new study on nde's says they are real

[bippy123]

Why do atheists ignore the 2nd law of thermodynamics and the substantiated science behind the big bang? To believe the universe is eternal is to ignore that the universe has a deep freeze coming because of the 2nd law unless God intervenes an adds more hydrogen for stars to burn,but also they ignore that the 2nd law came into existence at the big bang.

Because they will hold onto anything for their religion if atheism .
I just got done going through a debate on another forum on Nde's with an atheist that made the assertion that Nde's are caused by a lack of oxygen to the brain. When I showed him from the peer reviewed nde research that people have had Nde's with low oxygen as well as having substantial amounts of oxygen , instead of admitting he was wrong he put me on ignore .
Why is it when atheists are dealing with someone that knows their nde research, the common tactic is that they out you on ignore or hang up the phone you as patricia churchland did on the skeptiko interview ?



Atheists can keep shouting that that atheism isn't a religion and that they have no faith , but they don't act that way .

[Byblos]

patricia churchland

Now that's someone whose philosophy ought to be required reading for every atheist/agnostic. Only then will they know for certain what being an atheist truly entails and what such a position necessarily leads to.

[Morny]

Atheists can keep shouting that that atheism isn't a religion and that they have no faith , but they don't act that way .

Atheism is a religion, like "OFF" is a TV station.

[abelcainsbrother]

Why do atheists ignore the 2nd law of thermodynamics and the substantiated science behind the big bang? To believe the universe is eternal is to ignore that the universe has a deep freeze coming because of the 2nd law unless God intervenes an adds more hydrogen for stars to burn,but also they ignore that the 2nd law came into existence at the big bang.

Because they will hold onto anything for their religion if atheism .
I just got done going through a debate on another forum on Nde's with an atheist that made the assertion that Nde's are caused by a lack of oxygen to the brain. When I showed him from the peer reviewed nde research that people have had Nde's with low oxygen as well as having substantial amounts of oxygen , instead of admitting he was wrong he put me on ignore .
Why is it when atheists are dealing with someone that knows their nde research, the common tactic is that they out you on ignore or hang up the phone you as patricia churchland did on the skeptiko interview ?



Atheists can keep shouting that that atheism isn't a religion and that they have no faith , but they don't act that way .

I know what you're talking about.I too have been in debates with atheists on another forum,and no matter how much evidence I give? It is ignored and explained away.I'm not an expert like you on NDE' s ,even though I've briefly brought it up? I don't really know how to defend it well,so I get into other things. The atheists I'vebeen dealing with have atheism church were they get together as united atheists and have atheism church,they have guest atheist preachers too. They mock me a lot but I just keep on showing they are wrong.

[bippy123]

Why do atheists ignore the 2nd law of thermodynamics and the substantiated science behind the big bang? To believe the universe is eternal is to ignore that the universe has a deep freeze coming because of the 2nd law unless God intervenes an adds more hydrogen for stars to burn,but also they ignore that the 2nd law came into existence at the big bang.

Because they will hold onto anything for their religion if atheism .
I just got done going through a debate on another forum on Nde's with an atheist that made the assertion that Nde's are caused by a lack of oxygen to the brain. When I showed him from the peer reviewed nde research that people have had Nde's with low oxygen as well as having substantial amounts of oxygen , instead of admitting he was wrong he put me on ignore .
Why is it when atheists are dealing with someone that knows their nde research, the common tactic is that they out you on ignore or hang up the phone you as patricia churchland did on the skeptiko interview ?



Atheists can keep shouting that that atheism isn't a religion and that they have no faith , but they don't act that way .

I know what you're talking about.I too have been in debates with atheists on another forum,and no matter how much evidence I give? It is ignored and explained away.I'm not an expert like you on NDE' s ,even though I've briefly brought it up? I don't really know how to defend it well,so I get into other things. The atheists I'vebeen dealing with have atheism church were they get together as united atheists and have atheism church,they have guest atheist preachers too. They mock me a lot but I just keep on showing they are wrong.

Abel, As long as you never use Nde's to prove Christianity directly per say , then you will get them cornered every time .
I use Nde's for 2 reasons.
1. To show how atheists will cling to their atheism no matter what the evidence says and they will abandon their supposed love for science once their atheism is tested even a little . In other words I show that they are people of faith also , but their faith is in atheism.

2. That 2 major claims of what religion in general is saying have strong evidence for their factualness, namely the soul and the afterlife . Once you put it that way , they are cornered and can't weasel their way out of it, and this is where like professor patricia churchland in her interview on skeptiko, they great down and their atheistic cult is exposed .

But as far as them mocking you my friend, Jesus did tell the daughters of Jerusalem not to weep for him, for there will come a day when they will not want to bring kids into this world.
When they mock you abel , they prove what Christ says is happening .

Cool name by the way

[PaulSacramento]

Atheists can keep shouting that that atheism isn't a religion and that they have no faith , but they don't act that way .

Atheism is a religion, like "OFF" is a TV station.

