Defending the Trinity in the bible

[jenna]

jenna wrote:
again, you did not read what I said. i said the points about the TRINITY were valid.

Jenna, maybe you need to reread the original post. Every point, WITHOUT EXCEPTION, that was brought up as reasons why the person couldn't believe in the Trinity anymore, were points trying to show why Christ isn't God. So, for you to say, "I am with you on these points", how else can we take that other than you are with the person that Christ is not God? The points you say you are with Usagi on, are all points that say Christ is not God.

And as far as one God having two different natures- i consider God to be a family, consisting of Father and Son. ONE GOD (family) two beings.

I know what you think. And telling me again, doesn't make it any less contradictory. God cannot be two beings. Two separate beings have two separate natures, BY DEFINITION.

you are thinking in terms of human beings, not God. They share the same nature, that is, a holy nature

[B. W.]

We have been through this before...

Armstrong taught a family of Gods as one as in a family, which by the way is paganism...

He borrowed from paganism and Mormonism which is paganism based...

Herbert W. Armstrong, taught that there are only two Gods.

Continue to read their literature and you will come to the parts that they teach that Jesus is a God and that you too can become God, just like Jesus - a family of God in the Kingdom of God...all one God in a family of God

Guess that means one keeps on adding and adding gods so there are more than one god then, therefore, if the late H W Armstrong is now a god then there is more than one.

Armstrong taught that true Christians would eventually become God beings in various confusing and strange ways.

Quoted from:
The Family God's
Plan for Mankind
By Herbert W. Armstrong

Almost no one today knows that God is, actually, a divine FAMILY. One family. That family is ONE GOD.

Since humans were put on earth for the very PURPOSE of being begotten, and then BORN into the God FAMILY - which is the KINGDOM or God - the ETERNAL has endowed this GOD-PLANE relationship for HUMANS and for humans only! What a wonderful privilege to be humans - to be given the marriage relationship now, to marry Christ and become part of the God family!

This reeks of the Moon god's family of gods or Zeus or all the ancient Canaanite and Babylonians pantheon of gods are based on. In fact, God punished Israel for following these and now, you Jenna, are trying to have folks follow another god.

This one verse refutes your doctrines Jenna...

Isaiah 43:10, "You are My witnesses," says the LORD, "And My servant whom I have chosen, That you may know and believe Me, And understand that I am He. Before Me there was no God formed, Nor shall there be after Me." NKJV

Toss in a few more...

Isaiah 45:18... "I am the LORD, and there is no other. NKJV

Exo 23:31-33, "And I will set your bounds from the Red Sea to the sea, Philistia, and from the desert to the River. For I will deliver the inhabitants of the land into your hand, and you shall drive them out before you. 32 You shall make no covenant with them, nor with their gods. 33 They shall not dwell in your land, lest they make you sin against Me. For if you serve their gods, it will surely be a snare to you."

What you teach is in direct violation of the Bible Jenna...
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[jenna]

We have been through this before...

Armstrong taught a family of Gods as one as in a family, which by the way is paganism...

He borrowed from paganism and Mormonism which is paganism based...

Herbert W. Armstrong, taught that there are only two Gods.

Continue to read their literature and you will come to the parts that they teach that Jesus is a God and that you too can become God, just like Jesus - a family of God in the Kingdom of God...all one God in a family of God

Guess that means one keeps on adding and adding gods so there are more than one god then, therefore, if the late H W Armstrong is now a god then there is more than one.

Armstrong taught that true Christians would eventually become God beings in various confusing and strange ways.

Quoted from:
The Family God's
Plan for Mankind
By Herbert W. Armstrong

Almost no one today knows that God is, actually, a divine FAMILY. One family. That family is ONE GOD.

Since humans were put on earth for the very PURPOSE of being begotten, and then BORN into the God FAMILY - which is the KINGDOM or God - the ETERNAL has endowed this GOD-PLANE relationship for HUMANS and for humans only! What a wonderful privilege to be humans - to be given the marriage relationship now, to marry Christ and become part of the God family!

This reeks of the Moon god's family of gods or Zeus or all the ancient Canaanite and Babylonians pantheon of gods are based on. In fact, God punished Israel for following these and now, you Jenna, are trying to have folks follow another god.

This one verse refutes your doctrines Jenna...

Isaiah 43:10, "You are My witnesses," says the LORD, "And My servant whom I have chosen, That you may know and believe Me, And understand that I am He. Before Me there was no God formed, Nor shall there be after Me." NKJV

Toss in a few more...

