MBPrata wrote:Oh yes... it's not foolishness.
Of course Mr. Dawkins contradicts himself once in a while. Nothingness is a weird, freaking confusing stuff (or...lack of stuff?), it's hardly possible to talk about it without contradicting. Also, remember, christians also contradict themselves. Is it ok for me find them guilty for foolishness by exposing one of them contradicting himself/herself?
While I love to take the mickey out of Dawkins, he is nonetheless a very interesting and passionate person.
But, logic and reason is not his forte and highly clouded by his Atheistic anti-religious bias.
I think that much is clear to all who at least aren't like-minded Atheist themselves.
Given your self-confession of slant towards Nihilism, if true, then think about you being here... discussing and making all sorts of comments and claims would mean
you're a person full of the utmost contradictions. Perhaps you not so long ago came out of an IB's theory of knowledge course, and are now wired to see no real knowledge. Let me call your bluff however.
A true Nihilist would at least flirt with killing themselves.
Heck, I was Christian with existential issues -- ultimately seeing no real meaning in living life further having believed myself to discover it. While such isn't Nihilist, I clearly see and understand the end result of Nihilism and where it leads, which is nowhere.
Everything about you here though, if you are honest with yourself and truly reflect, seems to show that you aren't really Nihilistic except that you like playing that out for this discussion and thread. Indeed, you grasp knowledge and even believe in certain truths. That is apparent from your posts.
Let me dribble a bit -- actually I think there's some pearls here in what I'm about to say, but I'm happy to keep them as mine.
Nonetheless, in case you might be able to make some kind of association and some sense be brought about.
You know there is a certain logic and rationality to Pragmatism.
It's required to get started working on some intuitive foundational beliefs, or you may as well end your life and embrace insanity.
Speaking in practical terms, which would you prefer? Living life embracing what seems obvious with a sense of truth, or rejecting every belief including the rejection of rejecting a belief, rejecting that statement, and that statement, and that -- caught in a loop of insane thought unable to escape and embrace any meaning or truth = you may as well just end it.
Obviously life, if it be true, is a more logical and rational conclusion
pragmatically speaking, therefore lets accept logic, reason and experience as foundational sources of truth. Hey, and by those same grounds, let's accept other beliefs that seem intuitive as foundational also, including morality, goodness, justice, emotions, feelings, spirituality and the like.
With those foundations then it's a matter of some form of coherentism -- what is the largest and biggest puzzle pieces of beliefs you can fit together that best explain things. When it comes to existential questions and grounding many of the intuitive beliefs we just tend to naturally accept -- morality, existence of a self, goodness, justice, beauty, feeling of purpose, feeling of true meaning to life, feeling of the divine, that we can "progress" towards some superior standard -- all these puzzle pieces seem to best fit in a Christian puzzle.
If it's a matter of which belief sets are the most coherent, nothing comes close to Christianity.
If you can, get a copy of The Universe Next Door by James W. Sire. Great introductory book to world views.
Biased? Of course, everyone is. So it's a matter of our working out what appears to be most coherent picture of the world isn't it?
MBPrata wrote:Kurieuo wrote:You must be talking about something other than Atheism, because Atheism isn't logical at all.
I was talking about any belief, atheism included. Nearly every belief I've met until today has a logic behind it. Yeah, atheism included. Also, a couple of atheists I know don't expect logic to apply. As in...they believe everything that exists is just flat-out absurd, so the so-called lack of logic in things coming out of nowhere stops being relevant.
The most illogical, is a self-professing Nihilist who is making truth claims left, right and centre.
There is nothing more illogical than a Nihilist carrying on any sort of discussion other than meaningless mutterings.
You'll find such either as perhaps serial killers (because nothing is real anyway), in a mental asylum muttering away or dead due to suicide or the like.
MB Prata wrote:Nevermind the self-refuting nature of saying "We humans can realise that we don't really know anything at all" -- are you claiming to know something there?
No. That would be inconsistent with my belief that we know nothing. Instead, I am claiming that I BELIEVE that we know absolutely nothing.
Of course it would be inconsistent with your "Nihilism". You being here is inconsistent.
Again, you should truly self-reflect as mentioned in my writings above.
Evidently, you believe you can know some things.
MB Prata wrote:You're close to the key for escaping Nihilism in a justified way.
Well, maybe...and maybe I need to escape Nihilism...but it is still a valid way to live. Namely when someone gets so nuts because of not believing in anything that he/she says: "Screw this, I know nothing! I'm just gonna be happy and make other people happy!". Sounds constructive, am I right?
Constructive? No, sounds meaningless. You're fooling yourself if you think otherwise.
I've thrown out what I consider to be some pearls above... to help. Do with them what you will.
Sometimes He works in the most mysterious of ways... 
