why i stopped talking in tongues

[nuthajason]

Congrats – guess that since there are no longer tongues (the Gifts being done away with) proves that God does renege on his gifts, callings, and promises. Congrats, for pointing this out! This would also apply to John 3:16 - God may renege on that promise as well! Congrats guess this has proven beyond all reasonable doubt, God can’t keep a promise and is so unable to keep his word – well done! Bravo!

but biblically God does bring gifts in and out as needed. does anyone heal with their shadow or a handkerchief these days? Has anyone stopped the sun recently or turned rivers to blood or stopped the rain? in Israel's log history there were times of huge intervention by the Lord and times of quiet. We think it has been a long time since Christ but the story of the old testament covers at least twice as much time. a lot of which had no huge inbreaking of the kingdom. now, the fruit of the spirit is a different thing and some gifts are still with us. I am however very suspicious of anyone who calls themselves a prophet. For me the bible is all sufficient, for every good work.

[RickD]

And just to add, I'd be very suspicious of anyone who claims to have the gift of healing. EXTREMELY SUSPICIOUS!!!

[RickD]

Wasn't the gift of tongues given so people could preach the good news to others who spoke in a different language? Has anybody seen/heard that going on today? Is it possible that somewhere, maybe God gives a missionary the ability to communicate in the language of the country he is in? Maybe, but that's certainly not what "charismatics" and others consider to be tongues.

[Philip]

When I was very young (19-20), I was influenced by a co-worker who was a wonderful Christian that spoke in tongues. Only thing was that his church believed that they were THE key sign as to whether or not one is saved (clearly unscriptural). But I can remember wanting to speak in tongues. I even prayed to. I tried to look in the mirror and get into a trance-like state - so strange and silly, looking back 36 years. But nothing! I remember being worried that perhaps I wasn't truly saved (I know I was, at eight). Point is, I was once very open to having this gift and/or believing they were for Christians today. And so I both prayed for it and wanted it. Later I realized the redflags and become extremely skeptical about them, although I've known a few wonderful Christians who practiced them. But the more I studied how tongues are depicted in the New Testament, the more skeptical I became. I've also been very wary due to the often strange and bizarre manifestations of them, and (IF from the Lord) clear abuse of them.

Anyway, I'm quite curious (yep, that's my nickname!) about those here that say they have quit speaking in tongues.

For those that have quit, please enlighten us:

1) What do you think it was that caused the tongues coming from you to be uttered? What were their source - you or something/someone else? Were you in control of the tongues or were they - or was another source causing them - and in control? If you believe that God was their source, why do you believe that?

2) If YOU were the source of tongues emitted by your own voice, were you merely imitating those around you, simply putting on your own creative show? Or what? And WHY?

3) Was it difficult to stop speaking in tongues?

[Gman]

When I was very young (19-20), I was influenced by a co-worker who was a wonderful Christian that spoke in tongues. Only thing was that his church believed that they were THE key sign as to whether or not one is saved (clearly unscriptural). But I can remember wanting to speak in tongues. I even prayed to. I tried to look in the mirror and get into a trance-like state - so strange and silly, looking back 36 years. But nothing! I remember being worried that perhaps I wasn't truly saved (I know I was, at eight). Point is, I was once very open to having this gift and/or believing they were for Christians today. And so I both prayed for it and wanted it. Later I realized the redflags and become extremely skeptical about them, although I've known a few wonderful Christians who practiced them. But the more I studied how tongues are depicted in the New Testament, the more skeptical I became. I've also been very wary due to the often strange and bizarre manifestations of them, and (IF from the Lord) clear abuse of them.

Anyway, I'm quite curious (yep, that's my nickname!) about those here that say they have quit speaking in tongues.

For those that have quit, please enlighten us:

1) What do you think it was that caused the tongues coming from you to be uttered? What were their source - you or something/someone else? Were you in control of the tongues or were they - or was another source causing them - and in control? If you believe that God was their source, why do you believe that?

2) If YOU were the source of tongues emitted by your own voice, were you merely imitating those around you, simply putting on your own creative show? Or what? And WHY?

3) Was it difficult to stop speaking in tongues?

Phil.. Some good questions. Again, I don't claim to have the ultimate truth on speaking in tongues. What I'm expressing here is merely my opinion. My personal belief is that "speaking in tongues" can be expressed two ways.

