ok my faith has been shaken
ok my faith has been shaken
i know that God exist, but stupid little storys like this get my faith down, i heard someone who died few a few minutes came back too life and said there was no heaven or hell, i know thats stupid to start having doubts over that, but does that mean God doesnt show everyone heaven or hell, or does it mean he doesnt exist?
-
Religious Fanatic
- Familiar Member
- Posts: 27
- Joined: Fri Dec 09, 2005 10:26 pm
- Christian: No
- Location: God's Brothel (Church)
RE:
You're letting your faith be shaken because this person didn't experience an NDE? Even the so-called 'Near Death Experiences' are highly questionable as to their validity and many christians will even tell you this.
They are not real, either.
They are not real, either.
-
SUGAAAAA
- Established Member
- Posts: 224
- Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2005 3:42 pm
- Christian: No
- Location: California
how valid is that story? also note thats its physically impossible for a person to die and come back to life (unless it were an act of God) otherwise that person wasnt really dead.
however I have heard a story of a guy who died, was prayed for by a Pastor, came back to life screaming "IM IN HELL!!" and ran to a church to get baptized. I wasnt really there to witness the event but the person who i heard it from, well, lets just say he doesnt lie.
however I have heard a story of a guy who died, was prayed for by a Pastor, came back to life screaming "IM IN HELL!!" and ran to a church to get baptized. I wasnt really there to witness the event but the person who i heard it from, well, lets just say he doesnt lie.
Rice is great if you're really hungry and want to eat two thousand of something.
I know, but what about those who say they were fully 'dead' and came back too life after a few minutes?SUGAAAAA wrote:how valid is that story? also note thats its physically impossible for a person to die and come back to life (unless it were an act of God) otherwise that person wasnt really dead.
Ive heard that story on alot of sites toohowever I have heard a story of a guy who died, was prayed for by a Pastor, came back to life screaming "IM IN HELL!!" and ran to a church to get baptized. I wasnt really there to witness the event but the person who i heard it from, well, lets just say he doesnt lie.
-
Religious Fanatic
- Familiar Member
- Posts: 27
- Joined: Fri Dec 09, 2005 10:26 pm
- Christian: No
- Location: God's Brothel (Church)
RE:
Guys, this story has been shown to be a hoax with no backing evidence at all.however I have heard a story of a guy who died, was prayed for by a Pastor, came back to life screaming "IM IN HELL!!" and ran to a church to get baptized. I wasnt really there to witness the event but the person who i heard it from, well, lets just say he doesnt lie.
It's not even good to put your faith in fallible pop-fairytales like this one.
Re: RE:
i never completly believed it anyway. Just thought it was possible, but i dont think it would have been, because if it ha happened then this man would have had an unfair advantage, he didnt believe in God because he wanted to but only because he didnt want to go to hell, so i dont think it would have been true.Religious Fanatic wrote:Guys, this story has been shown to be a hoax with no backing evidence at all.however I have heard a story of a guy who died, was prayed for by a Pastor, came back to life screaming "IM IN HELL!!" and ran to a church to get baptized. I wasnt really there to witness the event but the person who i heard it from, well, lets just say he doesnt lie.
It's not even good to put your faith in fallible pop-fairytales like this one.
-
Jac3510
- Ultimate Member
- Posts: 5472
- Joined: Tue Aug 03, 2004 6:53 pm
- Christian: Yes
- Sex: Male
- Creation Position: Young-Earth Creationist
- Location: Fort Smith, AR
- Contact:
Jay, I can understand your concern. In the end, we can ask all day long, "Why would THAT shake your faith?" but in the end, it doesn't matter. What matters is that it did. So, how can we fix it?
First, let's start with the idea that all the NDE's, as nice as they sound, are just nice stories. Some are very convincing, but I would encourage you to google "Near Death Experiences" and see what happens. There are pages that are devoted specifically to the stories of people who have had them. Now, I don't read the accounts and say they all lie. In fact, I believe most of what people have written on the issue, so far as personal experience goes. But, what you will find is that there are so many conflicting accounts, that the obvious conclusion is that what people experienced is not objective reality, but rather something subjective. It happened to them because of the way they are wired. In other words, if people claim they went to heaven, they really didn't. They had an experience that they thought was heaven. Probably, that experience was nothing more than neurons firing off in their brain and exciting certain preconceived notions . . . it's very much like a dream. Have you ever been studying hard for a test ALL DAY LONG, and then you go to sleep dreaming about the subject? I wouldn't say that NDE's are all that different. Of course, that doesn't mean people will always have one. After all, you don't always dream about the test when you've been studying for it, do you?