Isaiah 45:18... "I am the LORD, and there is no other. NKJV

Exo 23:31-33, "And I will set your bounds from the Red Sea to the sea, Philistia, and from the desert to the River. For I will deliver the inhabitants of the land into your hand, and you shall drive them out before you. 32 You shall make no covenant with them, nor with their gods. 33 They shall not dwell in your land, lest they make you sin against Me. For if you serve their gods, it will surely be a snare to you."

What you teach is in direct violation of the Bible Jenna...
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-
-

what i am saying is no more in direct violation of the bible than your false trinity is. it is actually quite astounding that you can accuse me of polytheism, but cannot see that you believe in it, what with your 3-in-1.

[Philip]

Jenna: what i am saying is no more in direct violation of the bible than your false trinity is. it is actually quite astounding that you can accuse me of polytheism, but cannot see that you believe in it, what with your 3-in-1.

Jenna, whatever you might believe, please don't assert a belief in polytheism for those who believe in the Trinity. How many times does one have to emphasize that this is a Trinity of ONE (God)! So, for whatever you think of the doctrine, please don't insist a falsehood about what those who believe in God's Trinity of ONE are saying. It has been explained to you in great detail, and yet you come back with such a ridiculous statement? Plus, you've avoided much of what B.W. has explained to you about it.

[jenna]

Jenna: what i am saying is no more in direct violation of the bible than your false trinity is. it is actually quite astounding that you can accuse me of polytheism, but cannot see that you believe in it, what with your 3-in-1.

Jenna, whatever you might believe, please don't assert a belief in polytheism for those who believe in the Trinity. How many times does one have to emphasize that this is a Trinity of ONE (God)! So, for whatever you think of the doctrine, please don't insist a falsehood about what those who believe in God's Trinity of ONE are saying. It has been explained to you in great detail, and yet you come back with such a ridiculous statement? Plus, you've avoided much of what B.W. has explained to you about it.

what i believe has been explained in great detail also, and yet i have gotten nothing but trash comments like what i believe is nothing more than a cult, i believe in polytheism, etc. so please, dont insist on a falsehood of what i believe in either, unless you want the tables turned. doesnt feel very good does it?

[Philip]

Jenna, I don't really know all that you believe - I've not read much in or interacted with your threads. But one thing I do know, is that NO one here who believes in the Trinity believes in more than one God. So, whatever you issues with how you feel you have been wrongly framed - by all means, address the details - but please don't insist Trinity believers hold to more than one God, as there is not a hint of accuracy in that statement.

[jenna]

Jenna, I don't really know all that you believe - I've not read much in or interacted with your threads. But one thing I do know, is that NO one here who believes in the Trinity believes in more than one God. So, whatever you issues with how you feel you have been wrongly framed - by all means, address the details - but please don't insist Trinity believers hold to more than one God, as there is not a hint of accuracy in that statement.

what i am saying, Philip, is that there is no more truth in the statement that i believe in more than one God, than the statement that ya'll do. It has been said that i am a member of a cult, that i am polytheist, and i have even been accused of lying, more than once. i find it sad that just because my beliefs are not the same as someone else's, that they would go that far.

[RickD]

Jenna, I don't really know all that you believe - I've not read much in or interacted with your threads. But one thing I do know, is that NO one here who believes in the Trinity believes in more than one God. So, whatever you issues with how you feel you have been wrongly framed - by all means, address the details - but please don't insist Trinity believers hold to more than one God, as there is not a hint of accuracy in that statement.

what i am saying, Philip, is that there is no more truth in the statement that i believe in more than one God, than the statement that ya'll do. It has been said that i am a member of a cult, that i am polytheist, and i have even been accused of lying, more than once. i find it sad that just because my beliefs are not the same as someone else's, that they would go that far.

You forgot atheist. You have also been accused of being an atheist.

[RickD]

Jenna, I don't really know all that you believe - I've not read much in or interacted with your threads. But one thing I do know, is that NO one here who believes in the Trinity believes in more than one God. So, whatever you issues with how you feel you have been wrongly framed - by all means, address the details - but please don't insist Trinity believers hold to more than one God, as there is not a hint of accuracy in that statement.

what i am saying, Philip, is that there is no more truth in the statement that i believe in more than one God, than the statement that ya'll do. It has been said that i am a member of a cult, that i am polytheist, and i have even been accused of lying, more than once. i find it sad that just because my beliefs are not the same as someone else's, that they would go that far.

