What about.......

[SillyPutty]

the people who died before Christ came, where are they now and where will they spend eternity?

[B. W.]

the people who died before Christ came, where are they now and where will they spend eternity?

This is an interesting topic. I'll just post what some scholars say on this matter and let others chime in. I have my views, but I will remian silent on the matter. Others need to post

Many bible scholars believe that during the three days and nights after Jesus died on the cross before he was raised from the dead, He went to a place called Abraham's Bosom - the abode of the righteous dead (people who exercised faith as Hebrews 11 mentions) and brought the gospel to them. The unrighteous dead were left where they were, from what I read and gather on this subject.

This is the basic position many hold on this matter. There are others. Maybe someone could enlighten us more ???

[ryo dokomi]

true, Christ did go to Abraham's bosom, he did bring the righteous to the kingdom. however he did not just leave the unrighteous there. all unrighteous have to be judged before they go to Hell, so he brought all that did not serve God in thier time to the judgment seat, and they are waiting the end of days for the judgment. that is where they are now.

[Fortigurn]

I think we need to see more Scripture in this thread, and less Jewish fables.

[Fortigurn]

the people who died before Christ came, where are they now and where will they spend eternity?

Right now they are in the grave, lying unconscious:

Psalm 146:
3Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help.
4His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth; in that very day his thoughts perish.

The Living Bible:
4for every man must die. His breathing stops, life ends, and in a moment all he planned for himself is ended.

New American Bible:
4 When they breathe their last, they return to the earth; that day all their planning comes to nothing.

New Living Translation:
4When their breathing stops, they return to the earth, and in a moment all their plans come to an end

New Revised Standard Version:
4 When their breath departs, they return to the earth; on that very day their plans perish.

Revised Standard Version:
4 When his breath departs he returns to his earth; on that very day his plans perish.

New English Translation:

Psalm 6:
5 For no one mentions your name in the realm of death, In Sheol [the grave] who gives you thanks?

Psalm 115:

17 The dead do not praise the Lord, nor do any of those who descend into the silence of death.

Ecclesiastes 3:
19 For the fate of humans and the fate of animals are the same; as one dies, so dies the other. Both have the same breath; there is no advantage for humans over animals, for both are fleeting.
20 Both go to the same place, both come from the dust, and both return to dust.

Ecclesiastes 9:
5 For the living know that they will die, but the dead do not know anything; they have no further reward—and even the memory of them is forgotten.
6 The things they loved, as well as the things they hated and envied, all perished long ago; and they no longer have a part in anything that is done on earth.

10 Whatever you find to do with your hands, do it with all your might; because there is neither work nor plan nor knowledge nor wisdom in Sheol, the place where you will eventually go.

New English Translation

Isaiah 38:
9 This is the prayer of King Hezekiah of Judah when he was sick and then recovered from his illness:
10 “I thought, 'In the middle of my life I must walk through the gates of Sheol, I am deprived of the rest of my years.'

18 Indeed Sheol does not give you thanks; death does not praise you. Those who descend into the pit do not anticipate your faithfulness.
19 The living one, the living one, he gives you thanks, as I do today.

In the Bible, death is referred to as a sleep. Those who currently sleep in the unconsciousness of death will be awakened at the return of Christ, to face judgment:

Daniel 12:
2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awaken, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

[SillyPutty]

Interesting, my next questions then is

how will they be judged since they never heard of Christ?

and the people who do know Christ now and die today before the "judgement day" where are they?

thank you so much for help with this

[Fortigurn]

Interesting, my next questions then is

how will they be judged since they never heard of Christ?

Those who have heard the message of God and His commandment to obey His will are responsible to Him, regardless of whether the message they heard was Christ or not. The people of Nineveh and the queen of Sheba didn't hear about Christ, but they will be raised on the basis of the knowledge they had.

and the people who do know Christ now and die today before the "judgement day" where are they?

Same place.

thank you so much for help with this

You're welcome.

