Miraculous healings today

[RickD]

jpbg wrote/
Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
Gal 5:20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
Gal 5:21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God

the bible says people doing these things are not going to heaven and osas says they are so I believe the bible not osas

So, according to your theology, only perfect, sinless people have any chance of going to heaven, and Christ's sacrifice for us sinners, was worthless. How's that false Christ working out for you? I hope you're good enough to get to heaven.

[jpbg33]

I believe we should be striving to be perfect and when we mess up we should make things right right then. If we live that way we will make it.

so you are saying that the bible is not right by saying that, that osas is right not the bible.

[crochet1949]

I have never said I work to be saved. That would be stupid. I said I work because I am saved.

like Jesus said. I have good fruit because I am of a good tree and a good tree can not have bad fruit.


Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 
Gal 5:20  Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 
Gal 5:21  Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God

the bible says people doing these things are not going to heaven and osas says they are so I believe the bible not osas.


Gal 5:16  This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh. 
Gal 5:17  For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would. 
Gal 5:18  But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law. 
Gal 5:19  Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 
Gal 5:20  Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 
Gal 5:21  Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. 
Gal 5:22  But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, 
Gal 5:23  Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. 
Gal 5:24  And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. 
Gal 5:25  If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. 
Gal 5:26  Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another. 

The Bible Does say that those who practice those things are not going to heaven. So -- we Need to be careful of our Own actions, first -- If we find ourselves at some point being envious of Whatever -- to what extent are we envious -- our neighbor got a new car. We are envious of his ability to Get the car or are envious Of the Car. Are we content to simply 'sigh' or are we going to Act On those feelings Of envy. Maybe to the extent of trying to sabotage his job? Or do something to his new car? Are we Not content with our own car or bicycle or our ability to walk where ever we need to go?

With Christ in our heart -- we probably Won't have those antagonistic feelings. So we need to check our heart. And if / when we observe those negative attitudes in Others around us. We Could try to engage in conversation with them. Not by batting them over their head with Scriptures -- but in some loving, caring way -- approach the subject. Pray for an opening For conversation.

I suspect that in our Society , now days, we've gotten so far away from Bible / that which God is Trying to teach us -- We want to be our Own person. And we live with the negative as well as the positive consequences of our choices. And Society wants everyone to be tolerant of Everything / Anything that the other person does. So - is it any wonder that this world is full of unrepentant people. But -- God Also sees to it that those who Will accept Jesus Christ as their savior Will have opportunity to do so. No one is going to slip through the cracks.

Once saved Always saved IS in Bible -- it's NOT something made up by some group. The problem seems to come from those who have been led to say a prayer and given a card to sign and then sent back home. Or maybe during the alter call in a church service -- instead of taking a person to a different room where there will be no pressure of hearing the piano / organ keep on playing and playing while the person is 'making their decision' -- they remain in the auditorium and know that 'everyone ' is waiting for them to 'finish' so that everyone can rejoice in a new believer.
How many people have been led to pray a prayer without really understanding the why's or where fore's Of. My younger daughter was one of those. A 1st grade teacher had the kids in her class close their eyes and led them in a prayer. Our daughter was Bound and Determined that she was saved then. But after she was married to a nice Christian guy -- they were at a different church -- different preaching -- she realized what had happened back Then and Did get right with God.
So - the question Could be asked -- was she really Saved back then? I'll concede that God knew what was in her heart. He wasn't going to let anything Bad happen to her that would send her to hell. She'd always been a good young lady. And Then she Officially became a born-again young lady. A Big change in her, No. But she Did have assurance of her salvation. And That is what OSAS is about -- assurance of our salvation and that the Holy Spirit will NOT leave us.

[RickD]

jpbg wrote:
I believe we should be striving to be perfect and when we mess up we should make things right right then. If we live that way we will make it.

Ah ok. All we have to do is make things right.

Then why did Jesus come, if we have it in our power to make things right with God? You're saying Jesus died for nothing?

jpbg wrote:

so you are saying that the bible is not right by saying that, that osas is right not the bible.

No. I'm saying you are wrong. Your interpretation is wrong. You worship a false Christ, and a false gospel. You can't even post a coherent sentence, and you expect us to believe your interpretation of scripture is correct?

[jpbg33]

my sentence structure has nothing to do with the bible.

Osas say some of those people are going to heaven when the bible say they are not so osas is wrong not the bible.

We confess God makes it right. You are reading in to my statement. Osas is not in scripture. It is in people's interpretation of scripture But it conflicts with scripture so it can not be right.

When the bible directly say those people are not going to heaven and osas say they will then osas is wrong.

[RickD]

my sentence structure has nothing to do with the bible.

Osas say some of those people are going to heaven when the bible say they are not so osas is wrong not the bible.

We confess God makes it right. You are reading in to my statement. Osas is not in scripture. It is in people's interpretation of scripture But it conflicts with scripture so it can not be right.

When the bible directly say those people are not going to heaven and osas say they will then osas is wrong.