Actually, no.
Atheism is, more correctly, an ideology.
The definition of ideology is the set of ideas and beliefs that are important to a person, ...

That said, ANY view on the existence ( or non) of the supernatural is a religion to a certain degree BUT religion in the strict sense requires worship of some sort.

I think atheism CAN be a religion to some in this regard:
a pursuit or interest to which someone ascribes supreme importance.

[Morny]

Atheists can keep shouting that that atheism isn't a religion and that they have no faith , but they don't act that way .

Atheism is a religion, like "OFF" is a TV station.

Actually, no.
Atheism is, more correctly, an ideology.
The definition of ideology is the set of ideas and beliefs that are important to a person, ...

That said, ANY view on the existence ( or non) of the supernatural is a religion to a certain degree [...]

So not believing in Zeus is a religion.

[...] BUT religion in the strict sense requires worship of some sort.

OK. Another reason not to call atheism a religion.

I think atheism CAN be a religion to some in this regard:
a pursuit or interest to which someone ascribes supreme importance.

No. Atheism involves the absence of a belief, e.g., in Zeus.

Atheism is a religion like not collecting coins is a hobby.

You're conflating the concept of atheism with actual non-Christian religions, who also disagree, at a minimum, with your view on the nature of Jesus Christ.

[Kurieuo]

Morny, you sound zealous over Atheism to not be a religion.

Here's a question:

Is it possible for Atheists to setup a religion, the central focus and point of unity in their "religion" being no belief in a deity?

[RickD]

Morny wrote:
No. Atheism involves the absence of a belief, e.g., in Zeus.

Actually, atheism is a belief that God or gods don't exist. It's not an absence of belief.

And some atheists can be pretty religious about that belief. Some atheists even proselytize more than those that believe in God.

[EssentialSacrifice]

My biggest problem with athiesm is ... this is it... nothing after this life... I simply cannot fathom, knowing that there isn't anything else. How do you feel that way, defeatist in it's worst sense. Life is just too complex for me to believe that what goes on in my head won't go on after the body is done.

I suppose it's just me selfishly wanting more and not only finding what I have always believed to be true, before God found me, but now have someone to share it with who is, as it turns out, the Creator and wants to not only extend my existence forever, but wants and will supply an ongoing life with new and interesting events eternally.

Or, you die, it's lights out and .................................................................................................

NDE's aren't the evidence anyone needs to ascertian life after death, but they pretty darn well define the brain's ability to continue, and the brain is just the housing for the intellect that is physically then mentally spurred on by the soul and spirit of every person ever born, IMO.

I understand this is all debateable, all "in each and every man's mind alone" but there's no way this man can accept this life is it. I want more and I want the freedom too.

[abelcainsbrother]

Why do atheists ignore the 2nd law of thermodynamics and the substantiated science behind the big bang? To believe the universe is eternal is to ignore that the universe has a deep freeze coming because of the 2nd law unless God intervenes an adds more hydrogen for stars to burn,but also they ignore that the 2nd law came into existence at the big bang.

Because they will hold onto anything for their religion if atheism .
I just got done going through a debate on another forum on Nde's with an atheist that made the assertion that Nde's are caused by a lack of oxygen to the brain. When I showed him from the peer reviewed nde research that people have had Nde's with low oxygen as well as having substantial amounts of oxygen , instead of admitting he was wrong he put me on ignore .
Why is it when atheists are dealing with someone that knows their nde research, the common tactic is that they out you on ignore or hang up the phone you as patricia churchland did on the skeptiko interview ?



Atheists can keep shouting that that atheism isn't a religion and that they have no faith , but they don't act that way .

I know what you're talking about.I too have been in debates with atheists on another forum,and no matter how much evidence I give? It is ignored and explained away.I'm not an expert like you on NDE' s ,even though I've briefly brought it up? I don't really know how to defend it well,so I get into other things. The atheists I'vebeen dealing with have atheism church were they get together as united atheists and have atheism church,they have guest atheist preachers too. They mock me a lot but I just keep on showing they are wrong.

Abel, As long as you never use Nde's to prove Christianity directly per say , then you will get them cornered every time .
I use Nde's for 2 reasons.
1. To show how atheists will cling to their atheism no matter what the evidence says and they will abandon their supposed love for science once their atheism is tested even a little . In other words I show that they are people of faith also , but their faith is in atheism.

2. That 2 major claims of what religion in general is saying have strong evidence for their factualness, namely the soul and the afterlife . Once you put it that way , they are cornered and can't weasel their way out of it, and this is where like professor patricia churchland in her interview on skeptiko, they great down and their atheistic cult is exposed .

But as far as them mocking you my friend, Jesus did tell the daughters of Jerusalem not to weep for him, for there will come a day when they will not want to bring kids into this world.
When they mock you abel , they prove what Christ says is happening .

