Who said that Satan is a fallen angel who tempts, kills...?

[jerzy]

The Bible doesn't mention that Satan is a fallen angel.

Further, Jesus called Peter Satan in Mt 16:23.

Speaking about the thief in Jn 10:10 Jesus refers to at least 8 prophets like Eze 34:1-10. He was referring to the Jewish leaders not to the supposed fallen angel Satan.

Jesus came "that they which see (the Pharisees) not might see" Jn 9:39.

The Father, Lord of heaven and earth "hid these things from the wise and prudent" Mt 11:25.

God sends strong delusion, that they should believe a lie 1Th 2:11

Jesus always spoke to the Pharisees in parables because it is not given to them to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven Mt 13:34+11.

Well, how many of those parables have been used in over 33 000 Christian Churches as literal statements although they were designed to blind?

Man is tempted by his own lust Jam 1:14-15 not by a supposed fallen angel Satan.

God not the supposed fallen angel Satan kills and destroys De 32:39, Isa 45:7, Eze 14:13, Heb 12:29. As the matter of fact at least 50% of the OT records why and how God kills and destroys people and nations.

[1over137]

http://www.godandscience.org/doctrine/who_is_satan.html

[1over137]

Matthew 4:1-11
The Temptation of Jesus

4 Then Jesus was led up by the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted by the devil. 2 And after He had fasted forty days and forty nights, He [a]then became hungry. 3 And the tempter came and said to Him, “If You are the Son of God, command that these stones become bread.” 4 But He answered and said, “It is written, ‘Man shall not live on bread alone, but on every word that proceeds out of the mouth of God.’”

5 Then the devil *took Him into the holy city and had Him stand on the pinnacle of the temple, 6 and *said to Him, “If You are the Son of God, throw Yourself down; for it is written,

‘He will command His angels concerning You’;
and

‘On their hands they will bear You up,
So that You will not strike Your foot against a stone.’”
7 Jesus said to him, “On the other hand, it is written, ‘You shall not put the Lord your God to the test.’”

8 Again, the devil *took Him to a very high mountain and *showed Him all the kingdoms of the world and their glory; 9 and he said to Him, “All these things I will give You, if You fall down and [c]worship me.” 10 Then Jesus *said to him, “Go, Satan! For it is written, ‘You shall worship the Lord your God, and [d]serve Him only.’” 11 Then the devil *left Him; and behold, angels came and began to minister to Him.

James 4:7 ESV
Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.

Ephesians 6:11 ESV
Put on the whole armor of God, that you may be able to stand against the schemes of the devil.

Ephesians 4:27 ESV
And give no opportunity to the devil.

2 Corinthians 2:11 ESV
So that we would not be outwitted by Satan; for we are not ignorant of his designs.

Etc.

[PaulSacramento]

Luke 10:18

Jesus says He say Satan fall.

Peter was called "satan" because he was opposing Jesus at that time, although some also interpret that passage as Jesus ordering satan to stop influencing Peter.

To suggest that God is the CAUSE of evil is just plain silly BUT you are correct in the fact that God does kill and punish the wicked ( that fail to repent).

[jerzy]

1over137
None of your texts state that Satan is a fallen angel.

Let’s leave the NT for a moment.

Let me ask you the basic question: do you know how many times the word “Satan” appears in the OT and how many times it is transliterated instead of translated? Do you know why?

PaulSacramento
We have to determine who Satan really is before we understand what God is telling us.
1. God doesn’t tell us that Satan is a fallen angel.
2. You are correct on Mt 16:23. At that particular moment Peter was trying to do what was the best according to his human way of thinking. Unfortunately he didn’t consider that it was out of line with God’s purpose and Jesus’ mission.
3. The issue of “evil” is subjective depending on a point of reference. Let’s consider the flood during Noah’s time. Was the flood good for them who were perishing? Was the flood appropriate or necessary “good” under the circumstances from God’s point of view?

God acts as He dims necessary. Many who suffer don’t consider it good. As the matter of fact not many Christians are aware that they suffer because they became wicket.

Alas, they attribute God’s “chastising” to acts of their stupid idol supposed fallen angel Satan. They strip God of His Kingdom, power and glory attributing it all to their idol while they suffer more and more. They were butchering their Trinitarian brothers by millions in the WW 1. No repentance. They went into the much greater butchering in the WW 2. No awakening.

What is the next to come? The WW 3? The Armageddon?

Do you think that the Trinitarians will care for what God says?
Do you think that the Satan idolaters will acknowledge that God not their stupid idol supposed fallen angel kills and destroys? Can’t they read the OT at least once?

[B. W.]

..

I would watch what you say, jerzy, as you seem to be doing what Isaiah 5:20 warns about doing...

Do you have a clue what the word 'satanas' means?

Do you even know what the word' angel' actually means and how it was used in both OT and NT?
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[1over137]

None of your texts state that Satan is a fallen angel.