[SillyPutty]

So no humans are in heaven now? they are all in an unconsious state awaiting judgement day?

[Fortigurn]

So no humans are in heaven now? they are all in an unconsious state awaiting judgement day?

Yes.
Christ taught that no one has gone to heaven:

John 3:
13 No one has ascended into heaven except the one who descended from heaven—the Son of Man.

The apostles taught that no one has gone to heaven:

Acts 2:
29 “Brothers, I can speak confidently to you about our forefather David, that he both died and was buried, and his tomb is with us to this day.
34 For David did not ascend into heaven, but he himself says,
'The Lord said to my lord, “Sit at my right hand
35 until I make your enemies a footstool for your feet.”'

That is why judgment is spoken of consistently as being yet future:

Ecclesiastes 12:
14 For God will evaluate every deed, including every secret thing, whether good or evil.

This judgment is still in the future:

Matthew 10:
14 And if anyone will not welcome you or listen to your message, shake the dust off your feet as you leave that house or that town.
15 I tell you the truth, it will be more bearable for the region of Sodom and Gomorrah on the day of judgment than for that town!

Matthew 7:
21 “Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter into the kingdom of heaven—only the one who does the will of my Father in heaven.
22 On that day, many will say to me, 'Lord, Lord, didn't we prophesy in your name, and in your name cast out demons and do many powerful deeds?'
23 Then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you. Go away from me, you lawbreakers!'

Mathew 11:
22 But I tell you, it will be more bearable for Tyre and Sidon on the day of judgment than for you!
23 And you, Capernaum, will you be exalted to heaven? No, you will be thrown down to Hades! For if the miracles done among you had been done in Sodom, it would have continued to this day.
24 But I tell you, it will be more bearable for the region of Sodom on the day of judgment than for you!”

Matthew 12:
36 I tell you that on the day of judgment, people will give an account for every worthless word they speak.
37 For by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned.”

1 John 4:
17 By this love is perfected with us, so that we may have confidence in the day of judgment, because just as Jesus is, so also are we in this world.

Matthew 12:
41 The people of Nineveh will stand up at the judgment with this generation and condemn it, because they repented when Jonah preached to them—and now, something greater than Jonah is here!
42 The queen of the South will rise up at the judgment with this generation and condemn it, because she came from the ends of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon—and now, something greater than Solomon is here!

2 Peter 2:
9 …the Lord knows how to rescue the godly from their trials, and to reserve the unrighteous for punishment at the day of judgment…

2 Peter 3:
7 But by the same word the present heavens and earth have been reserved for fire, by being kept for the day of judgment and destruction of the ungodly.

In his parables, Jesus taught that the judgment of the good and wicked will take place at his return:

Matthew 13:
24 Jesus presented them with another parable: “The kingdom of heaven is like a person who sowed good seed in his field.
25 But while everyone was sleeping, an enemy came and sowed weeds among the wheat and went away.
26 When the plants sprouted and bore grain, then the weeds also appeared.
27 So the slaves of the owner came and said to him, 'Sir, didn't you sow good seed in your field? Then where did the weeds come from?'

In this parable, the harvest time is the time of future judgment. The judgment of the good and wicked takes place at Christ's return:

Matthew 13:
28 He said, 'An enemy has done this.' So the slaves replied, 'Do you want us to go and gather them?'
29 But he said, 'No, since in gathering the weeds you may uproot the wheat with them.
30 Let both grow together until the harvest. At harvest time I will tell the reapers, “First collect the weeds and tie them in bundles to be burned, but then gather the wheat into my barn.”'"

Here Jesus explains his own parable:

Matthew 13:
36 Then he left the crowds and went into the house. And his disciples came to him saying, “Explain to us the parable of the weeds in the field.”
37 He answered, “The one who sowed the good seed is the Son of Man.
38 The field is the world and the good seed are the people of the kingdom. The weeds are the people of the evil one,
39 and the enemy who sows them is the devil. The harvest is the end of the age, and the reapers are angels.

