Is secularism spreading?

[Audie]

I think the bigger problem is the fact that people are just using fear to get people to accepted God and not love

Oh, you know, some try the hellfire and brimstone thing, others try the "love" thing, some try the "philosophy-prove-god" thing.

Some discredit anything they say with nutty beliefs they promote.
A guy talks about how he saw a werewolf and some chubacabre, who will believe he saw a flying saucer?

The Moslems dont scare me with their promise that I will hang by my hair in eternal fire for not covering my head in public.

The "problem" with Christianity, if problem it is, is that its not very believable.

Why not?

Not meaning anything rude here, but... seriously?

[Storyteller]

Yes, seriously.
I believe.
It's totally believeable to me.

[Kurieuo]

I think the bigger problem is the fact that people are just using fear to get people to accepted God and not love

Oh, you know, some try the hellfire and brimstone thing, others try the "love" thing, some try the "philosophy-prove-god" thing.

Some discredit anything they say with nutty beliefs they promote.
A guy talks about how he saw a werewolf and some chubacabre, who will believe he saw a flying saucer?

The Moslems dont scare me with their promise that I will hang by my hair in eternal fire for not covering my head in public.

The "problem" with Christianity, if problem it is, is that its not very believable.

You're so unbelievable.

[Kenny]

I think the bigger problem is the fact that people are just using fear to get people to accepted God and not love

Fear is a very effective tool. The thread of eternal torture via Hell fire was the most difficult thing to get past when I lost my faith. Love was easy; I was capable of love myself! But hell fire..... Talkin about scared straight!

Ken

[UsagiTsukino]

I think the bigger problem is the fact that people are just using fear to get people to accepted God and not love

Fear is a very effective tool. The thread of eternal torture via Hell fire was the most difficult thing to get past when I lost my faith. Love was easy; I was capable of love myself! But hell fire..... Talkin about scared straight!

Ken

But shouldn't we be able to speak about both God's love and why we need it and not scare people because it was fear not love that bought them to god

[Storyteller]

I think the bigger problem is the fact that people are just using fear to get people to accepted God and not love

Fear is a very effective tool. The thread of eternal torture via Hell fire was the most difficult thing to get past when I lost my faith. Love was easy; I was capable of love myself! But hell fire..... Talkin about scared straight!

Ken

But your fear of Hell wasn`t enough for you to keep your faith. Maybe His love can tempt you back.

Ken? I really, really can`t get my head around how and why you lost your faith. It just seems incredulous to me that someone would go from having faith and believing to turning away from God.
I don`t know how much of your story you want to share on the forum but do you think it`s possible you gave up on God too soon? Do you want to believe again?

[Kenny]

I think the bigger problem is the fact that people are just using fear to get people to accepted God and not love

Fear is a very effective tool. The thread of eternal torture via Hell fire was the most difficult thing to get past when I lost my faith. Love was easy; I was capable of love myself! But hell fire..... Talkin about scared straight!

Ken

But shouldn't we be able to speak about both God's love and why we need it and not scare people because it was fear not love that bought them to god

I understand your point. But in my case, it wasn't love that brought me to God, but rather family tradition.

Ken

[Kenny]

I think the bigger problem is the fact that people are just using fear to get people to accepted God and not love

Fear is a very effective tool. The thread of eternal torture via Hell fire was the most difficult thing to get past when I lost my faith. Love was easy; I was capable of love myself! But hell fire..... Talkin about scared straight!

Ken

But your fear of Hell wasn`t enough for you to keep your faith. Maybe His love can tempt you back.

Ken? I really, really can`t get my head around how and why you lost your faith. It just seems incredulous to me that someone would go from having faith and believing to turning away from God.

I think it goes both ways; there are people on this forum who were atheists and converted to Christianity. That's a little difficult for me to get my head around.

[ I don`t know how much of your story you want to share on the forum but do you think it`s possible you gave up on God too soon?

Is 4 years too soon? By the time I was 20 years old I had spent nearly 20% of my life searching for God. If God knows everything he would have known that after 4 years I would have given up. I would not call that too soon; perhaps others would.

[ Do you want to believe again?

[/quote]
For me it was never about wanting to believe or not wanting to believe but about what is the truth. I am convinced I know the truth.

