Is the Christian God the same as the Islamic god?

[Zionist]

@ Gman
exactly as you have said and what i was trying to say as well but with questions and stuff. A Jew who accepts christ as savior doesn't stop being a Jew and yes the Koran is it's own separate book with it's own set of guidelines that contradict the bible. on a side note it's good to see you online again Gman and hope all is well with you.

[Jac3510]

But if a Hebrew/Jew suddenly decides that they believe in Jesus as the Messiah, they aren't a practicing Jew any more. Also, saying The Jewish God and the Christian God are the same while Allah "just isn't" is a pretty lame excuse for an argument. It just sounds like you want it to be that way out of nothing more than spite or bias.

Jews can still remain Jews even after they accept the Christian faith. There are many Jews that can attest to that via messianic Judaism which is completely Torah based. Christianity and Judaism IS actually the same although their views on Messiah and salvation are different. The Koran is completely another book altogether. It would do you well to read up on it a bit more.

Are you aware, Gman, that some Muslims remain Muslim after receiving Christ?

[KBCid]

Is it possible for many people to worship the same God and yet have a different conceptual understanding about him? I will let God himself answer;

Job 42:7 ...the LORD said to Eliphaz the Temanite, My wrath is kindled against thee, and against thy two friends: for ye have not spoken of me the thing that is right, as my servant Job hath.

Thus, it is absolutely a fact that different people can worship the same God and do it in two different understandings.

Even the Jews of Christs time thought they were worshipping the same God as Christ Yet Christ pointed out that they were not in fact worshipping the same God;
Luke 19:41-44 And when he was come near, he beheld the city, and wept over it, Saying, If thou hadst known, even thou, at least in this thy day, the things which belong unto thy peace! but now they are hid from thine eyes. For the days shall come upon thee, that thine enemies shall cast a trench about thee, and compass thee round, and keep thee in on every side, And shall lay thee even with the ground, and thy children within thee; and they shall not leave in thee one stone upon another; because thou knewest not the time of thy visitation.

So God and his Son have both testified against errors in understandings by those who thought they new the truth. In this day and time we see the same things occuring over and over. People asserting that they are the true people of God, that their method of worship is the correct one and everyone else is wrong and going to the pit for their errors. The typical error occurs when a human begins with biblical teaching and then incorporates their own understandings into it without biblical backing. We should all check to ensure that we are not like those who sought to help Job because we may be holding concepts about the one and only God that don't follow what he and his Son have taught.

[Zionist]

@ jac
actually a muslim is not a race of people a muslim is an adherent of Islam while a jew is a race of people. when a jew accepts christ as savior the person is still a jew in much the same as if a german accepts christ the person is still german, but a muslim who accepts christ is no longer a muslim because no longer being adherent to islam no longer makes one a muslim.

[Ivellious]

zionist, you are confusing the point entirely. The race of Jews, and the religion of Judaism are separate entities. One can have Jewish heritage but be a Christian, a Muslim, a Hindu, or whatever they want. Just like an African or a Russian can choose to become part of the Jewish faith. You seem to be arguing that because a Jewish person can accept Christ and remain a Jew by race, then the Jewish God is the same God as the Christian God. So, by extension, you must agree that if a Jew chooses to become part of Islam, that their God is the same?

[Zionist]

how would their God be the same? do you understand that the Koran is a separate book from the bible and a muslim is one who adheres to islam. the christian God is the same as the jewish God but the god of islam is not the same. do the research and you'll see. there are many contradictions in the koran and God is not contradicting so if they are the same god then why so many contradictions? same as the LDS a different gospel that isn't from God. Galatians 1:8. Do yourself a favor and do the research yourself instead of trying to argue with me on subjects you have not took the time to study. you honestly think i come to my conclusions based on bias? i did the research on my own and God revealed to me the truth i sought. so put your bias aside and research it because no matter how much material i throw at you or proof i show you unless you do so with an open mind you'll not see what God is trying to show you. pray, pray and continue praying while honestly searching. Matthew 7:7-8 additionally you never answered my questions i originally asked you so do yourself and me a favor research for yourself then come back and answer when you feel you have obtained the answers to those questions. thanks