Cool name by the way

Thanks,yeah I need to learn more about NDE's and add it to my repatoire. I will,but I have so many other things I'm trying to learn about to be better armed when dealing with nonbelievers.I feel kinda like a sheep against wolves at times but I do my best to handle it.My faith is strong in the Lord and so they will never effect my faith by mocking me,etc.I can handle it,it is mostly through the internet anyway.
I really kinda fill like God gave me the idea for the name abelcainsbother long before I understood why.Me and a friend used to hang out and he had a wresting video game we were playing,and you could create your own wrestler,we me being a/Christian thought up a wrestler named Abel.
When I eventually got into computers and on the internet when I made accounts I wanted to use the name Abel,but as you know there are already many Abel's out there,and I wanted it to be unique so I added cainsbrother on to the end of it.Then when I finally found out about the new atheists my name was set already before I ever engaged them,now the name fits well because every time a atheist mocks me in anger,and cusses at me,etc my name says it all.abelcainsbrother.

[bippy123]

My biggest problem with athiesm is ... this is it... nothing after this life... I simply cannot fathom, knowing that there isn't anything else. How do you feel that way, defeatist in it's worst sense. Life is just too complex for me to believe that what goes on in my head won't go on after the body is done.

I suppose it's just me selfishly wanting more and not only finding what I have always believed to be true, before God found me, but now have someone to share it with who is, as it turns out, the Creator and wants to not only extend my existence forever, but wants and will supply an ongoing life with new and interesting events eternally.

Or, you die, it's lights out and .................................................................................................

NDE's aren't the evidence anyone needs to ascertian life after death, but they pretty darn well define the brain's ability to continue, and the brain is just the housing for the intellect that is physically then mentally spurred on by the soul and spirit of every person ever born, IMO.

I understand this is all debateable, all "in each and every man's mind alone" but there's no way this man can accept this life is it. I want more and I want the freedom too.

Essential while nde's might not be absolute proof for the soul and after life , almost all the evidence points in this direction.
I have been researching a very unique kind of nde's called peak in Darien nde's which is basically a type of nde where an experienced would bring back information about loved ones who they saw in the afterlife who no one knew they had passed on.
There are quite a few of these cases. Eben Alexanders nde is one such peak in Darien case. These are very specific and very fascinating nde's . How do materialists explain this?
Their only answer is that all these people lied.

[bippy123]

Atheists can keep shouting that that atheism isn't a religion and that they have no faith , but they don't act that way .

Atheism is a religion, like "OFF" is a TV station.

But when the off button is on and the majority of evidence says the button is on and atheists keep insisting that the button is off then it becomes a dogmatic cult because they will not accept anything outside of their delusion . Atheists like you actually don't want ultimate meaning , purpose, value or hope . They want with all their heart to blink into non existence .
All the earmarkings of an irrational cult .
Sure one definition of religion involves worshipping a deity , but under that definition in the dictionary is belief in something dogmatically . Hence atheism is one form of religion .

[bippy123]

My biggest problem with athiesm is ... this is it... nothing after this life... I simply cannot fathom, knowing that there isn't anything else. How do you feel that way, defeatist in it's worst sense. Life is just too complex for me to believe that what goes on in my head won't go on after the body is done.

I suppose it's just me selfishly wanting more and not only finding what I have always believed to be true, before God found me, but now have someone to share it with who is, as it turns out, the Creator and wants to not only extend my existence forever, but wants and will supply an ongoing life with new and interesting events eternally.

Or, you die, it's lights out and .................................................................................................

NDE's aren't the evidence anyone needs to ascertian life after death, but they pretty darn well define the brain's ability to continue, and the brain is just the housing for the intellect that is physically then mentally spurred on by the soul and spirit of every person ever born, IMO.

I understand this is all debateable, all "in each and every man's mind alone" but there's no way this man can accept this life is it. I want more and I want the freedom too.

Essential, atheists actually want there to be nothing after this life , no matter what the evidence says lol.
This is why i find their atheistic faith unbelievable and unfathomable .

As far as your post about the brain being the housing , that is what most of the evidence shows from nde studies .
Another analogy is your television set. The tv receives the signals being broadcasted into it but the tv doesn't created those signals . This is precisely why every nde researcher that starts out as an atheist leaves atheism . They didn't leave atheism because of any religious book. They simply left it because the evidence from their nde research makes atheism intellectually untenable .

People like doctor jeffrey long
Doctor Pim van Lommel
Penny sartori
The list goes on

And they come out of these nde studies of their transformed and they know that their life has true and eternal purpose .

With atheism , your here, you blink away and your gone . You would have to jump through intellectual hoops to bring in ultimate purpose or value into it.

This is why I keep saying that the only honest atheists are nihilists .

[EssentialSacrifice]

Essential while nde's might not be absolute proof for the soul and after life , almost all the evidence points in this direction.

bippy, 100% here, I just meant that, like the Shroud, the "proof for the afterlife is in the life we have today being the sons of God and knowing through Him.

The Shroud the NDE's are both seismic movement in regards to the afterlife, but not as important as our faith and current relationship we have with our God, in this life that will lead to the kind of afterlife we will experience. My brother how I love your excitement it is so animated, contagious ! You're just great to be around.