ISIS from the INSIDE

[PaulSacramento]

http://www.breitbart.com/national-secur ... cleansing/

An eye opener for some and old news for others...

Jurgen Todenhofer, the first Western reporter to embed with Islamic State fighters and not be killed in the process, spoke to Al Jazeera about his time with the terror group.

Todenhofer lived side by side with the jihadist fighters for ten days in the Islamic State-stronghold city of Mosul, Iraq. He was accompanied only by his son, who served as his cameraman.

“I always asked them about the value of mercy in Islam,” but “I didn’t see any mercy in their behavior,” explained Todenhofer. He added, “Something that I don’t understand at all is the enthusiasm in their plan of religious cleansing, planning to kill the non-believers… They also will kill Muslim democrats because they believe that non-ISIL-Muslims put the laws of human beings above the commandments of God.”

The German reporter then elaborated on how shocked he was about how “willing to kill” the ISIS fighters are. He said that they were ready to commit genocide. “They were talking about [killing] hundreds of millions. They were enthusiastic about it, and I just cannot understand that,” said Todenhofer

He warned that the Islamic State “is much stronger than we think,” and that their recruiting has brought motivated jihadis from across the globe. “Each day, hundreds of new enthusiastic fighters are arriving,” explained Todenhofer. “There is an incredible enthusiasm that I have never seen in any other war zones I have been to.”

The journalist asserted that the U.S.-led bombing campaign was not going to stop the Islamic State and its continuing jihad. He told Al Jazeera that he believed the terror group would only be stopped if fellow Sunni Iraqis would rise up against them.

[Danieltwotwenty]

I finished reading a book awhile ago called "The eternal message of the prophet Muhammed", it was written just after WW11 and was written by a layman Islamic fellow (I forget his name), it was written as a guide for new Muslims. I found it to be really eye opening, it was a doorway into the Muslim world, it explained a lot of the harder to understand passages and gave context for them, the overall message was of grace and mercy, to respects others beliefs and protect the people of the book (Christians and Jews) because they are our brothers and sisters. It was however very legalistic and everything was about the law and the institution of the Caliphate, but overall I think Muslim extremists are taking passages out of context and using them to oppress others, these are not the real Muslims, these are just bad people. A similar situation in Uganda of Christians killing homosexual people based on out of context passages in the Bible or Christians blowing up abortion clinics based on their faulty understanding of what God wants from us. ISIS are not following what the Koran says, they are extremist radicals, they even kill their own people as stated in the article. I am not saying that the Koran is perfect or inspired, just saying it's not as brutal as some seem to say it is, especially when context is given.

Interesting account, thanks Paul.

[PaulSacramento]

I finished reading a book awhile ago called "The eternal message of the prophet Muhammed", it was written just after WW11 and was written by a layman Islamic fellow (I forget his name), it was written as a guide for new Muslims. I found it to be really eye opening, it was a doorway into the Muslim world, it explained a lot of the harder to understand passages and gave context for them, the overall message was of grace and mercy, to respects others beliefs and protect the people of the book (Christians and Jews) because they are our brothers and sisters. It was however very legalistic and everything was about the law and the institution of the Caliphate, but overall I think Muslim extremists are taking passages out of context and using them to oppress others, these are not the real Muslims, these are just bad people. A similar situation in Uganda of Christians killing homosexual people based on out of context passages in the Bible or Christians blowing up abortion clinics based on their faulty understanding of what God wants from us. ISIS are not following what the Koran says, they are extremist radicals, they even kill their own people as stated in the article. I am not saying that the Koran is perfect or inspired, just saying it's not as brutal as some seem to say it is, especially when context is given.

Interesting account, thanks Paul.

The issue is, truly, that the extremists are allowed to do whatever they want and the vast majority ( supposedly) that are moderates say nothing, do nothing to counter them.
If, or more probably, WHEN the rest of the world retaliates as they did centuries ago with Islam tried to expand then, they ( the moderates) will have no one to blame but themselves for the consequences.

