Russian Jet Shot Down by Syrian Rebels

[DBowling]

We can't let the chemical weapons attack emotionally draw us into a civil war.

Trump is an isolationist, and he announced his goal last week to pull troops out of Syria, so I don't think Trump has any intention of leaving US troops in Syria. Bush talked about regime change in Syria. Obama talked about regime change in Syria. But I don't recall Trump saying anything about regime change. Trump apparently is ok with leaving Syria in the hands of Russia.

As you point out in your post, we are in a classic lose/lose situation.

IMHO Trump's now telegraphed missile strike has nothing to do with getting more deeply involved in the Syrian civil war. I think Trump is making a statement to other audiences as well.
- Syria made an agreement with the UN to destroy their chemical weapon stockpile. Obama did nothing when Syria used chemical weapons their own people. As the anti-Obama, Trump wants to show that he is stronger than Obama.
- Russia was also involved in the chemical weapons agreement between Syria and the UN. This is a signal to Russia that if they want the US to leave their puppet Assad alone, then Russia needs to make sure that he doesn't use chemical weapons. As you point out, I guess it's ok to kill your own people, just don't use chemical weapons to do it.
- I think this is also a signal to North Korea. I think Trump is flexing some US muscle before his negotiations with North Korea in an attempt to show what the US can and will do in response to the use of wmd.
- Let's not forget Mueller. I think part of this involves Trump trying to show that he can stand up to the Russians in an attempt to show that he is not "colluding with the Russians".
- And finally, as K points out, this is mid-term election year, and Trump is trying to increase his popularity and avoid losing one or both houses of Congress by rallying the country around the flag as he stands up to the evil Assad and Putin.

So I really don't think the impending US missile strike will be anything more than a punch in the face to Assad before the US packs up and leaves Syria. So the smart thing for Putin to do is let Trump have his glorious exit from Syria without doing anything that will persuade Trump that he needs to change his mind and get more involved.

My .02

[RickD]

We can't let the chemical weapons attack emotionally draw us into a civil war.

Trump is an isolationist, and he announced his goal last week to pull troops out of Syria, so I don't think Trump has any intention of leaving US troops in Syria. Bush talked about regime change in Syria. Obama talked about regime change in Syria. But I don't recall Trump saying anything about regime change. Trump apparently is ok with leaving Syria in the hands of Russia.

As you point out in your post, we are in a classic lose/lose situation.

IMHO Trump's now telegraphed missile strike has nothing to do with getting more deeply involved in the Syrian civil war. I think Trump is making a statement to other audiences as well.
- Syria made an agreement with the UN to destroy their chemical weapon stockpile. Obama did nothing when Syria used chemical weapons their own people. As the anti-Obama, Trump wants to show that he is stronger than Obama.
- Russia was also involved in the chemical weapons agreement between Syria and the UN. This is a signal to Russia that if they want the US to leave their puppet Assad alone, then Russia needs to make sure that he doesn't use chemical weapons. As you point out, I guess it's ok to kill your own people, just don't use chemical weapons to do it.
- I think this is also a signal to North Korea. I think Trump is flexing some US muscle before his negotiations with North Korea in an attempt to show what the US can and will do in response to the use of wmd.
- Let's not forget Mueller. I think part of this involves Trump trying to show that he can stand up to the Russians in an attempt to show that he is not "colluding with the Russians".
- And finally, as K points out, this is mid-term election year, and Trump is trying to increase his popularity and avoid losing one or both houses of Congress by rallying the country around the flag as he stands up to the evil Assad and Putin.

So I really don't think the impending US missile strike will be anything more than a punch in the face to Assad before the US packs up and leaves Syria. So the smart thing for Putin to do is let Trump have his glorious exit from Syria without doing anything that will persuade Trump that he needs to change his mind and get more involved.

My .02

It's times like this that I wish we had a real leader in office. Someone like...Egg McMuffin.

[DBowling]

It's times like this that I wish we had a real leader in office. Someone like...Egg McMuffin.

Hey... we agree on something...
Me too!

McMullin actually had first hand experience working in the Middle East and understands the many different dynamics and players in involved. But my guy didn't win.

However, I believe that the stable leadership of a President Pence would be a definite improvement.

[RickD]

It's times like this that I wish we had a real leader in office. Someone like...Egg McMuffin.

Hey... we agree on something...
Me too!

McMullin actually had first hand experience working in the Middle East and understands the many different dynamics and players in involved. But my guy didn't win.