1. Speaking in a known language by men.
2. Speaking to G-d by chants (but not gibberish).

Speaking in tongues during the time of Acts, many heard spirit filled Christians speaking other nations languages as recorded in Acts 2:6. Why? I believe it was used to spread the news of G-d in other languages AND to show that G-d has the power over languages in order to bring unity or division as He did at the Tower of Babel. Acts 2 would be a reversal of the Tower of Babel to bring unity instead of division. Second, I don't believe that the tongues of angels are gibberish. There are numerous Bible examples of angels speaking to men. In not a single instance do they communicate in anything except in languages that are perfectly understandable, a communication that the recipient can process readily. There is not one shred of biblical evidence to suggest that angels speak in disjointed, incomprehensible gibberish. But I'm not necessarily ready to say that it is all bunk either. That is why I believe you could chalk up this communication of prayer as merely as chanting as recorded in 1 Corinthians 14:2.

Now this is my problem with those who believe that speaking in tongues is the only way to know that someone is spirit filled. I have a really really hard time believing that and not even talk about obedience to G-d. To me there needs to be some kind obedience to G-d's commandments otherwise it is just lip service..

I believe this is summed up very well in 1 John..

1 John 3:22-24 then, whatever we ask for, we receive from him; because we are obeying his commands and doing the things that please him. 23 This is his command: that we are to trust in the person and power of his Son Yeshua the Messiah and to keep loving one another, just as he commanded us. 24 Those who obey his commands remain united with him and he with them. Here is how we know that he remains united with us: by the Spirit whom he gave us.

However if someone feels compelled to utter gibberish and say that brings them closer to G-d. Who am I to judge that? It's only when someone says that is the only way to know someone is spirit filled is where I have the problem.

IMO...

[Gman]

And remember.. Love speaks louder than words...

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xyAJa2J9xQ4[/youtube]

[Philip]

However if someone feels compelled to utter gibberish and say that brings them closer to G-d. Who am I to judge that? It's only when someone says that is the only way to know someone is spirit filled is where I have the problem.

Scripture teaches us to test false spirits speaking through false prophets: "Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world." (1 John 4:1)

When I see a church consumed with speaking gibberish, chaotically, doing many bizarre and unedifying things, it is disturbing. The source is potentially demonic. We ARE to judge, righteously, and to test ALL things. I see that we are to do no differently when it comes to tongues.

[Gman]

However if someone feels compelled to utter gibberish and say that brings them closer to G-d. Who am I to judge that? It's only when someone says that is the only way to know someone is spirit filled is where I have the problem.

Scripture teaches us to test false spirits speaking through false prophets: "Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world." (1 John 4:1)

When I see a church consumed with speaking gibberish, chaotically, doing many bizarre and unedifying things, it is disturbing. The source is potentially demonic. We ARE to judge, righteously, and to test ALL things. I see that we are to do no differently when it comes to tongues.

Thank you Phil.. Yes, I believe you can be correct about that too.. Miracles or signs are not always a way to discern the presence of the Holy Spirit. Christ rather tells us when we practice "lawlessness" is a way to tell..

Matthew 7:21-23 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’

[PeteSinCA]

Not sure why this thread was started when very similar thread was begun several days earlier. I posted a series of posts surveying Scriptures relevant to this and related topics, which seem to have gone unnoticed. But I'll ask folks who have posted in this thread, why would Satan counterfeit a three dollar bill?

[Gman]

Not sure why this thread was started when very similar thread was begun several days earlier. I posted a series of posts surveying Scriptures relevant to this and related topics, which seem to have gone unnoticed. But I'll ask folks who have posted in this thread, why would Satan counterfeit a three dollar bill?

Sure.. What I'm saying here however is that someone claiming to be speaking in tongues (which I believe can be either the tongues of men or just chanting to G-d) as an all means to the presence of the Holy Spirit. I think it is much more complicated than that such as knowing a person by their fruits as record in Matthew 7:16. In other words, I wouldn't marry something just because it is a sign.. There are signs all over the place.. It is our duty to discern if it is of G-d or not.