Lets us not forget that when Christians do things like oyu mentioned above, they are denounced by fellow christians for what they are.
We don't' see that in Islam.

[Rob]

overall I think Muslim extremists are taking passages out of context and using them to oppress others, these are not the real Muslims, these are just bad people.

The trouble with the Koran is that there isn't any source material to pull from. Often this means that some passages can be interpreted in both a violent way and a peaceful way. Who's to say which is wrong? They certainly can't go by the text alone.

Take for instance a passage (I'll look up the specific passage later and edit this post to show it) in which Muhammed's followers are concerned about taking a city. Since it's dark out, they're afraid that they'll accidentally kill women and children in the process of taking the town. Muhammed replies that it's ok if the women and children die because they're still infidels. Later however, Muhammed says that it is NOT okay to kill the women and children.

A long time ago the current leader gathered all version of the Koran, chose one and burned the rest. He meant well to be sure, wanting to unify all Muslims to the same text. But unfortunately it means we cannot compare and contrast various versions to get a consensus like we can with the New Testament. Sadly, most muslims today do not know that this event occurred. They often ridicule us for having different versions of our text and claim that they only have only one version. They do not understand that this was not always so.

Lets us not forget that when Christians do things like oyu mentioned above, they are denounced by fellow christians for what they are.
We don't' see that in Islam.

True. Islam is often peaceful when it's in the minority. As it gains majority and political power, those moderates will become much less so.

[Danieltwotwenty]

I finished reading a book awhile ago called "The eternal message of the prophet Muhammed", it was written just after WW11 and was written by a layman Islamic fellow (I forget his name), it was written as a guide for new Muslims. I found it to be really eye opening, it was a doorway into the Muslim world, it explained a lot of the harder to understand passages and gave context for them, the overall message was of grace and mercy, to respects others beliefs and protect the people of the book (Christians and Jews) because they are our brothers and sisters. It was however very legalistic and everything was about the law and the institution of the Caliphate, but overall I think Muslim extremists are taking passages out of context and using them to oppress others, these are not the real Muslims, these are just bad people. A similar situation in Uganda of Christians killing homosexual people based on out of context passages in the Bible or Christians blowing up abortion clinics based on their faulty understanding of what God wants from us. ISIS are not following what the Koran says, they are extremist radicals, they even kill their own people as stated in the article. I am not saying that the Koran is perfect or inspired, just saying it's not as brutal as some seem to say it is, especially when context is given.

Interesting account, thanks Paul.

The issue is, truly, that the extremists are allowed to do whatever they want and the vast majority ( supposedly) that are moderates say nothing, do nothing to counter them.
If, or more probably, WHEN the rest of the world retaliates as they did centuries ago with Islam tried to expand then, they ( the moderates) will have no one to blame but themselves for the consequences.

Lets us not forget that when Christians do things like oyu mentioned above, they are denounced by fellow christians for what they are.
We don't' see that in Islam.

I totally agree Paul, I wasn't saying people are not culpable for standing by an not doing anything, but if you spend time on Islamic forums you will find there is outrage at the actions of ISIS, I can only speak for the forums I frequent however and I am sure there are others that are more quiet. I guess it all depends on your geographic location, some times it can be dangerous to speak out. Just like in medieval times when the church was witch burning, it would have been a life sentence for you and your family to speak out against the extremists in the church. I think education and poverty are the driving forces of extremism and the western world has a lot to answer for in regards to leaving the rest of the world behind and in a lot of circumstances taking advantage of poorer countries to make our own richer. But most western people are silent on these issues, we are just as much to blame for extremists as the Muslims (I don't like to use moderate because why should we, they are the ones following their book properly, we should just call them Muslims).

Edit. Just like to add that evangelical groups in the US are still financing these extremists in Uganda (as far as I am lead to believe), in spite of fully knowing what is going on. Also the top Imams/Clerics have been speaking out against ISIS and other extremists, it's just that western media doesn't report that much on it.