Reasons to Believe Biochemist on Covid-19 Vaccines' Safety

[RickD]

Now we’re starting to see that those most vulnerable to Covid-19, can also be the most vulnerable to the vaccine.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nydail ... utType=amp

Safe and effective?

[Philip]

Does it shock you that people over 80 with serious conditions might be pushed over the edge with a vaccine? Just about ANY serious virus or flu could do the same thing to such people. And this is not happening widespread. Think Covid itself wouldn't likely kill such people - first, think of the many thousands, in just the U.S., that have died when they caught Covid (almost 400,000) - and then one can apply a more dire analysis of this isolated cluster. Rick, I think you expect 100% guarantee for some vaccine - not gonna happen! Think of the vast thousands of U.S. elderly who Covid sealed their fate - and millions of them worldwide.

[RickD]

Does it shock you that people over 80 with serious conditions might be pushed over the edge with a vaccine?

Why would it shock me? I’m not the one claiming vaccines are safe.

Just about ANY serious virus or flu could do the same thing to such people. And this is not happening widespread.

Not widespread YET. The elderly are just beginning to be vaccinated for this.

Rick, I think you expect 100% guarantee for some vaccine - not gonna happen!

You must have me mistaken for someone who
claims that vaccines, especially the Covid-19 vaccines, are safe and effective.

Think of the vast thousands of U.S. elderly who Covid sealed their fate - and millions of them worldwide.

I do think of it. And I also think of those who claim the Covid-19 vaccine is safe for the most vulnerable group.

[Philip]

Rick, all I can say is, you better hope and pray that you are wrong, and that these vaccines ARE an important step into greatly diminishing this. Million of Christians around the globe have been praying for a solution - do you think God will NEVER show us a way? Or are we just to trust in dumb luck? And if He does, when will you trust it - when the clouds part and God says, "It's OK." In the distant past, pandemics that killed vast numbers just kept going until they mysteriously ended. And I wonder how long your job will be safe if you continue to hold out?

[RickD]

Rick, all I can say is, you better hope and pray that you are wrong, and that these vaccines are a important step into greatly diminishing this.

Wrong? I haven’t made any claims! I said that there’s no long term safety data, so I don’t know if the vaccine is going to be safe.

Million of Christians around the glove have been praying for a solution - do you think God will NEVER show us a way?

I wish I knew an answer to that Philip. Seeing that both Pfizer and Moderna used aborted cell lines for testing of their vaccines, I’m certainly not going to claim these vaccines are a gift from God. I’m not really an “end justifies the means” kind of guy.

Or are we just to trust in dumb luck?

Maybe it is just dumb luck Phil. I’ve been exposed to Covid patients for the last year, and I haven’t gotten sick. Last Tuesday, in that day alone, I was exposed to at least 56 Covid positive patients. Will dumb luck still be on my side?

In the distant past, pandemics that killed vast numbers just kept going until they mysteriously ended.

And this one will eventually come to an end too.
Hopefully sooner, rather than later.

And I wonder how long your job will be safe if you continue to hold out?

Philip, I have the antibodies. The cdc says they’re shooting for herd immunity which is a combination of those vaccinated, and those with natural antibodies. My hospital has pretty much been mirroring whatever the cdc says. If I lose my job because I don’t get a vaccine, then God will continue to provide as He always has.

There is no reason for someone to get the vaccine if their body has already been exposed to the virus, and has fought it off.

Like I have said before, each person has to decide for himself if he wants the vaccine. I just hope people will do their own research.

[Stu]

Have you guys heard of Anti-Body Dependent Enhancement?
Well if you haven't I suggest you read up.

Basically the vaccine can exacerbate the symptoms and outcome and make things much worse rather than better.

In 2005 they done a study on SARS-CoV and the animals that were given the vaccine actually died. I can't find that study but have included a link to another article.

Wait and see seems like it might be a good idea given this info.

Antibody-dependent enhancement and SARS-CoV-2 vaccines and therapies

Here's the abstract.

