repeated sins

[Seeker]

Im pretty sure this was posted already on the website but im not 100% sure and it has been on my mind lately. Does God's forgiviness continue even if the sin that you commit is a sin that you repeatedly do even after asking for forgiveness?

[neo-x]

short answer...Yes

[Silvertusk]

short answer...Yes

Which is a huge relief I can tell you.....

[neo-x]

Absolutely bro.

[Danieltwotwenty]

If we couldn't get forgiveness for repeated sins then the new creation is going to be very lacking in the human department.

[neo-x]

yes and God understands that we might stumble again and again. Christ's work on the cross saves us.

[Stu]

Well hang on. If you ask for forgiveness, but in your heart do not regret committing that sin (and so continue to do so knowing full well you will just ask for forgiveness again) you are merely paying lip service.
This is not asking for forgiveness but asking for a pass, two different things.

Of course if you are sincere in your asking for forgiveness but nevertheless sin then that is another matter.

[neo-x]

if someone is merely doing lip service than he has more deeper problems like salvation to look for first. we are talking about coming into christ and after that.

[jlay]

Well hang on. If you ask for forgiveness, but in your heart do not regret committing that sin (and so continue to do so knowing full well you will just ask for forgiveness again) you are merely paying lip service.
This is not asking for forgiveness but asking for a pass, two different things.

Of course if you are sincere in your asking for forgiveness but nevertheless sin then that is another matter.

Stu, not to be mean, but that is a lie straight from the pit of Hell.

We can NEVER exhibit enough remorse, regret or contrition for sin.
And further, salvation does not require us to ask for forgiveness. As if we have to beg and negotiate with God to forgive us. Please God, will you forgiv me? Answer": He already has. Jesus died for the sin of the world. How many? All of them. Even the ones not committed yet? Yes. Jesus has forgiven sin. And we need that forgiveness appropriated in our lives. We receive that as a free gift through faith, and not by mustering up enough regret. Should we feel regret? Of course. But imagine getting to heaven to find out, "Well Stu, you just didn't have enough regret when you ____________. So you're out!" This says that our salvation is contingent on our ability; in this case our ability to show God how 'serious' we are. Stu, I used to follow this same Lordship thinking. And bottom line, I was a self-rigtheous, fruit inspector, who frankly thought his sin didn't stink as bad as the next guys.

That said, we are not to use the grace of God for an occassion of the flesh. The liberty we have in Christ is not freedom to do as we please, but freedom to do as we ought. If a person thinks, "I can sin over and over, and it doesn't matter because God forgives me," then they are misguided. Are they forgiven? If they have trusted Christ, Yes. All sin is forgiven. However, that doesn't mean that sin does not have destructive effects on our lives. It does.
Another possibility is that they have trusted a false Gospel; that Jesus is a get out of jail free card. Perhaps they've paid lip service to His diety, His work, His life, His death and resurrection. And its just something akin to a rabbits foot for them. Certainly a possibility, but that is between God and them. We shouldn't assume that when someone says they are "Christian" that they have heard and received the true Gospel of Grace.

If they are saved, then they have the Holy Spirit. And God chastens those He loves. prayer, prayer, prayer.

[Stu]

Well hang on. If you ask for forgiveness, but in your heart do not regret committing that sin (and so continue to do so knowing full well you will just ask for forgiveness again) you are merely paying lip service.
This is not asking for forgiveness but asking for a pass, two different things.

Of course if you are sincere in your asking for forgiveness but nevertheless sin then that is another matter.

Stu, not to be mean, but that is a lie straight from the pit of Hell.

We can NEVER exhibit enough remorse, regret or contrition for sin.
And further, salvation does not require us to ask for forgiveness. As if we have to beg and negotiate with God to forgive us. Please God, will you forgiv me? Answer": He already has. Jesus died for the sin of the world. How many? All of them. Even the ones not committed yet? Yes. Jesus has forgiven sin. And we need that forgiveness appropriated in our lives. We receive that as a free gift through faith, and not by mustering up enough regret. Should we feel regret? Of course. But imagine getting to heaven to find out, "Well Stu, you just didn't have enough regret when you ____________. So you're out!" This says that our salvation is contingent on our ability; in this case our ability to show God how 'serious' we are. Stu, I used to follow this same Lordship thinking. And bottom line, I was a self-rigtheous, fruit inspector, who frankly thought his sin didn't stink as bad as the next guys.