I made two posts. Have you seen the link from my first post?

[jerzy]

B.W.

Yes, I know what Isa 5:20 says. I am not changing God’s word by merely pointing to texts like De 32;39, Isa 45:7, Eze 14:13 to mention but three.

I also know what the word means in both OT and NT. It never means a fallen angel. It means a person (like Peter), people (like Pharisees) or human lust/way of thinking. While James is clear on genesis of sin in Jam 1:14-15 Paul describes his own struggle with his sinful nature in Rom 7:15-24.

One is certain, God doesn’t mention that there exist a fallen angel Satan who tempts, kills and destroys.

It is certain that we are tempted by our own lust.

It is certain that no a supposed fallen angel Satan but God kills and destroys (directly by His Spirit or His angels or indirectly by setting wicket against evil people).

Christianity borrowed many of the pagan beliefs (with some modifications) and declared as their official teachings. The fallen angel Satan is one of them.

Unfortunately it is one of the most contrary (if not the most contrary) to God’s word. It acknowledges existence of a supernatural power opposing God, tempting, killing and destroying.

1. God’s word clearly states that there is no power besides the power of God.
2. It states that God kills and destroys.
3. Further, it states that we are responsible for controlling our lustful body and have nobody but ourselves to blame for our sins.

Propagating the supposed fallen angel Satan theology is idolatry.

[jerzy]

1over137

Yes, I saw your posts. This link http://www.godandscience.org/doctrine/who_is_satan.html offers the common non-Biblical pagan flavoured story modified by Christians substituting the old Egyptian bad god Set with the supposed fallen angel Satan.

Since none of your texts state that Satan is a fallen angel and you cannot point to a text stating that there exists a fallen angel Satan but merely point to the Satan’s attributes I asked you to get to the basis:

Let me ask you the basic question: do you know how many times the word “Satan” appears in the OT and how many times it is transliterated instead of translated? Do you know why?

Please forget for a moment what people say but try to find out from God’s word if Satan is really a fallen angel. Explain why out of 27 times the word Satan appears in the OT it is translated as adversary 8 times only when it points to people or an angel. Compare with Mt 16:23 where the word is merely transliterated although it is clearly pointing to a person. Unfortunately people are trying to explain away the absolutely clear text which provides reason why Peter was Satan to Jesus in this particular moment.

[1over137]

I will have a look. It may take some days.

[jerzy]

1over137

We lost a lot of information because of manipulated translations.
We also don’t pay attention to what God says (to know the Bible well is a challenge) but rely on pulpit man assuming that all of them are interested in our salvation not in our money and their position of control and authority.

The fact is that a fallen angel Satan is not found in the Bible. However, it is a very good scaring tool for the pulpit man.

The Bible makes it clear that the bad or lying spirits come from God.

But there is a twist in the NT. There seem to be explosion of satanic activity. It seems to prove the fallen angel theology.

However the facts are clear. The Jews were often back sliding to pagan belief. God kept correcting them by His prophets and punished when refused to comply. We notice that God didn’t send prophets for circa 500 years prior to John the Baptist and Jesus. The Jews quickly forgot God’s teaching to the point that they rejected their so clearly foretold Messiah. They placed themselves in a position of authority, added their own laws and turned to the pagan beliefs again.

Christians fail to note that:
1. The demons (mentioned 4 times in the OT as wood-curved stupid idols) proclaimed that Jesus was the Son of God the term Jesus explains in Jn 10:34-36.
2. The Jewish perceived supernatural powers submited to the supposed Messiah’s imposter. On one account they asked Jesus to turn them into pigs. What??? Into the unclean animals? Can you see God’s wisdom? Can you imagine Pharisees looking at that?
3. Jesus (and the Father) blinded them by speaking in parables.
4. The parables are to “shut” the Kingdom of Heaven to the blinded.
5. The so called demon possession of sick people are clearly understood by the apostles in Jn 9:1-3.

Alas, the pulpit man uses those blinding parables as literal proof of existence of their stupid idol supposed fallen angel.

[1over137]

Your last post was really unnecessary. I already know your position and told you that it may take me some days to look at it (and then reply to you)

We lost a lot of information because of manipulated translations.
We also don’t pay attention to what God says (to know the Bible well is a challenge) but rely on pulpit man assuming that all of them are interested in our salvation not in our money and their position of control and authority.

I hope you do not assume this of all people.

[neo-x]

So you are saying there is no satan, jerzy?

[jerzy]

1over137

Sorry, I didn’t mean to offend you but wanted to provide a bit more of information on the subject.

While most of the Christians never read the entire Bible through many of the pulpit man are ignorant or preach false doctrines deliberately to conform to what people want.

[jerzy]

neo-x

No, I don’t say there is no Satan.

I say that according to God’s word it is not a fallen angel who opposes God, tempts us to sin, kills and destroys.