So a little research into NDE's can calm your concerns there, but what about proactive approaches? I can tell you that there are certain things that I don't understand, but they don't challenge my faith anymore. The reason is that I can't stop believing if I want to. I did a very serious study on the Resurrection accounts of Jesus Christ, and unless I decide to make some wild assumptions, basic logic tells me that He HAD to have risen from the dead. Now, despite what people may say, if Jesus rose from the dead, Christianity is true!
I would recommend getting into some basic apologetics. Start with the easy stuff. C. S. Lewis' Mere Christianity and Lee Strobel's The Case for Christ are probably the easiest readings and clearest explanations of two approaches to a rational defense of the Christian faith. Then, start working your way up. You'll find in no time that Christianity is rational, and to be honest, it is the only world view that makes sense. Everything else is just idiotic--no exageration intended.
God bless
Oh, and one more thing: James 1:5-8 saysm "If any of you lacks wisdom, he should ask God, who gives generously to all without finding fault, and it will be given to him. But when he asks, he must believe and not doubt, because he who doubts is like a wave of the sea, blown and tossed by the wind. That man should not think he will receive anything from the Lord; he is a double-minded man, unstable in all he does." If you have questions, go to God. Ask Him to show you Himself, and He will . . . Bible promises so
First, let's start with the idea that all the NDE's, as nice as they sound, are just nice stories. Some are very convincing, but I would encourage you to google "Near Death Experiences" and see what happens. There are pages that are devoted specifically to the stories of people who have had them. Now, I don't read the accounts and say they all lie. In fact, I believe most of what people have written on the issue, so far as personal experience goes. But, what you will find is that there are so many conflicting accounts, that the obvious conclusion is that what people experienced is not objective reality, but rather something subjective. It happened to them because of the way they are wired. In other words, if people claim they went to heaven, they really didn't. They had an experience that they thought was heaven. Probably, that experience was nothing more than neurons firing off in their brain and exciting certain preconceived notions . . . it's very much like a dream. Have you ever been studying hard for a test ALL DAY LONG, and then you go to sleep dreaming about the subject? I wouldn't say that NDE's are all that different. Of course, that doesn't mean people will always have one. After all, you don't always dream about the test when you've been studying for it, do you?
So a little research into NDE's can calm your concerns there, but what about proactive approaches? I can tell you that there are certain things that I don't understand, but they don't challenge my faith anymore. The reason is that I can't stop believing if I want to. I did a very serious study on the Resurrection accounts of Jesus Christ, and unless I decide to make some wild assumptions, basic logic tells me that He HAD to have risen from the dead. Now, despite what people may say, if Jesus rose from the dead, Christianity is true!
I would recommend getting into some basic apologetics. Start with the easy stuff. C. S. Lewis' Mere Christianity and Lee Strobel's The Case for Christ are probably the easiest readings and clearest explanations of two approaches to a rational defense of the Christian faith. Then, start working your way up. You'll find in no time that Christianity is rational, and to be honest, it is the only world view that makes sense. Everything else is just idiotic--no exageration intended.
God bless
Oh, and one more thing: James 1:5-8 saysm "If any of you lacks wisdom, he should ask God, who gives generously to all without finding fault, and it will be given to him. But when he asks, he must believe and not doubt, because he who doubts is like a wave of the sea, blown and tossed by the wind. That man should not think he will receive anything from the Lord; he is a double-minded man, unstable in all he does." If you have questions, go to God. Ask Him to show you Himself, and He will . . . Bible promises so
And that, brothers and sisters, is the kind of foolishness you get people who insist on denying biblical theism. A good illustration of any as the length people will go to avoid acknowledging basic truths.Proinsias wrote:I don't think you are hearing me. Preference for ice cream is a moral issue
I have no idea, anyway i was just saying, if someone thought God showed them heaven or hell that would sort of force them too believe in God, kind of like an unfair advantage.Fortigurn wrote:How would you know it was 'hell'?Jay_7 wrote:Well if you think you 'saw' hell then you'll obviously believe in God.Fortigurn wrote:How would the absence of heaven or hell going actually affect your belief in God?