The harvest (the time of judgment), is still future, the end of the age.

Jesus explains his own parable further:

Matthew 13:
40 As the weeds are collected and burned with fire, so it will be at the end of the age.
41 The Son of Man will send his angels, and they will gather from his kingdom everything that causes sin as well as all lawbreakers.
42 They will throw them into the fiery furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
43 Then the righteous will shine like the sun in the kingdom of their Father. The one who has ears had better listen!

Jesus was teaching that the judgment of all men is still in the future.

In the next parable, Jesus again taught that the judgment of the good and wicked takes place at his return:

Matthew 13:
47 “Again, the kingdom of heaven is like a net that was cast into the sea that caught all kinds of fish.
48 When it was full, they pulled it ashore, sat down, and put the good fish into containers and threw the bad away.
49 It will be this way at the end of the age. Angels will come and separate the evil from the righteous
50 and throw them into the fiery furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

The sorting (the time of judgment), is still future, the end of the age.

Here Jesus says plainly that the judgment of the good and wicked takes place at his return:

Matthew 16:
27 For the Son of Man will come with his angels in the glory of his Father, and then he will reward each person according to what he has done.

Jesus was teaching that the judgment of all men is still in the future.

Again, Jesus insists that the judgment of the good and wicked takes place at his return:

Matthew 19:
28 Jesus said to them, “I tell you the truth: In the age when all things are renewed, when the Son of Man sits on his glorious throne, you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
29 And whoever has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or children or fields for my sake will receive a hundred times as much and will inherit eternal life.
30 But many who are first will be last, and the last first.

Jesus was teaching that the judgment of all men is still in the future.

Again, Jesus insists that the judgment of the good and wicked takes place at his return:

Matthew 24:
37 For just like the days of Noah were, so the coming of the Son of Man will be.
38 For in those days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day Noah entered the ark.
39 And they knew nothing until the flood came and took them all away. It will be the same at the coming of the Son of Man.

Jesus was teaching that the judgment of all men is still in the future.

I could keep going for another few pages.

[Fortigurn]

I've attached a WinRAR file containing a Powerpoint presentation on what the Bible says about death and judgment.

[Byblos]

................... W A R N I N G ..................

SOME OPINIONS EXPRESSED IN THIS THREAD MAY NOT BE TRADITIONAL, MAINSTREAM CHRISTIAN IDEAS. PROCEED AT YOUR OWN PERIL (LITERALLY).

[Fortigurn]

................... W A R N I N G ..................

SOME OPINIONS EXPRESSED IN THIS THREAD MAY NOT BE TRADITIONAL, MAINSTREAM CHRISTIAN IDEAS. PROCEED AT YOUR OWN PERIL (LITERALLY).

I'd welcome your comments on the quotes provided here.

[Byblos]

................... W A R N I N G ..................

SOME OPINIONS EXPRESSED IN THIS THREAD MAY NOT BE TRADITIONAL, MAINSTREAM CHRISTIAN IDEAS. PROCEED AT YOUR OWN PERIL (LITERALLY).

I'd welcome your comments on the quotes provided here.

Fort man, we've gone down this road many times. I simply thought a disclaimer is in order so everyone knows to weigh opinions with denomination and background, that's all. Do not take offense to it.

[Fortigurn]

................... W A R N I N G ..................

SOME OPINIONS EXPRESSED IN THIS THREAD MAY NOT BE TRADITIONAL, MAINSTREAM CHRISTIAN IDEAS. PROCEED AT YOUR OWN PERIL (LITERALLY).

I'd welcome your comments on the quotes provided here.

Fort man, we've gone down this road many times. I simply thought a disclaimer is in order so everyone knows to weigh opinions with denomination and background, that's all. Do not take offense to it.

I'm not actually taking offense. I was pretty careful with my comments. I don't think they go beyond what those passages say.

Take the parables of Christ, for example. Are they saying that judgment is yet in the future, or takes place immediately at death?