mood as he "treads the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God." (Revelation 19:15) It will be known that he fully intends to forcefully take over and rule the entire world from Jerusalem. He will then be portrayed by the world leaders as the ultimate fanatical religious terrorist and alien that the world must unite against to defeat. By the time world political leaders are through painting this picture of Yahshua, the likes of Saddam Hussein and Osama Binladen will seem like boy scouts. At that time, governments will inform their citizens that "you are either with us, or against us."* Everyone will be required to receive the personal identification chip as a show of solidarity with mankind against Yahshua before they will be able to operate in society buying and selling. Those who take the ID will know exactly what they are doing and what statement they are making.
-----------------------
I had no idea about that, This just makes it even more likely that its soon. Also, would Jesus come first before this thing which is likely to be a chip?
READ THE FOLLOWING, TAKEN FROM A WEBSITE I WAS JUST READING....
Every Christian who is seriously looking for the return of Yahshua is looking for this number to begin showing up. Some segments of Christianity have turned this prophecy into a bit of a superstitious joke, but in spite of this, the prophecy is non-the-less valid. It may surprise some to learn that the number 666 is already here and the prophecy is beginning to be fulfilled. You handle it every day! When it comes to retail merchandise, it is almost impossible to buy anything today that doesn't have the number 666 encoded on it. It is found in the UPC bar code that checkout scanners use. If you would like to clearly see the 6-6-6 sequence in the bar-code for yourself, see my article in the appendix at, 666 in UPC bar-codes The question is, of all the numbers that could have been selected for the purpose that the sequence 6-6-6 is used for in the bar-code, why does it happen to be three sixes? Any other number could have been assigned to the particular sets of bars in question. It even could have been four sixes. Why did it have to be three sixes? Then add to this the fact that this number is inextricably and exclusively tied to the practice of buying and selling and it becomes more obvious this has to do with what is prophesied in the book of Revelation. It can't be just coincidence. The bar code is obviously a precursor of things to come that will be further developed from it. There is technology coming on the scene that might replace this bar code with a chip. But a logistical fact that chip manufacturers must deal with is that all scanners are already programmed to first scan for this 6-6-6 sequence before deciphering the product code. Considering that for some time while the transition from bar-code to chips is completed, retail outlets will be required to have the capacity to scan both chips and bar-code, it is inconceivable to think that the basic format will change. It would cost billions to change the format now. It would mean requiring retail outlets to have two separate types of scanners at each checkout. It won't happen because the 6-6-6 format is workable for both. So in the future, the bar-code might be gone and you won't be able to see the 6-6-6 in it with your eyes, but it will still be there in the chip.
Here is were it starts getting too close to home. In an effort to thwart terrorist activity since the 9-11 terrorist attack, there has been much political talk being reported in the news about governments requiring everyone to have some sort of personal identification. A number of the proposals coming forward have included chip implantation in a person's right hand, and for those few who don't have a right hand there is the proposal to implant the chip in their forehead. It only stands to reason that this chip must also be able to be scanned by the same computers that scan bar-code and other chips. So it will undoubtedly be designed similarly within the same basic 6-6-6 format. As terrorism increases in the world there will be further development of this technology as well as more political endeavors to implement this identification system. When Yahshua made this prophecy in the first century, it was absolutely inconceivable that man would ever have the power, the technology, or the reason to carry it out. But we have it all today... with the number 6-6-6 being firmly established in the process of buying and selling. Considering that there is no prophetic reference made in the Tanach to the number 666, what should these facts indicate concerning Yahshua's credibility?
I am personally of the persuasion that it is very unlikely the implementation of this identification system will come about without the general population understanding exactly what it is all about. As I mentioned in the previous chapter, there will come a time when everyone will be glued to the television watching the news unfold that Yahshua is alive, returning, and in a bad mood as he "treads the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God." (Revelation 19:15) It will be known that he fully intends to forcefully take over and rule the entire world from Jerusalem. He will then be portrayed by the world leaders as the ultimate fanatical religious terrorist and alien that the world must unite against to defeat. By the time world political leaders are through painting this picture of Yahshua, the likes of Saddam Hussein and Osama Binladen will seem like boy scouts. At that time, governments will inform their citizens that "you are either with us, or against us."* Everyone will be required to receive the personal identification chip as a show of solidarity with mankind against Yahshua before they will be able to operate in society buying and selling. Those who take the ID will know exactly what they are doing and what statement they are making.
