SoCalExile wrote:
Listened to the first few minutes and stopped because there's so much to question and discuss already.
Those who know me here, would vouch that I'm a free-thinking theologian. I do not attach myself to fitting Scripture in this systematic theology or that. Clearly, unlike the man in the video, he seems to have adopted a theological system of his own. Whether that matters, well, I just say build up a case according to what is revealed to us in Scripture.
Given that I've recently been listening to perhaps the most leading Reformed preacher of the last century (Martyn Lloyd-Jones), many things in the video that the guy claims seems very strawmanish. Maximally, he is applying an infinitely broad stroke to Calvinists (aka Reformed theologians).
My understanding of Reformed theology, is that truly understood, it would never be said one is "saved by belief" except where one is perhaps being quite loose with their words. Rather, strictly speaking, it is by God's grace in Christ who was sent, that the requirements of the Law have been met completely (Christ positively fulfilled them in every way being born into the world as man via Mary, and satisfying every dot and tittle). Then Christ bore our punishment for breaking the Law thereby wiping our slate clean before God for the sin of all humanity. And finally, Christ's Righteousness is then imputed to us
via faith.
Now, what I'm about to say is an important distinction. "Faith" or a belief isn't
what saves us, but is merely the vehicle by which we receive Christ's Righteousness. Faith is the method by which Christ's righteousness is imputed to us, faith is not the what that saves us.
To say it is "by faith" or "by belief" that we are saved is merely adding a requirement, something we can boast in. Paul states, no one can boast. (Ephesians 2:9; 1 Cor 1:29-31) No one can boast, and yet someone who has a belief that saves can boast that they are saved on account of their belief!
Now to borrow some on Jones' thoughts and even words, many Christians or preachers today might say something like:
- "how wonderful it is to live now... under the old dispensation God confronted people with the Law, God said if you keep that it'll save you. You've got to keep that or you won't be saved! They were confronted by the Law. Ohhh.. but thankfully there's a new dispensation. God doesn't speak about the law any more, simply says "Will you believe in my Son?" "will you accept my son or won't you? How much easier is that?" They say, "How easier to believe in Christ than it was to keep the law."
No, the Gospel doesn't void the law
through offering us an easier way of going to heaven. It is not as if God says, "
well the other was rather difficult after all, forget all about it, will you mere believe in my Son or won't you? If you will, it's alright. And you slip into heaven easily. If not, then off with you to the fiery pits of hell." Is it?
NOW STOP before you misunderstand. A
tolerable Calvinist or Reformed theologian will not say what the man in the video says, "
you must keep the Law or else it shows you're not really saved." (strawman version) No, the true thinking Reformed theologian rather sees this easy believing "faith" as a kind of
new law, just one that is easier and simpler than the old law. It creates something for Christians to boast in does it not? Isn't that antithetical to Paul's teachings?
So then, I agree up to here with the more thoughtful Reformed thinking I've elaborated upon.
That is, to say one is saved on account of their belief is simply replacing the harder legalism of the OT Law with a softer legalism of NT Faith. One's actions under the Law, replaced by one's act in belief. Such an easy believism is actually legalistic and can create boast that ought to be reserved for Christ alone. It turns "belief" or "faith" in a law,
one must believe to gain righteousness and be saved, fleshly actions being the very antithesis of Paul's teachings of Christ alone.
So what is "faith" then? When Paul uses by faith, it is always the opposite to everything that is legalistic.
Philippians 3, he thought he was as regards to the demands of the law, perfect and righteous. That's legalistic.
A man thinks he has made himself righteous by works or as Paul says, "confidence in the flesh."
Faith is the exact opposite of that. Jones' preached of faith that (paraphrasing),
Faith is the opposite of everything that is meritorious in men.
Faith is the contradiction and negation of every tendency in men to say that his merit is enough.
Faith is just the blank contradiction to all that.
It is in the exclusion of any worthiness in us, that the worth of true faith is brought out.
So then, if what you call faith hasn't pushed outside everything
you can do, then you haven't got faith in Christ alone. You can boast in yourself, in keep a rule that says you must believe to be saved.
Now what I've written above, agree with it or not -- the above is a very Reformed (Calvinist) way of thinking. So in all fairness and respect, I naturally have some reservations just in the first few minutes of the video:
- The man in the video just claims that the Calvinist will believe one is "saved by belief" [wrong]
- The man also goes on to say, "We believe that the gift is salvation, they believe the gift is the faith to believe." [distorted]
- The man also says, "While a Calvinist says, 'yes, absolutely, salvation is by belief [no they don't],' that's not where it ends with them. For us we're ok with that. When I talk to someone and I ask them what they believe in. If they say yes I trust in what God solely did for me, I believe it. They're saved and I believe I'm done." [notice the "I trust" = action = still of the flesh = still legalistic based upon a law of "must believe" = boastable = not Christ alone]
- The man also says, "When a Calvinist says yes it's by belief, it is belief by works. So ultimately it comes across you have works you're not saved. [Jones and I guess other Reformed theologians with common sense, do not say this at all, in fact rather the opposite]
Indeed, to say that one is saved by their belief in Christ, is to add a requirement. An action or law
that one must do in order to be saved. This contradicts Paul message as I read it throughout his many epistles, the the anti legalism that Paul rejoices in (Philippians 3:3).
Let's be careful here, select from one of the following:
- Is it our belief that saves us?
- Is it our faith that saves us?
- Is it Christ and Christ alone?
- Or is it a mix of our work conjoined with Christ's work?
There is only one correct answer I see which won't result in any boasting of ourselves.
Notwithstanding any issues I see with some Calvinist beliefs, the man in the video contradicts this and commits a serious error in my opinion.