[Philip]

I see the supposed Scriptural explanations that tongues are supposedly a spiritual gift still given by God today. But what I'm not seeing are any answers to my biggest questions: Why, if GOD STILL gives the gift of tongues, and as He has abundantly sprinkled the other Scripturally listed gifts throughout Christians in ALL true, Jesus-believing churches across the world - then why are tongues totally missing from Christians in the vast majority of Jesus-following/honoring churches? This is a HUGE redflag for me. And this absence of or practice of tongues is significantly correlated along denominational lines. WHY and WHY? Pete, etc - no one is answering this key question! This just doesn't make any sense to me. Add in the large number of those churches that DO manifest tongues - chaotically and bizarrely - well, it makes me ever more wary. IF tongues are a spiritual gift, then no church or denomination simply chooses to have or pursue them. And so I'd just like some answers to these questions.

Thanks.

[B. W.]

I see the supposed Scriptural explanations that tongues are supposedly a spiritual gift still given by God today. But what I'm not seeing are any answers to my biggest questions: Why, if GOD STILL gives the gift of tongues, and as He has abundantly sprinkled the other Scripturally listed gifts throughout Christians in ALL true, Jesus-believing churches across the world - then why are tongues totally missing from Christians in the vast majority of Jesus-following/honoring churches? This is a HUGE redflag for me. And this absence of or practice of tongues is significantly correlated along denominational lines. WHY and WHY? Pete, etc - no one is answering this key question! This just doesn't make any sense to me. Add in the large number of those churches that DO manifest tongues - chaotically and bizarrely - well, it makes me ever more wary. IF tongues are a spiritual gift, then no church or denomination simply chooses to have or pursue them. And so I'd just like some answers to these questions.

Thanks.

Primarily for the reason's listed in 1 Co 13:1,2,3

People make dumb idols out of the things of God all the time.

A person can even, make the bible into an idol as well.

The gifts are still there and people are the same as when Paul wrote of the gifts. In that, you will find an answer that does not present a logical contradiction to Hebrews 13:8
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[Philip]

Primarily for the reason's listed in 1 Co 13:1,2,3

People make dumb idols out of the things of God all the time.

A person can even, make the bible into an idol as well.

The gifts are still there and people are the same as when Paul wrote of the gifts. In that, you will find an answer that does not present a logical contradiction to Hebrews 13:8
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Yes, the 1 Corinthians 13 verses would explain the abuse of the gift of tongues, but they in no way explain why the vast majority of Christians in today's Christian churches exhibit the distribution of ALL of the other gifts EXCEPT tongues. What is different about the gift of tongues that God has not distributed it with equal generosity across the church as He obviously has the other gifts? And largely along denominational lines? Why would God be so "stingy" as to how He has given such a small percentage of His Church the gift of tongues? Especially, as He clearly knew that amongst the ones (supposedly) given this gift, such a large number of them would greatly abuse it.This is clearly what we see - extremely limited distribution and abuse. And there is NOTHING in Scripture to suggest that the gift of tongues is unique as to its distribution or as to its supposed receivers (in fact, quite the opposite).

So, what's up with this ENORMOUS distribution disparity? Why the withholding to the far greater majority? Why the distribution only to specific churches and largely along denominational lines? And why are these the cases with ONLY the gift of tongues, and not with the other gifts?

[B. W.]

Primarily for the reason's listed in 1 Co 13:1,2,3

People make dumb idols out of the things of God all the time.

A person can even, make the bible into an idol as well.

The gifts are still there and people are the same as when Paul wrote of the gifts. In that, you will find an answer that does not present a logical contradiction to Hebrews 13:8
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Yes, the 1 Corinthians 13 verses would explain the abuse of the gift of tongues, but they in no way explain why the vast majority of Christians in today's Christian churches exhibit the distribution of ALL of the other gifts EXCEPT tongues. What is different about the gift of tongues that God has not distributed it with equal generosity across the church as He obviously has the other gifts? And largely along denominational lines? Why would God be so "stingy" as to how He has given such a small percentage of His Church the gift of tongues? Especially, as He clearly knew that amongst the ones (supposedly) given this gift, such a large number of them would greatly abuse it.This is clearly what we see - extremely limited distribution and abuse. And there is NOTHING in Scripture to suggest that the gift of tongues is unique as to its distribution or as to its supposed receivers (in fact, quite the opposite).

So, what's up with this ENORMOUS distribution disparity? Why the withholding to the far greater majority? Why the distribution only to specific churches and largely along denominational lines? And why are these the cases with ONLY the gift of tongues, and not with the other gifts?

