Reason to believe

[domokunrox]

Much of this came to me whilst under the influence of cannabis, who else says it is a work of evil?
"And so I tell you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come". Matthew 12:31-32.

Ah, well unfortunately its confirmed now that you must be some kind of mystic. Wow, this is gonna be good. Unfortunately, you cannot put down your bong or whatever it is that you do so that you can have a rational conversation here.

You keep ignoring the fact that you have been and continue to make a non sequitur. Let me go ahead and give you a demonstration of what you sound like.

I wrote this while being under the influence of eating 5 bananas:
The Lord said the greatest commandment is to love God with all your blah blah blah, etc.
Also, the Lord commanded us to love our neighbor, and to love our enemies.

Because I was able to write this while under the influence of eating 5 bananas, God approves my consumption of eating 5 bananas.

Oh, and as a kicker and to insult anyone who disagrees with my banana consumption habits. Disagreement with my banana consumption being directly responsible for what I wrote is somehow blasphemy against the holy spirit.

Here is your last chance, sir. You either want to have a rational discussion or you will just stop. I am ready to recommend you for a ban if you want to continue propagating your anti christ doctrine in a philosophical discussion.

Your move. What is it going to be?

[RickD]

domokunrox wrote:
Here is your last chance, sir. You either want to have a rational discussion or you will just stop. I am ready to recommend you for a ban if you want to continue propagating your anti christ doctrine in a philosophical discussion.

Dom,

Please don't threaten members. If we moderators banned members because of recommendations, Dom, you would have been banned a long time ago.

[oldman]

Here is your last chance, sir. You either want to have a rational discussion or you will just stop. I am ready to recommend you for a ban if you want to continue propagating your anti christ doctrine in a philosophical discussion.

Over the years I have met quite a few people on the internet who not only show their hatred of the truth but also their hatred for the meaning of truth. They cannot reason correctly and have a rational discussion because they cannot acknowledge the truth.



The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ reveals the meaning of His Spirit to fallen man, the love of the Father is the heart of His personality, His love is what governs His reasoning. His love given to and revealed to us through His Son is His righteousness, and this eternal Spirit of pure and perfect love that embraces all knowledge and wisdom is the Spirit of truth: There is no other Spirit of truth, this is obvious: Only the Spirit who is faithful to love unto death will have no reason to deceive and offend any of us.

The only true and perfect Spirit that came through the Father and the Son was also given to the angels who came after, and then to the first man Adam; but through pride and the desire to experience the unknown and gain a greater wisdom, this Spirit died in many of the angels and eventually in Adam also. Even so, by the grace of the Lord Jesus, this Spirit is born in man again. All who are given faith in this Spirit will naturally have faith in the Son. All who are of God have faith in this Spirit. Whoever will not have faith in this Spirit will remain a liar.






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[domokunrox]

Over the years I have met quite a few people on the internet who not only show their hatred of the truth but also their hatred for the meaning of truth. They cannot reason correctly and have a rational discussion because they cannot acknowledge the truth.

Thats great. Please take your own advice and tackle the arguments presented to you instead of committing the fallacy of Begging the question. Thank you.

[1over137]

Hi oldman,

May i ask why you keep claiming that God lead you to canabis when it seems to be in contradiction with the Bible? Do you love God with all your heart when you keep claming God brought you to canabis which seems to be in contradiction with his own words? Do you love God with all your heart that you went to Sciptures to look what God himself has to say on this?

Couldn't just God have stepped into your life after the moment you started to take canabis?

[oldman]

Hi oldman,

May i ask why you keep claiming that God lead you to canabis when it seems to be in contradiction with the Bible?

Hello 1over137,

God is the author of our destinies, now before we go any further please tell me, where exactly does it explain that eating cannabis is in contradiction with the Bible?





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[RickD]

Hi oldman,

May i ask why you keep claiming that God lead you to canabis when it seems to be in contradiction with the Bible?

Hello 1over137,

God is the author of our destinies, now before we go any further please tell me, where exactly does it explain that eating cannabis is in contradiction with the Bible?





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Oldman, here's one perspective:
http://www.godandscience.org/doctrine/marijuana.html

[oldman]

Hi oldman,

May i ask why you keep claiming that God lead you to canabis when it seems to be in contradiction with the Bible?

Hello 1over137,

God is the author of our destinies, now before we go any further please tell me, where exactly does it explain that eating cannabis is in contradiction with the Bible?





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Oldman, here's one perspective:
http://www.godandscience.org/doctrine/marijuana.html

In your own words please, if you can. Then we can can have a proper discussion

[RickD]

Oldman,

The link I provided answers your question. Did you read the link? Where do you disagree with the author?

We can have a proper conversation, by addressing the link, which addresses your question.

[1over137]

Hi oldman,

May i ask why you keep claiming that God lead you to canabis when it seems to be in contradiction with the Bible?