[RickD]

I originally said that Christians(true, born-again), and Jews believe in a different God. Christians believe in a Trinitarian God, Jews a Unitarian God. Did Saul of Tarsus believe in the same God before he became Paul, as he did after? The bible tells us to see who someone says Jesus is. If it's a different Jesus, than the Jesus of the bible, then that person believes in a different God, right? If Jesus is God, and I deny that, then I'm not really believing in God as He is. I'm believing in a different God. Another thing to think about: if Jews and Muslims believe in the same God, then we as Christians should fellowship with both, without any reservations. And we also wouldn't need to tell them about the gospel of Jesus Christ.

[Zionist]

so am i wrong to call the jewish believers in God brothers and sisters? one thing i dont understand is how believers separate themselves from other believers. the jew and the gentile are grafted together as one. remember that all Israel will be saved as it is written and do we not remember the standpoint of God's choice they are beloved for the sake of the fathers. how can we think more highly of ourselves when it was also said do not be arrogant remeber it is not you who supports the root but the root supports you. it does sadden me to see christians, fellow believers separating themselves from their jewish brothers it really does.

[RickD]

so am i wrong to call the jewish believers in God brothers and sisters?

You could call them brothers and sisters, if you want. But, would you call them brothers and sisters
in Christ? Would you witness about the gospel of Jesus Christ, to your Jewish friends? Or, would you just assume God will save them without having faith in Christ?

how can we think more highly of ourselves when it was also said do not be arrogant remeber it is not you who supports the root but the root supports you. it does sadden me to see christians, fellow believers separating themselves from their jewish brothers it really does.

I don't understand how, because I believe someone can't come to God, except through Christ, that equates to thinking more highly of myself. Do all people, including Jews, need to have faith in Christ, for salvation? Yes, or no?

[B. W.]

Statement:

The Jews and Christians share the same God. The difference is that there is a fuller understanding of God thru Christ that Christians have than do the religious Jews.

The Old Testament (OT) was written with a Trinitarian concept about God’s Oneness. It is all over it, third person speech God uses, His names, personal pronouns used, attributes, metaphoric language (Arm, Hand of the Lord) and how he reveals himself in the OT.

The OT describes that only God can save and that a savior would come, himself, to save and reconcile humanity at an appointed time. The Apostle John identified as the Word which in the OT is revealed as the Malak (Messenger) YHWH. Malak can be any kind of Messenger who bears a word and does tasks, even God.

The religious Jews do not have this revelation, yet. They rejected it in exchange for the doctrines of men to lead them regarding God and His oneness. They made God into a singleness of number and not of unity and made an Idol of the singleness. God is posted as being in the same class as a single chair, tree, or the number One. This in violation of Exodus 20:4, 5 with what they did with the name and as verse five states, answers much of what happened in history.

The bible states there is NONE like God, therefore his oneness is described as Unity of Being. The Being of God has three persons – none like him, is there? Moses asked to see the Lord’s full Glory of oneness and God refused this but made a manner with precaution (Exo 33:19-23). Yet before this event happened, in Exo 24:9, 10, 11 its states that 74 people total saw God! Who did they see and dine with? I’ll let you figure that one out. Then Moses and his group were called higher, to see whom?

You see the religious Jews know of the same God as the Christian’s but lack a full revelation of the Godhead. That is all.

Islam, on the other hand is not the same God as the historical record shows – Muslims revived the MOON god of war/submission of ancient Assyria/Babylon and modernized it the best they could. It is not the same God of the Christians or the Jews no matter how hard people try to spin it...
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[RickD]

B.W. On one hand you said:

The religious Jews do not have this revelation, yet. They rejected it in exchange for the doctrines of men to lead them regarding God and His oneness. They made God into a singleness of number and not of unity and made an Idol of the singleness. God is posted as being in the same class as a single chair, tree, or the number One. This in violation of Exodus 20:4, 5 with what they did with the name and as verse five states, answers much of what happened in history.

And on another you said:

You see the religious Jews know of the same God as the Christian’s but lack a full revelation of the Godhead. That is all.

