mathmystic wrote:Interestingly you offer absolutely nothing to refute the simple systemic argument above as to the impossibility of an “Intelligent Designer” that can be studied in the science classroom.
I believe in God, but not a scientifically provable God. Proof precludes the need for faith. Faith is necessary simply because there is no proof.
Reading through your comments, though it appears you think of God as a “rational God” who thinks like humans — designing things like we might do.
I don't believe in a God who thinks like humans, however. This seems to me how we differ.
B. W wrote:Every experiment used to prove evolutionary processes was made by someone who had intelligently designed the test/experiment. Therefore, intelligent design is probable.
Next, Mathematical probability reveals that some things are just impossible to just happen. Remember, Darwin intelligently developed his theory and others adapted to it as well.
Also Physics / Mathematics prove there is an order to the universe — a measurable design.
Being able to deduce these equations / formulas takes intelligence. Intelligence of itself proves design. If these things exist, and there is a design and pattern to the entire natural world as well as mathematics, then there must be a head designer somewhere desiring to engage our own intelligence for some intention.
Just the fact we can use our intelligence to attempt to prove or disprove God existence reveals another measurable means to note intelligent design at work. If our own intelligence exists, so can, in all probability, another far greater intelligent designer, or designers, also exist due to the design and pattern of the entire natural world as well as mathematics.
Therefore, from our own existence and arguments we can note two great intelligent designers at work: one designer with intelligence busy blinding people to reject God's existence and another intelligent designer busy revealing that He, God, does indeed exist. How? by engaging our human intelligence.
What camp do you choose to reside? - One that rejects God rationally well? Or one that rationally accepts God as He is? If one rationally or irrationally rejects, God, why would God want to live next to you forever?
Where do you want to reside? You and I have a 50/50 chance to make the correct intelligent decision. Why make the wrong one that offers no return?
You claim, “that I have - absolutely nothing to refute the simple systemic argument above as to the impossibility of an “Intelligent Designer” that can be studied in the science classroom.”
In this you err,
Every experiment used to prove evolutionary processes was made by someone who had intelligently designed the test/experiment. Therefore, intelligent design is probable because each test proves the need for someone with intelligence to plan and create the test/experiment using some design and method.
Physics / Mathematics / Biology / Earth and Atmospheric sciences all prove there is an order to the universe — a measurable design. Lets toss is chemistry, pharmacology, and a host of other science disciplines. These detect design, patterns all around us. The problem resides not with the data but rather how one's intelligence interprets this data. Herein lies the construct of error: biased intelligence.
It is amazing how brilliant man and women go to such great lengths to interpret that the orderly data of the universe proves no intelligent design, no God, because it cannot be tested. It has — but reading the data through rose colored glasses prevents one from seeing anything except their own exalted intelligence.
If the evidence — hard core evidence can be read and deciphered — then what is the conclusion? All creation was fashioned with an intelligent design in mind. Therefore what else can you deduce? I guess that ...
People hate God and want nothing to do with Him. People deny God so they cannot be held responsible for their own actions and justify how they personally live. People acknowledge a form of God that is impotent so they can claim they have a form of godliness based on their great intelligence and works. Or a few people who acknowledge God and simply accept Him by faith concerning all He is and all He does. These see the data that all creation displays and thus return to God on God's terms.
Romans1:18-23 — was written before Darwin, before all the advancements of modern science, and its truth still rings true for today…
“For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them. For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse, because, although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful, but became futile in their thoughts, and their foolish hearts were darkened. Professing to be wise, they became fools, and changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like corruptible man—and birds and four-footed animals and creeping things.” NKJV
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