Hello 1over137,

God is the author of our destinies, now before we go any further please tell me, where exactly does it explain that eating cannabis is in contradiction with the Bible?

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It seems to be in contradiction.

Bible on being sober-minded:
1 Corinthians 15:34; 1 Thessalonians 5:4-8; 2 Timothy 4:5; 1 Peter 1:13; 4:7; 5:8; 1 Peter 5:8

[B. W.]

....The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ reveals the meaning of His Spirit to fallen man, the love of the Father is the heart of His personality, His love is what governs His reasoning. His love given to and revealed to us through His Son is His righteousness, and this eternal Spirit of pure and perfect love that embraces all knowledge and wisdom is the Spirit of truth: There is no other Spirit of truth, this is obvious: Only the Spirit who is faithful to love unto death will have no reason to deceive and offend any of us.

The only true and perfect Spirit that came through the Father and the Son was also given to the angels who came after, and then to the first man Adam; but through pride and the desire to experience the unknown and gain a greater wisdom, this Spirit died in many of the angels and eventually in Adam also. Even so, by the grace of the Lord Jesus, this Spirit is born in man again. All who are given faith in this Spirit will naturally have faith in the Son. All who are of God have faith in this Spirit. Whoever will not have faith in this Spirit will remain a liar.

Oldman,

I have several questions for you:

How do you define love?

You mentioned a true an perfect spirit in the second paragraph - which spirit is this?

If this spirit can die as you claim, then it cannot be the Holy Spirit.

Lesson: to be born again refers to how the Holy Spirit enters a person's heart and sanctifies (righteousness - note 2 Thess 2:13),teaches, convicts, and reveals judgment to those whom are born again.

Who is the Holy Spirit to you?
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[oldman]

We can have a proper conversation, by addressing the link, which addresses your question.

First then, I would like to draw your attention to the section, The Bible's take on other mind-altering drugs where it says:

“Although the Bible does not address marijuana directly, it does discuss other mind-altering drugs. Specifically, the Bible addresses the use of drugs in the book of Galatians:

Now the deeds of the flesh are evident, which are: immorality, impurity, sensuality, idolatry, sorcery, enmities, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, disputes, dissensions, factions, envying, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these, of which I forewarn you, just as I have forewarned you, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God. (Galatians 5:19-21)"



I agree that those who use mind expanding or mind altering drugs in order to harness occult forces or evil spirits to further the cause of evil in anyway and do not repent are destined for the wrath to come. This does not mean to say that all cannabis use is evil or cannot be used for good. As I have already tried to explain to you, when the desired effect of cannabis has started to work when taken in moderation, without alcohol, tobacco or any other drug or chemical, or person for that matter, that can so easily inhibit the ability of cannabis to raise one's awareness to higher levels, not only does it become obvious that the senses become so much more improved and the mind so much more relaxed, but it also becomes clear that one can see and reason so much more as well.



Now RickD please give a clear answer, was it good or evil that led me to write down these words?

Those who see and know this Spirit: “the greatest in the kingdom of heaven”, revealed so clearly for too short a time in little children who are believing in Jesus (Matthew 18:1-5, Mark 9:33-37, Luke 9:46-48) and seek to corrupt, torment or destroy this Spirit, will never be saved for there is nothing left to save them, they condemn themselves. Matthew 18:6-7 explains, “Whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to sin, it would be better for him if a millstone were hung around his neck, and he were drowned in the depth of the sea. Woe to the world because of offences! For offences must come, but woe to that man by whom the offence comes!
Again, Matthew 12:31-32 explains, "And so I tell you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come".

The Father's Spirit then given to each of His chosen ones gives new life by transforming their corrupted spirits back into perfect holiness, just as Adam and Eve were before the Spirit of truth in them was confounded and corrupted into something evil by their desire to know evil. The Spirit of God therefore will live in all His chosen ones and ultimately make their unique personalities perfect in knowledge, wisdom and love forever, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit given by the Father will never be broken again.

When the Son of God suffered and died for us He revealed to us His self sacrificing Spirit of perfect love: faithful to love unto death and the only way to overcome our old corrupt spirit of lies and delusion. By His finished work He has revealed in full the essence and character of the Spirit of truth, and we shall only be trusted to live with God forever when He knows we will faithfully give our lives for His sake, “For whoever desires to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for my sake will find it” (Matthew 16:25). Saving faith in this atoning God then is all we need. We who have faith in this God will see His promised paradise where the free and infinite imagination of the Spirit of truth is the infinite realm of everything. Where this Spirit is never threatened or offended again there will be endless joy in free and endless creation.



What is your answer then Rick? Do you also see my understanding of God and His promised paradise as the devil's work?


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[Neha]

I don't think you can connect cannabis to scriptures and find support for it Old Man, its just isn't there. Truth can be revealed in many ways but drug inducement is not one of them as long as you are talking about the Christian faith.