As for the second paragraph, I don't disagree, except in the part that by not knowing Christ, they don't know God. 1 John 2:22-23 22Who is the liar? It is the man who denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a man is the antichrist—he denies the Father and the Son. 23No one who denies the Son has the Father; whoever acknowledges the Son has the Father also.
And, the first paragraph is basically my point. Until individual Jews come to know God as He is, they can't be saved. Anyone who makes and worships an idol, is worshiping a false god. And, a false god is not God.

[B. W.]

B.W. On one hand you said:

The religious Jews do not have this revelation, yet. They rejected it in exchange for the doctrines of men to lead them regarding God and His oneness. They made God into a singleness of number and not of unity and made an Idol of the singleness. God is posted as being in the same class as a single chair, tree, or the number One. This in violation of Exodus 20:4, 5 with what they did with the name and as verse five states, answers much of what happened in history.

And on another you said:

You see the religious Jews know of the same God as the Christian’s but lack a full revelation of the Godhead. That is all.

As for the second paragraph, I don't disagree, except in the part that by not knowing Christ, they don't know God. 1 John 2:22-23 22Who is the liar? It is the man who denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a man is the antichrist—he denies the Father and the Son. 23No one who denies the Son has the Father; whoever acknowledges the Son has the Father also.
And, the first paragraph is basically my point. Until individual Jews come to know God as He is, they can't be saved. Anyone who makes and worships an idol, is worshiping a false god. And, a false god is not God.

Just making a simple statement that the religious Jews do believe in the same God the Bible speaks of and yes, they also do not know him. They lack the revelation needed to know him, Jesus Christ. They need to be awakened unto salvation like everybody else.

So, on a technicality, Jewish non-messiahian (non- Yeshua’ians) do not know God, yet they know about God the bible speaks of and thus believe in the God of the bible (on their terms). Christians, we also believe and know the God the Bible speaks of as per His revelation to us (not on our terms but by His Grace).

[RickD]

Ok, B.W. I think I'm agreeing with you. I'm just saying it in a different way, perhaps.

[Gman]

Interesting discussion guys... And a very sensitive subject. But yes, I would agree with Zionist here that Jews are actually our long lost brothers. Let me explain how I see it. The Jews have NOT stumbled beyond recovery. This is CLEARLY shown in Romans 11:11.

Romans 11:11 Again I ask: Did they (The Jews) stumble so as to fall beyond recovery? Not at all! Rather, because of their transgression, salvation has come to the Gentiles to make Israel envious.

And let's look at another fact, Jews are only currently "partly" blind as shown in Romans 11:25.

Romans 11:25 I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers and sisters, so that you may not be conceited: Israel has experienced a hardening in part until the full number of the Gentiles has come in.

But here is the kicker.. It states that ISRAEL has experienced a hardening in part. And who is Israel? Look no further than Ephesians 2:11-19

Ephesians 2:11,19 Therefore, remember that formerly you who are Gentiles by birth and called “uncircumcised” by those who call themselves “the circumcision” (which is done in the body by human hands) — 12 remember that at that time you were separate from Christ, excluded from citizenship in Israel and foreigners to the covenants of the promise, without hope and without God in the world. 13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far away have been brought near by the blood of Christ. 19 Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and strangers, but fellow citizens with God’s people and also members of his household.

What are these passages seem to be implying? That BOTH Jews and Christians that are apart of Israel have received this blindness. Therefore Christians are ALSO blind.. Blind to what? I would say blind to the Torah or law. Basically we are not looking down the tree to our Hebrew roots, and the Jews are not looking up the tree to Yeshua. We have also been blinded from our Jewish brothers.

Also as B.W. stated in the Trinity, they are only viewing part of the Trinity or the G-d portion and not the Yesuha or Holy Spirit portion. However they are still looking at the same G-d nonetheless.

[Zionist]

Thank you B.W. and Gman that was the point i was trying to convey. The fact that the God of christians is the same as of the hebrews and that the god of islam is not the same as our heavenly father. The hebrew people are our brothers and have not been forgotten by God. We must pray for them as we should pray for all our brethren around the world. It is also stated in scripture that God blesses those who bless Israel.