1 Co 12:11, But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually just as He wills. NASB

May having something to do with it ... with that, I can rest at ease because I am not the one


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[PeteSinCA]

long before the strangfire conference I have been worried about the whole tongue's issue as I just cannot see a good mandate for it in scripture.

I'm not sure what you mean by "a good mandate for it in scripture", nor "tongue's issue" (my emphasis). The book of 1 Corinthians says much about speaking in tongues, but perhaps you should clarify what you mean by "mandate" and "issue". At any rate:

1 Corinthians 12:4 Now there are varieties of gifts, but the same Spirit. 5 And there are varieties of ministries, and the same Lord. 6 There are varieties of effects, but the same God who works all things in all persons. 7 But to each one is given the manifestation of the Spirit for the common good. 8 For to one is given the word of wisdom through the Spirit, and to another the word of knowledge according to the same Spirit; 9 to another faith by the same Spirit, and to another gifts of healing by the one Spirit, 10 and to another the effecting of miracles, and to another prophecy, and to another the distinguishing of spirits, to another various kinds of tongues, and to another the interpretation of tongues. 11 But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually just as He wills.
...
28 And God has appointed in the church, first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, administrations, various kinds of tongues. 29 All are not apostles, are they? All are not prophets, are they? All are not teachers, are they? All are not workers of miracles, are they? 30 All do not have gifts of healings, do they? All do not speak with tongues, do they? All do not interpret, do they?

Genuine speaking in tongues was and is the work of the Holy Spirit, and appointed by God.

1 Corinthians 14:5 Now I wish that you all spoke in tongues, but even more that you would prophesy; and greater is one who prophesies than one who speaks in tongues, unless he interprets, so that the church may receive edifying.

Not quite a mandate or command to speak in tongues, but clearly Paul saw speaking in tongues as a valid and valuable gift of the Holy Spirit.

when I told my close friends I had decided to stop talking in tongues I got an interesting range of responses. from pity to shunning.

How you communicated, "I had decided to stop talking in tongues," to your various friends may have affected their reactions. But assuming for the sake of discussion that your manner of communication had no effect beyond communicating a simple decision, reactions such as "pity" and "shunning" were utterly inappropriate and unscriptural. For that matter those kinds of reactions could only be appropriate were your manner of communication highly offensive and hostile.

... no one online or in person has been able to sit with a bible and give me a good hermeneutical exposition to justify this practice ...

Paul called speaking in tongues a gift given by the Holy Spirit, and a gift by the appointment of God. What further "justification" is needed?

... after this process I am even more convinced that tongues aren't for today.

What is your basis for making this assertion? If you allude to 1 Corinthians 13:8-12:

8 Love never fails; but if there are gifts of prophecy, they will be done away; if there are tongues, they will cease; if there is knowledge, it will be done away. 9 For we know in part and we prophesy in part; 10 but when the perfect comes, the partial will be done away. 11 When I was a child, I used to speak like a child, think like a child, reason like a child; when I became a man, I did away with childish things. 12 For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face; now I know in part, but then I will know fully just as I also have been fully known.

I responded to this argument in the other thread I linked in this way:

Verses 8-12 show where Cessationists are correct, and where they are incorrect. Faith, hope and love are enduring, will last into eternity; spiritual gifts will cease (you know, Cessationist). The question is, when. Verses 10-12 answer this clearly: the gifts of the Spirit will cease when they are no longer necessary, when Jesus' return makes spiritual gifts unnecessary.

... this practice which I have observed in other world religions and which I believe is a potentially dangerous practice.

What happens in other religions is an irrelevant and emotive red herring argument. Paul clearly and unequivocally states that one of the gifts given by the Holy Spirit is speaking in tongues. You say speaking in tongues is "a potentially dangerous practice"; Paul said speaking in tongues is a gift given by the Holy Spirit at the appointment of God; Paul's "opinion" is Scripture.

I would challenge anyone here to give me good counter arguments (no tiny out of context proof texts either please).

Since it is for you to define "good counter arguments", and you can set those goalposts as you choose, I'll leave that to you. As to "tiny out of context proof texts", I've included significant portions of 1 Corinthians chapters 12, 13, and 14 in this post. If you view those quotes as "tiny" and "out of context", I'll happily post all three chapters in their entirety, subject to the rules of this forum and the judgment of the forum Moderators.