Depends on which group you fall, if you happen to view God in the calvinistic or more properly double (predestination) calvinistic framework then you were DESTINED to be saved and so one way or the other, cannabis or not, you will get saved. The importance of Cannabis is zero since its absence would not change the outcome, that is divine calling and unconditional election.

If however you view God as in the Wesleyan or more non-reformed frameworks do, then you still can't support cannabis. Paul clearly wrote that salvation come from hearing the gospel of Christ or more properly to hear christ in your being. It comes from nowhere else, it needs no other mechanism to activate. And you have to lift up the character of God from the same scriptures too, which also say that God does not tempt or test people with evil or immoral acts. Now you will likely say that cannabis is not mentioned in scriptures but isn't a lot of things? What you need to understand is, that even from a christian perspective, you cannot say, God led you to use cannabis. That goes against the idea of a christian God because it shifts the light to a drug, and its use is entirely subjective. People can say all sorts of weird things under cannabis, including that they may be God or Jesus christ.

Also you need to see that Cannabis alters your senses, amplifies them, as you said you could reason better. But your great reasoning is not rooted in cannabis in any objective way, many christians can and do claim the same thing without using a drug, so no the answer does not lie in cannabis. In other words try to think, you will get to the same results if you applied reason to it.

Also you need to see that a sense heightening drug can not be called to introduce the HS (as christians say) to you, because even in the most basic analysis of the bible, feelings are second things, they are not considered divine or always spiritually reliant. Feeling more, does not mean being spiritual. Unless you fall into a well cult like word of faith movement where, people can laugh or cry or roll on the floor under said spirit, feelings are not evidences of a spiritual encounter. Its a second, low denominator in assessing faith and "spirit".

I don't believe in God but even I wonder why would a God use cannabis to get to you or lead you to it? this is wrong on many levels. It may have led you to God but don't think its pre-ordained or anything, as you won't be able to patch it with the God of the bible. It is and will be contradictory.

[RickD]

Oldman,

I'm sorry I haven't responded to your post. I'm having computer problems again. I only have access to my iphone.

In order for me to give you honest answers, I need a little more info. Could you please answer the questions that B. W. Asked you:

B. W. Asked:

Oldman,

I have several questions for you:

How do you define love?

You mentioned a true an perfect spirit in the second paragraph - which spirit is this?

If this spirit can die as you claim, then it cannot be the Holy Spirit.

Lesson: to be born again refers to how the Holy Spirit enters a person's heart and sanctifies (righteousness - note 2 Thess 2:13),teaches, convicts, and reveals judgment to those whom are born again.

Who is the Holy Spirit to you?
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[oldman]

Oldman,

I'm sorry I haven't responded to your post. I'm having computer problems again. I only have access to my iphone.

In order for me to give you honest answers, I need a little more info. Could you please answer the questions that B. W. Asked you:

Oldman,

I have several questions for you:

How do you define love?

As far as I am aware I have already defined what I believe perfect love is and how it came to exist. The Son of God came from His Father before anything was made. From the Father and the Son came their perfect and eternal love for each other. Their love is their endless joy in their pure and perfect caring, sharing and giving to each other all that they are and all that they care to create. The Son came from the Father and He naturally looks up to His Father, but without the Father's only eternal child there would be no possibility for an eternal God known as "love", "God is love", as Scripture clearly proclaims, and this love cannot exist with one person alone. This love, this God called love, needs at least two free thinking reasoning minds. Through the eternal Son the Father became the eternal giver of joy in perfect caring and sharing, and through the eternal Father His Son became the eternal receiver and giver of this same Spirit. Without the eternal Son there would be no such Spirit of pure and perfect eternal love; and it is this eternal Spirit that comes through the Father and the Son, and with the Father and the Son, all creation is governed. This Spirit naturally embraces all knowledge and wisdom and would mean nothing without being the heart or the innermost ruling character of a person.

You mentioned a true an perfect spirit in the second paragraph - which spirit is this?

See above and below

If this spirit can die as you claim, then it cannot be the Holy Spirit.

I disagree, the Spirit of truth God gave to Adam died in Adam the moment Adam gave into Satan's temptation and valued his own desire to know evil above his Father's warning. This perfect Spirit that was sovereign in the then perfect Adam was corrupted into a spirit of lies and rebellion against God. The pure and perfect Spirit that was the innermost ruling character in Adam had died in Adam.

Lesson: to be born again refers to how the Holy Spirit enters a person's heart and sanctifies (righteousness - note 2 Thess 2:13),teaches, convicts, and reveals judgment to those whom are born again.

Who is the Holy Spirit to you?

He is the one who guides me and enlightens me.

Only the Spirit that is faithful to love unto death, will have no reason to deceive and offend any of us, such is the Spirit that is revealed by the Lord Jesus and by His true followers.

This Spirit is the only proven conveyor of truth simply because no one can even begin to explain an alternative in which we all can trust.
Can they Rick?


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