Jenna,

I'm not sure you're listening to what people are saying. Your theology necessarily leads to polytheism. Nobody is saying that you are consciously believing in two gods. But your theology contradicts what you say you believe.

Stop taking this whole discussion as a personal attack against you. It's not. We are trying to show you how your theology is unbiblical, contradictory, and just flat out wrong. And just like you don't understand the doctrine of the Trinity, you can't seem to grasp what people are saying about your theology. Stop getting offended, and defensive, and just make an attempt to listen and understand. Nobody here is your enemy.

[jenna]

Jenna, I don't really know all that you believe - I've not read much in or interacted with your threads. But one thing I do know, is that NO one here who believes in the Trinity believes in more than one God. So, whatever you issues with how you feel you have been wrongly framed - by all means, address the details - but please don't insist Trinity believers hold to more than one God, as there is not a hint of accuracy in that statement.

what i am saying, Philip, is that there is no more truth in the statement that i believe in more than one God, than the statement that ya'll do. It has been said that i am a member of a cult, that i am polytheist, and i have even been accused of lying, more than once. i find it sad that just because my beliefs are not the same as someone else's, that they would go that far.

Jenna,

I'm not sure you're listening to what people are saying. Your theology necessarily leads to polytheism. Nobody is saying that you are consciously believing in two gods. But your theology contradicts what you say you believe.

Stop taking this whole discussion as a personal attack against you. It's not. We are trying to show you how your theology is unbiblical, contradictory, and just flat out wrong. And just like you don't understand the doctrine of the Trinity, you can't seem to grasp what people are saying about your theology. Stop getting offended, and defensive, and just make an attempt to listen and understand. Nobody here is your enemy.

i do not think anyone here is my enemy. all i am saying here is that it is no more unbiblical what i believe, as what you believe. you want me to listen and understand, yet make no effort on your half to do the same. what i have gotten, from you specifically, is sarcasm. you have repeatedly called me slow or special, lol. and my belief is not more polytheistic than yours is.

[RickD]

Jenna, I don't really know all that you believe - I've not read much in or interacted with your threads. But one thing I do know, is that NO one here who believes in the Trinity believes in more than one God. So, whatever you issues with how you feel you have been wrongly framed - by all means, address the details - but please don't insist Trinity believers hold to more than one God, as there is not a hint of accuracy in that statement.

what i am saying, Philip, is that there is no more truth in the statement that i believe in more than one God, than the statement that ya'll do. It has been said that i am a member of a cult, that i am polytheist, and i have even been accused of lying, more than once. i find it sad that just because my beliefs are not the same as someone else's, that they would go that far.

Jenna,

I'm not sure you're listening to what people are saying. Your theology necessarily leads to polytheism. Nobody is saying that you are consciously believing in two gods. But your theology contradicts what you say you believe.

Stop taking this whole discussion as a personal attack against you. It's not. We are trying to show you how your theology is unbiblical, contradictory, and just flat out wrong. And just like you don't understand the doctrine of the Trinity, you can't seem to grasp what people are saying about your theology. Stop getting offended, and defensive, and just make an attempt to listen and understand. Nobody here is your enemy.

i do not think anyone here is my enemy. all i am saying here is that it is no more unbiblical what i believe, as what you believe. you want me to listen and understand, yet make no effort on your half to do the same. what i have gotten, from you specifically, is sarcasm. you have repeatedly called me slow or special, lol. and my belief is not more polytheistic than yours is.

Well, either your belief OR the Trinity is unbiblical. They both could be unbiblical, but since the two beliefs are contrary to each other, they both can't be biblical.

You've already been shown multiple times, why your theology is polytheistic. The fact that you say it isn't, doesn't change that one iota.

[Philip]

Jenna, do you believe that the Father is God? Do you believe the Son is God?

[jenna]

Well, either your belief OR the Trinity is unbiblical. They both could be unbiblical, but since the two beliefs are contrary to each other, they both can't be biblical.

You've already been shown multiple times, why your theology is polytheistic. The fact that you say it isn't, doesn't change that one iota.

thats funny, first i am atheist, but also polytheist. so which is it Rick? because it cant be both. do i believe in multiple gods, no God, or do i believe that there is ONE GOD, but that ONE GOD is ONE family (no polytheism there).

[jenna]

Jenna, do you believe that the Father is God? Do you believe the Son is God?

yes.

[Nessa]

What about the holy spirit?