However, I believe that the stable leadership of a President Pence would be a definite improvement.

Isn't pence a neocon?

For me, I can do without that as president.

I tried to find out more about Pence. When I looked up "neocon" in the thesaurus, Pence was a synonym.

[DBowling]

I tried to find out more about Pence. When I looked up "neocon" in the thesaurus, Pence was a synonym.

That's not what my thesaurus said...
mine said the synonym for 'neocon' was...
John Bolton

[Kurieuo]

Just replace Neo-Conservative with Republican who apparently has some sort of conservative valus and doesn't mind blowing up any Arab nation, making a mess in the Middle East (or Russia, or China, or heck anyone really).

As for McMuffin, he definitely knows how to get arms to terrorist groups... sorry Al Qu... err "Syrian rebels" alongside McCain -- those groups who are probably really responsible for orchestrating any chemical attacks while their comrades put on white helmets and pretend to rescue children. All for a good cause though, of ousting Assad who we have evidence, err, actually no real evidence so says Mattis, of any chemical weapons attack. Nonetheless, our Australian government could perhaps learn a thing or two about selling weapons from the Mcs.

And no, that sadly wasn't satire. I believe every word I just wrote.

Pence to me, though, doesn't seem to fit that mould. I really don't know enough about his international policies, or whether he's strongly advocated wars. I'm sure he'd cave into the other republicans. I don't know really much about who he's closer to or rubbed shoulders with. But, the guy seems to be a decent Christian with a true conscience so far as I've seen. Maybe I'm wrong. I've always thought he'd be better than Trump, so we can agree there DB.

[abelcainsbrother]

I don't know Abe, the US military looks to be gearing up from news I've heard. Ships with tomahawk missiles sailing to Middle East, trying to fly drones presumably to identify targets to bomb, etc. The US looks to be gearing up to unleash some fire and fury, but right now seems to be intelligence gathering and working out where to strike.

Israel has already set the tone bombing Iranian targets after the chemical attack. Nice distraction from its own Gaza conflict. Also, with France increasing it's own military in Syria, UK blaming Russia for its own chemical attack and like. I see a head-to-head confrontation as inevitable, its just a matter of whether enough justification has been given to increase public sentiment in the West for full on military action.

There's only so many times you can let Trump wash his hands and blame the deep state. It feels to me like there will be a confrontation within the next couple of weeks which Trump has green-lighted. Russia has drawn a line saying no more strikes by the US-Coalition in Syria, and any bombings will be met with retaliation. Israel's attack was unexpected and the Israel-Russia relationship appears to be treated separately on its own terms, so there's a certain other tolerance there. If the US however attacks Syria and thereby crosses the line Russia has clearly drawn, I do believe Russia will hit back.

It will take 9 days for US military ships to get there,in the meantime Trump will ask for evidence that Assad was behind the attack and they won't have any and there will be no war and the troops will be brought home. Even the last time Trump fired missiles into Syria he targeted ISIS at the time.Trump is allowing the players in the deep state to expose themselves so he knows who they are by buying time,in the meantime he is playing along with them like Assad is a bad guy just like he did with KimJong Un. Remember how tough Trump talked about "Rocketman"? While behind the scenes he was working with China to simmer him down and they have and now there is peace.

Trump has talked tough before playing along with the neo-cons who are controlled by the Deep State. I told ya'll before that Trump has control of most military forces but there are rogue CIA forces he does not control and they carried out this attack to blame on Assad.Trump is not a neo-con and does not want to be fighting useless wars that do nothing to keep America safe but the Deep state and Neo-cons have been planning regime change in Syria for years and they are not giving up trying to find a way to stay in Syria but Trump is going to pull the troops out and bring them home.

[Philip]

ACB: I told ya'll before that Trump has control of most military forces but there are rogue CIA forces he does not control and they carried out this attack to blame on Assad.

So, you're privy to intelligence that no other civilian has?

[Kurieuo]

I suppose there's always hope reason will prevail before firing off some tomahawks, otherwise here is what Russians are being advised to stock up on food-wise in preparation for armageddon:


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=AaoIStztLcU

What a great joke if Trump last minute says just kidding to all.

[abelcainsbrother]

ACB: I told ya'll before that Trump has control of most military forces but there are rogue CIA forces he does not control and they carried out this attack to blame on Assad.

So, you're privy to intelligence that no other civilian has?