-----------------------
I had no idea about that, This just makes it even more likely that its soon. Also, would Jesus come first before this thing which is likely to be a chip?
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LittleShepherd
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- Location: Georgia, USA
666 in UPC codes -- No. I just checked the UPC codes of a few completely different, random items, and the number 666 did not appear on any of their bar codes. Even some of the other numbers commonly thought to represent 666, such as 216(6 cubed) did not appear.
Mark & Winepresses -- No. The Bible is quite clear that the "The Mark" event takes place a good while before Jesus' return at the end of the Tribulation event and the whole "winepress" thing. The mark will not be in response to this, but will precede it entirely. Jesus will not be viewed as a "religious terrorist" by the media because his march to Jerusalem will be it. The end. Finito. There won't be enough time for the media to put a spin on it, and for it to make any difference if they did.
Knowing the Mark -- Not necessarily. All they are certain to know is that it is a mark of loyalty, not necessarily that it's the final seal of their doom that will make it impossible to become a follower of Christ if they want to later. Some will be familiar with Revelations and might associate the two, but a lot of people will not. They will be deceived, even though by that point they really should know something's not quite right. Regardless of the knowledge possessed by each individual, everyone who takes the mark will do so willingly. "Taking a stand against Yeshua" will be the farthest thing from most of their minds.
Mark & Winepresses -- No. The Bible is quite clear that the "The Mark" event takes place a good while before Jesus' return at the end of the Tribulation event and the whole "winepress" thing. The mark will not be in response to this, but will precede it entirely. Jesus will not be viewed as a "religious terrorist" by the media because his march to Jerusalem will be it. The end. Finito. There won't be enough time for the media to put a spin on it, and for it to make any difference if they did.
Knowing the Mark -- Not necessarily. All they are certain to know is that it is a mark of loyalty, not necessarily that it's the final seal of their doom that will make it impossible to become a follower of Christ if they want to later. Some will be familiar with Revelations and might associate the two, but a lot of people will not. They will be deceived, even though by that point they really should know something's not quite right. Regardless of the knowledge possessed by each individual, everyone who takes the mark will do so willingly. "Taking a stand against Yeshua" will be the farthest thing from most of their minds.
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kateliz
- Advanced Senior Member
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The Mark is Being Born
They've put computer chips into pets, (for identification,) they're just now putting chips into passports, they're putting chips in eyes, (with cameras too!) and they're merging brain cells, (what are they called again?) with chips. In some schools now they're requiring students to wear GPS enabled ID badges, and I've heard of a college where students wear rings with chips in them for ID, and work places where your chip tracks your exact location in the building at all times and even opens doors for you.
If you combine all of these types of things you get the mark of the beast. A computer chip implanted into your forehead or your hand that without you can't buy or sell. May it also contain your driver's license and social security number, as well as contain your banking info? And would it be GPS enabled?
How would that pledge your allegiance to the Antichrist? It would be because he would control the world markets, banks and governments. That seems pretty logical to me!
Only, how does 666 fit into this scenario? And what is the number of man that the Bible mentions, and what is that all about?
If you combine all of these types of things you get the mark of the beast. A computer chip implanted into your forehead or your hand that without you can't buy or sell. May it also contain your driver's license and social security number, as well as contain your banking info? And would it be GPS enabled?
How would that pledge your allegiance to the Antichrist? It would be because he would control the world markets, banks and governments. That seems pretty logical to me!
Only, how does 666 fit into this scenario? And what is the number of man that the Bible mentions, and what is that all about?
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LittleShepherd
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That, and so much more. It's only limited by how much "memory" they can somehow cram into those chips. As memory technology continues to advance...the sky's really the limit.May it also contain your driver's license and social security number, as well as contain your banking info? And would it be GPS enabled?
I heard an explanation once. See, man was created on the 6th day(the day of man), and God rested on the 7th day(the day of the Lord). As God is triune in Himself, the 666 represents Satan's attempt to be triune in man.Only, how does 666 fit into this scenario? And what is the number of man that the Bible mentions, and what is that all about?
In the end, of course, we don't know for sure. I found that explanation pretty interesting, though. It made as much sense as any of the other weird explanations floating around out there.
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Anonymous