Proof of God: "I want PROOF!"

[Kenny]

In what cases would you disagree and why?

Lets say if 90% of the world's population saw evidence of "X" being true, and 10% did not, and I were one of the 10% who did not; initially I would probably assume I and the rest of the other 10% did something wrong to not see the evidence, so I would do extensive research to understand why I did not get this information. If my extensive research shows the 90% to be wrong conserving the issue, I would accept it as true; thus the 90% is wrong.

Hmmm, that is very interesting.
How does that work with say, quantum mechanics or things that YOU simply can't prove via the 5 senses ?

I don't know much about quantum mechanics, so it's never been an issue with me.

Kind of missed the point, didn't you?

Probably; what's the point? Oh yeah; and the extensive research I mentioned before; it isn't limited to what can be proved via my 5 senses.

[PaulSacramento]

Lets say if 90% of the world's population saw evidence of "X" being true, and 10% did not, and I were one of the 10% who did not; initially I would probably assume I and the rest of the other 10% did something wrong to not see the evidence, so I would do extensive research to understand why I did not get this information. If my extensive research shows the 90% to be wrong conserving the issue, I would accept it as true; thus the 90% is wrong.

Hmmm, that is very interesting.
How does that work with say, quantum mechanics or things that YOU simply can't prove via the 5 senses ?

I don't know much about quantum mechanics, so it's never been an issue with me.

Kind of missed the point, didn't you?

Probably; what's the point? Oh yeah; and the extensive research I mentioned before; it isn't limited to what can be proved via my 5 senses.

So, here is the thing, you ( and I) accept multiple things based solely on the belief that who is telling us these things are experts, right?
There is no way for us to verify them ourselves, correct?
And consensus is a big factor in us accepting those things also, right?

[Kenny]

Hmmm, that is very interesting.
How does that work with say, quantum mechanics or things that YOU simply can't prove via the 5 senses ?

I don't know much about quantum mechanics, so it's never been an issue with me.

Kind of missed the point, didn't you?

Probably; what's the point? Oh yeah; and the extensive research I mentioned before; it isn't limited to what can be proved via my 5 senses.

So, here is the thing, you ( and I) accept multiple things based solely on the belief that who is telling us these things are experts, right?
There is no way for us to verify them ourselves, correct?
And consensus is a big factor in us accepting those things also, right?

I agree.

[PaulSacramento]

I don't know much about quantum mechanics, so it's never been an issue with me.

Kind of missed the point, didn't you?

Probably; what's the point? Oh yeah; and the extensive research I mentioned before; it isn't limited to what can be proved via my 5 senses.

So, here is the thing, you ( and I) accept multiple things based solely on the belief that who is telling us these things are experts, right?
There is no way for us to verify them ourselves, correct?
And consensus is a big factor in us accepting those things also, right?

I agree.

So, if those with expert opinion AND a huge consensus of people ( billions) believe that evidence A points to conclusion B, why wouldn't you?

[Kenny]

Kind of missed the point, didn't you?

Probably; what's the point? Oh yeah; and the extensive research I mentioned before; it isn't limited to what can be proved via my 5 senses.

So, here is the thing, you ( and I) accept multiple things based solely on the belief that who is telling us these things are experts, right?
There is no way for us to verify them ourselves, correct?
And consensus is a big factor in us accepting those things also, right?

I agree.

So, if those with expert opinion AND a huge consensus of people ( billions) believe that evidence A points to conclusion B, why wouldn't you?

I probably would! I can't think of a scenario where as I would not

[PaulSacramento]

Probably; what's the point? Oh yeah; and the extensive research I mentioned before; it isn't limited to what can be proved via my 5 senses.

So, here is the thing, you ( and I) accept multiple things based solely on the belief that who is telling us these things are experts, right?
There is no way for us to verify them ourselves, correct?
And consensus is a big factor in us accepting those things also, right?

I agree.

So, if those with expert opinion AND a huge consensus of people ( billions) believe that evidence A points to conclusion B, why wouldn't you?

I probably would! I can't think of a scenario where as I would not

Welcome to Theism in general and Christianity in particular.

[Kenny]

So, here is the thing, you ( and I) accept multiple things based solely on the belief that who is telling us these things are experts, right?
There is no way for us to verify them ourselves, correct?
And consensus is a big factor in us accepting those things also, right?

I agree.

So, if those with expert opinion AND a huge consensus of people ( billions) believe that evidence A points to conclusion B, why wouldn't you?

I probably would! I can't think of a scenario where as I would not

Welcome to Theism in general and Christianity in particular.