Or...perhaps...your understanding of those verses that you believe state that osas is wrong, may be wrong.

As of now, we're going around in circles, so I'm going to refrain from responding to your posts.

[jpbg33]

So what is your understanding of this verse that makes it fit osas. I do not see how it fits osas at all. you said I was wrong so what is not.

we are going in circles because you are trying to dismiss this these verses and I am not going to let you. So how do they fit into osas. Show me how they work with osas and I will move on. if you can't then by all means you do not have to try just admit that I am right or stop posting which is the same thing.

[RickD]

So what is your understanding of this verse that makes it fit osas. I do not see how it fits osas at all. you said I was wrong so what is not.

we are going in circles because you are trying to dismiss this these verses and I am not going to let you. So how do they fit into osas. Show me how they work with osas and I will move on. if you can't then by all means you do not have to try just admit that I am right or stop posting which is the same thing.

Yes, you're right. Nobody who believes in osas has ever read any of the verses that you think disprove osas. All of us just ignore them, and hope nobody notices.

Every verse that you have posted that you think promotes your interpretation, I or someone else, has explained to you, or posted a link explaining a meaning other than what you think they mean. There isn't a single verse that you think goes against osas, that people haven't looked at.

This just goes to show what I've been saying all along...you are arguing against straw man arguments that are a figment of your imagination. It's a dishonest way to have a conversation. That's why people have stopped responding to your posts. It's not like I'm the only one on this forum that believes in osas/security of the believer. I'm just the only one who up until now, was stupid enough to continue trying to reason with you.

Ultimately it comes down to your interpretation vs mine. You continue to worship your weak, pathetic, warped version of god. And I'll stick with the God of the Bible who keeps His promises, and doesn't abandon people just because we aren't perfect.

[jpbg33]

I just looked through this thread and no one has said anything about it here on this thread. I was talking about healing and everyone else started hitting me over the head about osas I did not bring it up on this thread y'all did.

How do you handle these verses in your osas belief

I do not think you have a good answer.

Gal 5:18  But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law. 
Gal 5:19  Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 
Gal 5:20  Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 
Gal 5:21  Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. 

[RickD]

I just looked through this thread and no one has said anything about it here on this thread. I was talking about healing and everyone else started hitting me over the head about osas I did not bring it up on this thread y'all did.

How do you handle these verses in your osas belief

I do not think you have a good answer.

Gal 5:18  But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law. 
Gal 5:19  Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 
Gal 5:20  Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 
Gal 5:21  Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. 

Here you go. Before you dismiss the article out of hand, please read it and at least make an attempt to understand it.

I'm not saying which of the 4 views, if any, I agree with. I'm just posting so you can see that the verses in Galatians have been dealt with.
https://faithalone.org/journal/1991b/Wilkin.html

[crochet1949]

Yes, we were originally talking about miraculous healings. It's God who does the healing -- we are the ones who pray and ask that God's will be done.

[jpbg33]

They have not been dealt with on this thread

[RickD]

I just looked through this thread and no one has said anything about it here on this thread. I was talking about healing and everyone else started hitting me over the head about osas I did not bring it up on this thread y'all did.

How do you handle these verses in your osas belief

I do not think you have a good answer.

Gal 5:18  But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law. 
Gal 5:19  Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 
Gal 5:20  Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 
Gal 5:21  Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. 

Here you go. Before you dismiss the article out of hand, please read it and at least make an attempt to understand it.

I'm not saying which of the 4 views, if any, I agree with. I'm just posting so you can see that the verses in Galatians have been dealt with.
https://faithalone.org/journal/1991b/Wilkin.html

Here Jpbg. Just want to make sure you read this link, so you'll stop saying these verses haven't been dealt with.

[jpbg33]

I read though some of that and thoes different ways of dealing with these scriptures are not right because they are changing the verses. You can not get what they are saying out of thoes verses. It doesn't matter who is being talked to in the verse. The verse says that anyone doing any of these things are going to hell.

I'll give you an example of what I am talking about.

If I was talking to a group of thiefs and I told that group of thiefs that if I cot anyone stilling then I would throw that person in prison that that is the way it works in this town if you are cot stilling you are put directly in prison.


Do you really think that goes far just thiefs and if someone else stole it would be ok.

[crochet1949]

I just looked through this thread and no one has said anything about it here on this thread. I was talking about healing and everyone else started hitting me over the head about osas I did not bring it up on this thread y'all did.

How do you handle these verses in your osas belief

I do not think you have a good answer.

Gal 5:18  But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law. 
Gal 5:19  Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 
Gal 5:20  Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 
Gal 5:21  Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. 

Here you go. Before you dismiss the article out of hand, please read it and at least make an attempt to understand it.

I'm not saying which of the 4 views, if any, I agree with. I'm just posting so you can see that the verses in Galatians have been dealt with.
https://faithalone.org/journal/1991b/Wilkin.html

Here Jpbg. Just want to make sure you read this link, so you'll stop saying these verses haven't been dealt with.

I was reading the link -- a very good thorough article. Thanks for sharing it.