That said, we are not to use the grace of God for an occassion of the flesh. The liberty we have in Christ is not freedom to do as we please, but freedom to do as we ought. If a person thinks, "I can sin over and over, and it doesn't matter because God forgives me," then they are misguided. Are they forgiven? If they have trusted Christ, Yes. All sin is forgiven. However, that doesn't mean that sin does not have destructive effects on our lives. It does.
Another possibility is that they have trusted a false Gospel; that Jesus is a get out of jail free card. Perhaps they've paid lip service to His diety, His work, His life, His death and resurrection. And its just something akin to a rabbits foot for them. Certainly a possibility, but that is between God and them. We shouldn't assume that when someone says they are "Christian" that they have heard and received the true Gospel of Grace.

If they are saved, then they have the Holy Spirit. And God chastens those He loves. prayer, prayer, prayer.

I'm going to have to disagree with you.

What about someone who continually steals and asks for forgiveness thereafter over and over. Or even murders over and over.
God knows your heart. God knows whether you are lukewarm or not, my guess the example I'm attempting to raise would fall into the lukewarm category. Something which God does not desire.

Also reminds me of the mafia of old. They kill someone and then go to church to ask for forgiveness, repeating the cycle (although that is a Roman Catholic thing which is a whole other can of worms).

[jlay]

Stu,

As you said, that is another matter. The RCC never had the authority to forgive sins, mafia or otherwise.
If a person believes that a priest has the ability to forgive someone, and that being forgiven is the equivalent of sitting in a box with a priest and running down a list, then that is a different thread topic.

Unfortunately, you are saying is that the atonement is NOT complete and finished. That there are certain sins God will not forgive. Or, that there is some number of sins that crosses a threshold and God removes His GIFT of grace.

The term 'lukewarm' is used in the NT once, and it refers to an entire church, not an individual.

My guess is Stu, that we can examine your life and find areas where you are so called, "lukewarm." Jesus warned don't judge by a measure unless you are prepared to have that measure applied back to you. So, if you are going to present this argument, then bro, I'm gonna hold your feet to the fire.(no pun)

Are you saying that God is fickle about distributing grace? Please expound.

[Stu]

No, what I'm saying is that if you are not sincere, if you merely pay lip service to your prayers, that God will know your heart.

Are you telling me that if you make a habit of sleeping around (or killing or whatever) over and over and just repent each time that that will find one in favour with God and He will simply forgive even though sincerity is not there and knowingly repeat the actions again and again?

God is not only love and grace, He judges us as well. The Bible tells us this quite clearly. How can you demand or expect grace when your heart and actions continually act otherwise and in opposition to your prayers. Then you are merely saying the words, and like the mafia, expecting grace while you act in any manner you see fit.

[jlay]

No, what I'm saying is that if you are not sincere, if you merely pay lip service to your prayers, that God will know your heart.

Of course God knows our heart, and that is key. God knows who has genuinely trusted Christ.

Are you telling me that if you make a habit of sleeping around (or killing or whatever) over and over and just repent each time that that will find one in favour with God and He will simply forgive even though sincerity is not there and knowingly repeat the actions again and again?

Stu, to answer hypotheticals, I have to presume that 'you' is referring to a genuine, born again believer. So, if the person is a believer, then they are ALREADY forgiven. However, to trust Christ one must know what it is that needs entrusting. It would be impossible to trust Christ for salvation if you didn't know you were dead in sin.
So, you can throw up all the hypotheticals you can muster. It doesn't matter. God is judge and He has already dealt with sin at the cross. Let me ask you, why are you so worried about this?

God is not only love and grace, He judges us as well. The Bible tells us this quite clearly. How can you demand or expect grace when your heart and actions continually act otherwise and in opposition to your prayers. Then you are merely saying the words, and like the mafia, expecting grace while you act in any manner you see fit.

Demand or expect grace? That doesn't even resonate with the nature of grace. Grace is the opposite of what we should expect.
Question: Do you really think that by being contrite that you somehow have garnered favor with God? That you somehow impressed God, and now he is obligated to offer you grace because of how 'sincere' you were? Contrition can be an affective agent in showing a sinner their need of saving. But it is impossible to establish what level one must reach to be sincere.
You sound like you are saying that Jesus only came to save the good sinners. I hope you make the cut.

Peter asked Jesus, "Lord, how often shall my brother sin against me and I forgive him? Up to seven times?" 22Jesus said to him, "I do not say to you, up to seven times, but up to seventy times seven.…" (Matt. 18:21)

[Danieltwotwenty]

Peter asked Jesus, "Lord, how often shall my brother sin against me and I forgive him? Up to seven times?" 22Jesus said to him, "I do not say to you, up to seven times, but up to seventy times seven.…" (Matt. 18:21)

Stu is a Bible literalist (YEC) so God will only forgive us 490 times then we get baked for eternity.

[neo-x]