And here is where we disagree; I see Theism in general as evidence A points to conclusion B, but nobody agrees on what B is; and Christianity is just one of countless versions B

[PaulSacramento]

I agree.

So, if those with expert opinion AND a huge consensus of people ( billions) believe that evidence A points to conclusion B, why wouldn't you?

I probably would! I can't think of a scenario where as I would not

Welcome to Theism in general and Christianity in particular.

And here is where we disagree; I see Theism in general as evidence A points to conclusion B, but nobody agrees on what B is; and Christianity is just one of countless versions B

Sure , yet, by your criteria, you should believe in A God ( even if you are not sure which one yet).
You have the testimony of BILLIONS ( believers in a God) and the expert opinion of countless of experts ( scholars, theologians).

[Kenny]

So, if those with expert opinion AND a huge consensus of people ( billions) believe that evidence A points to conclusion B, why wouldn't you?

I probably would! I can't think of a scenario where as I would not

Welcome to Theism in general and Christianity in particular.

And here is where we disagree; I see Theism in general as evidence A points to conclusion B, but nobody agrees on what B is; and Christianity is just one of countless versions B

Sure , yet, by your criteria, you should believe in A God ( even if you are not sure which one yet).

It doesn't work that way for me. In order for me to believe "X" is truth, real, the correct answer, etc. etc. I have to first know what "X" is.
[/quote]

[Kenny]

So, if those with expert opinion AND a huge consensus of people ( billions) believe that evidence A points to conclusion B, why wouldn't you?

I probably would! I can't think of a scenario where as I would not

Welcome to Theism in general and Christianity in particular.

And here is where we disagree; I see Theism in general as evidence A points to conclusion B, but nobody agrees on what B is; and Christianity is just one of countless versions B

Sure , yet, by your criteria, you should believe in A God ( even if you are not sure which one yet).

It doesn't work that way for me. In order for me to believe "X" is truth, real, the correct answer, etc. etc. I have to first know what "X" is.

[Kenny]

So, if those with expert opinion AND a huge consensus of people ( billions) believe that evidence A points to conclusion B, why wouldn't you?

I probably would! I can't think of a scenario where as I would not

Welcome to Theism in general and Christianity in particular.

And here is where we disagree; I see Theism in general as evidence A points to conclusion B, but nobody agrees on what B is; and Christianity is just one of countless versions B

Sure , yet, by your criteria, you should believe in A God ( even if you are not sure which one yet).

It doesn't work that way for me. In order for me to believe "X" is truth, real, the correct answer, etc. etc. I have to first know what "X" is.

[Philip]

Ken: And here is where we disagree; I see Theism in general as evidence A points to conclusion B, but nobody agrees on what B is; and Christianity is just one of countless versions B

TOTALLY false! For example, much of the world has pantheistic beliefs - which are totally incompatible with Christian beliefs. And that's just one difference in Christianity and other religious beliefs.

[PaulSacramento]

I probably would! I can't think of a scenario where as I would not

Welcome to Theism in general and Christianity in particular.

And here is where we disagree; I see Theism in general as evidence A points to conclusion B, but nobody agrees on what B is; and Christianity is just one of countless versions B

Sure , yet, by your criteria, you should believe in A God ( even if you are not sure which one yet).

It doesn't work that way for me. In order for me to believe "X" is truth, real, the correct answer, etc. etc. I have to first know what "X" is.

Do you feel that way about quantum mechanics?

[Kenny]

Ken: And here is where we disagree; I see Theism in general as evidence A points to conclusion B, but nobody agrees on what B is; and Christianity is just one of countless versions B

Philip: TOTALLY false! For example, much of the world has pantheistic beliefs - which are totally incompatible with Christian beliefs. And that's just one difference in Christianity and other religious beliefs.

All the other religions have something about it that is totally incompatible with Christian beliefs; how does this point you made refute what I said?

[Byblos]

Ken: And here is where we disagree; I see Theism in general as evidence A points to conclusion B, but nobody agrees on what B is; and Christianity is just one of countless versions B

TOTALLY false! For example, much of the world has pantheistic beliefs - which are totally incompatible with Christian beliefs. And that's just one difference in Christianity and other religious beliefs.

All the other religions have something about it that is totally incompatible with Christian beliefs; how does this point you made refute what I said?

Reason alone necessarily leads to monotheism (A). From there it's reason coupled with revelation that lead to B. You're forever conflating the 2, hence discussions with you seem to always lead to C (nowhere).