Ken
Ken

[Storyteller]

Maybe 20% wasn`t/isn`t enough.

Giving up after 4 years too soon? Perhaps not for you but for me it would be. I have been looking for God for as long as I can remember. I`ve been through all the doubt, all the is it too good to be true? Is it really possible? I never, ever gave up on finding God. If you give up on looking for Him you will never find Him, that`s a definite. If you keep looking, with all your heart and mind you will find Him. You just have to want to enough.

Truth. That`s a tough one because as convinced as you are that you know the truth, I am convinced that I do too. And guess what? One of us is wrong. Trouble is, how do we figure out who?

Do me a favour Ken? Keep looking, don`t close yourself off to the possibility that you might be wrong about this, don`t give up on God because it wasn`t an instant thing.
Try praying again? With an open heart.


Because this matters.

[Audie]

Yes, seriously.
I believe.
It's totally believeable to me.

and to krink im totally unbelievable

[Storyteller]

Yes, seriously.
I believe.
It's totally believeable to me.

and to krink im totally unbelievable

I think it was your comment rather than you he finds unbelievable.

If Christianity is really that unbelievable then how do you explain why so many people believe it? Are we all fools? Deluded? Or just plain wrong? Or is there just the smallest chance that we might be right?

[RickD]

Yes, seriously.
I believe.
It's totally believeable to me.

and to krink im totally unbelievable

I think it was your comment rather than you he finds unbelievable.

If Christianity is really that unbelievable then how do you explain why so many people believe it? Are we all fools? Deluded? Or just plain wrong? Or is there just the smallest chance that we might be right?

Actually, there are only two choices, IMO.

Either Christianity is true. And all it entails.

Or, we are extremely deluded, even fools. There's really no in between.

Either Jesus Christ is who he said he is, God in the flesh, or he's a lunatic. There's no in between.

[Audie]

So many of you xtians are so into binary thinking. Absolutes. What is with that? Is it a cause or res
Ult of religiosity?

There a lot of kinds of "true". Are parables true?

"All" it entails? By whose figuring? Gappists, yec, Mormons, and all the other interpretations and mutually contradictory takes on "truth"? Unicorns?

Some percent of Christians for sure are fools. But which? Everyone says its them others gets it wrong.

As for Jesus the lunatic..how do YOU know what he really said or meant by it? Remote viewing?

How about these two possibilities:

Either you are gifted with infallible readin' and err not, or you are not.

Clarify svp.

[RickD]

So many of you xtians are so into binary thinking. Absolutes. What is with that? Is it a cause or res
Ult of religiosity?

There a lot of kinds of "true". Are parables true?

"All" it entails? By whose figuring? Gappists, yec, Mormons, and all the other interpretations and mutually contradictory takes on "truth"? Unicorns?

Some percent of Christians for sure are fools. But which? Everyone says its them others gets it wrong.

As for Jesus the lunatic..how do YOU know what he really said or meant by it? Remote viewing?

How about these two possibilities:

Either you are gifted with infallible readin' and err not, or you are not.

Clarify svp.

Ah sorry. I Should've been more clear. When I said Christianity and all that it entails, I was referring to the person of Jesus Christ, and the gospel. That, to me, is Christianity. One's creation position, YEC, Gap, OEC, TE, isn't Christianity.

Does that clear up what I'm saying?

[Audie]

So many of you xtians are so into binary thinking. Absolutes. What is with that? Is it a cause or res
Ult of religiosity?

There a lot of kinds of "true". Are parables true?

"All" it entails? By whose figuring? Gappists, yec, Mormons, and all the other interpretations and mutually contradictory takes on "truth"? Unicorns?

Some percent of Christians for sure are fools. But which? Everyone says its them others gets it wrong.

As for Jesus the lunatic..how do YOU know what he really said or meant by it? Remote viewing?

How about these two possibilities:

Either you are gifted with infallible readin' and err not, or you are not.

Clarify svp.

Ah sorry. I Should've been more clear. When I said Christianity and all that it entails, I was referring to the person of Jesus Christ, and the gospel. That, to me, is Christianity. One's creation position, YEC, Gap, OEC, TE, isn't Christianity.

Does that clear up what I'm saying?

As clear as redirect is likely to be.

In the grant biz, that would be stamped "unresponsive" and circular-filed.