Not intelligence but bread crumbs from Q.Q gives bread crumbs and people go through it and decipher it and know what is going on by doing it.We don't know who Q is but it is somebody close to the President who people think is apart of military intelligence.

[DBowling]

ACB: I told ya'll before that Trump has control of most military forces but there are rogue CIA forces he does not control and they carried out this attack to blame on Assad.

So, you're privy to intelligence that no other civilian has?

Not intelligence but bread crumbs from Q.Q gives bread crumbs and people go through it and decipher it and know what is going on by doing it.We don't know who Q is but it is somebody close to the President who people think is apart of military intelligence.

Sounds to me like Q is most likely Putin's propaganda and misinformation machine raising its ugly head again.
If Trump decides to strike Syria, will that be enough to convince you that Q is not a reliable source for accurate information?

[Kurieuo]

I think the more time that goes by, the more it seems everyone doesn't know what to expect.

Trump says missiles will be coming. Nikki Haley always plays tough to Russia and like to the UN council, says there's enough proof and the world needs to hold Assad accountable, etc. Then Mattis comes out more cautiously saying ​the US is still looking for “actual evidence” of a chemical weapons attack in Syria. Strange and unexpected that he keeps pulling the rug out like that from those who keep saying Assad has used chemical weapons. Perhaps he should be investigated for ties to Russia too.

Given Trump's mixed messages on many occasions, wanting to be buds with Putin one day, then saying we're firing missiles your way the next, it looks like Trump is just fumbling his way through. Perhaps such is more reflective of different advisors who have his ear. When those more anti-Russia war-leaning types have his ear then Trump plays tough, but when others have his ear then he wants to befriend Russia.

What I'd hope for is that further investigations are done into the claimed chemical incident, although it is beyond me why the US would care anyway given their partipation in Yemen and Mosul. No outcry there for the children who have died. Syria has welcomed investigations with arms wide open in response to Mattis, offering to even lead investigators into any part of Ghouta they wish.

Regardless, those who hate Russia (many of those you tend to like DB) want Assad gone and war will continue pushing Trump in the direction of firing missiles.

[Philip]

If you got rid of Putin, Assad and Iran, over there, you'd still have a civil war - just not one nearly as well funded. What peaceful entity exists that could keep a peace?

[DBowling]

I think the more time that goes by, the more it seems everyone doesn't know what to expect.

And I think that's a good thing... Trump's initial stupid tweet was exactly the kind of telegraphing that he railed on Obama for.

Trump says missiles will be coming. Nikki Haley always plays tough to Russia and like to the UN council, says there's enough proof and the world needs to hold Assad accountable, etc. Then Mattis comes out more cautiously saying ​the US is still looking for “actual evidence” of a chemical weapons attack in Syria.

I agree 100% with Mattis

Mattis placed blame on Russia for the continuing alleged chemical attacks in Syria, despite the fact that Mattis said the U.S. does not have hard evidence that chemical weapons were used in the Douma attack that has killed at least 43 people.

He said that they were still trying to get Organization for the Prevention of Chemical Weapons inspectors to Douma within the week to collect evidence.

Mattis has never denied that Assad used chemical weapons on its own people.

Israel took care of the initial kneejerk response. The US knows which helicopter delivered the chemical weapons. But Mattis is right. Putin is engaged in an aggressive misinformation campaign, and before the US strikes Syria we need to have convincing proof to present to the international community to justify any response.

I think we are also wise to make this an international response instead of just the US vs Syria.

So I am glad that Mattis appears to be the adult in the room.

[B. W.]

Well, the Democrats want a war with Russia and have been insulting a powerfully nuclear armed state by its...

Russia, Russia, Russia,

Trump colluded with Russia so poor old Hilary lost the election she was preordained to win...

Mueller's team violated the rights of all clients represented by Trumps lawyer - and Comey is pushing 'Pee Gate' because they most likely paid Stormy Daniels to be a false witness against Trump with a guy wearing a Trump wig on film.

Well, war with Russia is what the democrats want all because they did not provide them with true dirt of trump after selling 20 per cent of US uranium to Russia - they got burned in that deal and want revenge.

So why would they now be mad at Trump for doing what they want - war with Russia - to destroy the world totally for such high lofty goals of Cultural Marxism's progressive elitist ?

"Truth is Stranger than Fiction - Judgey Wudgey" (quote from Curly Howard, Disorder in the Court - film short)