Abstract
Antibody-based drugs and vaccines against severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) are being expedited through preclinical and clinical development. Data from the study of SARS-CoV and other respiratory viruses suggest that anti-SARS-CoV-2 antibodies could exacerbate COVID-19 through antibody-dependent enhancement (ADE). Previous respiratory syncytial virus and dengue virus vaccine studies revealed human clinical safety risks related to ADE, resulting in failed vaccine trials. Here, we describe key ADE mechanisms and discuss mitigation strategies for SARS-CoV-2 vaccines and therapies in development. We also outline recently published data to evaluate the risks and opportunities for antibody-based protection against SARS-CoV-2.

[RickD]

Stu,

Thanks for posting that! I’m troubled, but not surprised that I’ve never heard of ADE. If our government and vaccine makers were being open and honest, we should’ve heard about this.

Here’s another article that may be on more Layman terms.
https://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/a ... nhancement

It’ll be interesting to see what happens in the coming months from these vaccines.

[Stu]

Stu,

Thanks for posting that! I’m troubled, but not surprised that I’ve never heard of ADE. If our government and vaccine makers were being open and honest, we should’ve heard about this.

Here’s another article that may be on more Layman terms.
https://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/a ... nhancement

It’ll be interesting to see what happens in the coming months from these vaccines.

Thanks, will read when I have some time.

Yeah stuff like that is quite worrying. I'm not saying that people are going start dropping dead when they become infected and have had the vaccine, but if past studies are anything to go by then it could happen.

Like you have said, we don't have any long term data for these vaccines so anything is possible. All I know is that we are living in scary times and knowing what the right thing to do is is getting quite tricky.

[Stu]

Something else that you guys might be interested in.

There is evidence that hydroxychloroquine DOES work to combat Covid-19.
Here is a 2005 study that shows as much. Don't use Google if you are going to do a search, use www.duckduckgo.com

Chloroquine is a potent inhibitor of SARS coronavirus infection and spread

If you know someone that has Covid or you have Covid, take hydroxychloroquine, it cannot hurt if you (not sure about pregnant women, please consult your doctor) take the right dose, people have been taking it for 20 years.

Don't believe everything you hear or see on the mainstream media.

HUGE! Results from Breaking Chloroquine Study Show 100% Cure Rate for Patients Infected with the Coronavirus

[Stu]

Stu,

Thanks for posting that! I’m troubled, but not surprised that I’ve never heard of ADE. If our government and vaccine makers were being open and honest, we should’ve heard about this.

Here’s another article that may be on more Layman terms.
https://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/a ... nhancement

It’ll be interesting to see what happens in the coming months from these vaccines.

Thanks, interesting article. So essentially to sum it up, "so far, so good".

I still don't know if I want to be a guinea pig in terms of the long term effects of the vaccines. ADE is still a possibility we just don't know.

[Philip]

Found out this morning my little sisters both have Covid - one tested positive and the other is likely, due to constant proximity - they are twins and live together.

[RickD]

Found out this morning my little sisters both have Covid - one tested positive and the other is likely, due to constant proximity - they are twins and live together.

Your younger sisters? That means they’re how old, like 85?

[Stu]

Found out this morning my little sisters both have Covid - one tested positive and the other is likely, due to constant proximity - they are twins and live together.

Sorry to hear man, it can be a real shock to the system to find out you are positive.

I don't know if you are familiar with it but try get them on hydroxychloroquine, there is evidence that it has a very high success rate. It can't hurt to try as people have been using it for 50 years.

[Philip]

Thanks, Stu - I'll look into it. Weird thing is, they had been pretty careful about precautions, don't go out too much. This stuff just really sucks!

[Stu]

Thanks, Stu - I'll look into it. Weird thing is, they had been pretty careful about precautions, don't go out too much. This stuff just really sucks!

Someone just gave me this link, maybe your sisters can try it. It seems it has been use for a long time so is probably safe to use.

Quebec researchers say they have found an effective drug to fight COVID-19