John Calvin

[SUGAAAAA]

was he a murderer?

[B. W.]

was he a murderer?

Was St. Paul? Would it matter if Calvn was or was not?

I am looking into the historical record of Calvin in Geneva for another thread on forum. Maybe you can help dig up what happened there and post it?

[B. W.]

Here is more on Calvin quoted from this web site:

http://www.biblelife.org/calvinism.htm

Calvin's Reign of Terror

After some negotiation, Ami Perrin, commissioner for Geneva, persuaded Calvin to return. He did so, though unwillingly, on September 13, 1541. His entry was modest. Geneva was a church-city-state of 15,000 people, and the church constitution now recognized "pastors, doctors, elders and deacons," but the supreme power was given to the magistrate, John Calvin. In November 1552, the Council declared Calvin's Institutes to be a "holy doctrine which no man might speak against." Thus the State issued dogmatic decrees, the force of which had been anticipated earlier, as when Jacques Gruet, a known opponent of Calvin, was arrested, tortured for a month and beheaded on July 26, 1547, for placing a letter in Calvin's pulpit calling him a hypocrite. Gruet's book was later found and burned along with his house while his wife was thrown out into the street to watch. Gruet's death was more highly criticized by far than the banishment of Castellio or the penalties inflicted on Bolsec -- moderate men opposed to extreme views in discipline and doctrine, who fell under suspicion as reactionary. Calvin did not shrink from his self-appointed task. Within five years fifty-eight sentences of death and seventy-six of exile, besides numerous committals of the most eminent citizens to prison, took place in Geneva. The iron yoke could not be shaken off. In 1555, under Ami Perrin, a revolt was attempted. No blood was shed, but Perrin lost the day, and Calvin's theocracy triumphed. John Calvin had secured his grip on Geneva by defeating the very man, Ami Perrin, commissioner of Geneva, who had invited him there.
John Calvin - Enpsychlopedia.

Calvin forced the citizens of Geneva to attend church services under a heavy threat of punishment. Since Calvinism falsely teaches that God forces the elect to believe, it is no wonder that Calvin thought he could also force the citizens of Geneva to all become the elect. Not becoming one of the elect was punishable by death or expulsion from Geneva. Calvin exercised forced regeneration on the citizens of Geneva because that is what his theology teaches.

Michael Servetus, a Spaniard, a physician, a scientist and a Bible scholar was born in Villanova in 1511. He was credited with the discovery of the pulmonary circulation of the blood from the right chamber of the heart through the lungs and back to the left chamber of the heart. He was Calvin's longtime friend in their earlier resistance against the Roman Catholic Church. Servetus, while living in Vienne (historic city in southeastern France), angered Calvin by returning a copy of Calvin's writings, Institutes, with critical comments in the margins. Servetus was arrested by the Roman Catholic Authorities on April 4 but escaped on April 7, 1553. He traveled to Geneva where he attended Calvin's Sunday preaching service on August 13. Calvin promptly had Servetus arrested and charged with heresy for his disagreement with Calvin's theology. The thirty-eight official charges included rejection of the Trinity and infant baptism. Servetus was correct in challenging Calvin's false teaching about infant baptism leading to salvation, but he was heretical in his rejection of the doctrine of the Trinity. Servetus pleaded to be beheaded instead of the more brutal method of burning at the stake, but Calvin and the city council refused the quicker death method. Other Protestant churches throughout Switzerland advised Calvin that Servetus be condemned but not executed. Calvin ignored their pleas and Servetus was burned at the stake on October 27, 1553. Servetus was screaming as he was literally baked alive from the feet upward and suffered the heat of the flames for 30 minutes before finally succumbing to one of the most painful and brutal death methods possible. Servetus had written a theology book, a copy of which Calvin had strapped to the chest of Servetus. The flames from the burning book rose against Servetus' face as he screamed in agony.

John Calvin was proud of his killing of Servetus, bragging and celebrating. Many theological and state leaders criticized Calvin for the unwarranted killing of Servetus, but it fell on deaf ears as Calvin advised others to do the same. Calvin wrote much in following years in a continual attempt to justify his burning of Servetus. Some people claim Calvin favored beheading, but this does not fit charges of heresy for which the punishment as written by Calvin earlier was to be burning at the stake. Calvin had made a vow years earlier that Servetus would never leave Geneva alive if he were ever captured, and Calvin held true to his pledge.

Another victim of Calvin's fiery zeal was Gentile of an Italian sect in Geneva, which also numbered among its adherents Alciati and Gribaldo. More or less Unitarian in their views, they were required to sign a confession drawn up by Calvin in 1558. Gentile signed it reluctantly, but in the upshot he was condemned and imprisoned as a perjurer. He escaped only to be twice incarcerated at Berne where, in 1566, he was beheaded. Calvin also had thirty-four (34) women burned at the stake after accusing them of causing a plague that had swept through Geneva in 1545. John Calvin's actions were very paganistic like his mentor, Saint Augustine. Jesus and all of the Apostles would have abhorred and condemn these blatant mass murders.
Puritanism.

The citizens of Geneva hated John Calvin as he clearly stated. In 1554 Calvin wrote "Dogs bark at me on all sides. Everywhere I am saluted with the name of 'heretic,' and all the calumnies that can possibly be invented are heaped upon me; in a word, the enemies among my own flock attack me with greater bitterness than my declared enemies among the papists." Calvin, quoted in Schaff, History, volume 8, page 496. The history of John Calvin's reign of terror in Geneva is undisputed. Calvin himself had historical records kept that have survived to this day.

John Calvin had no love, no compassion, no patience and no tolerance for those who did not believe his Institutes. Criticism of Calvin's Institutes was considered heresy for which the sentence was death by burning at the stake. To his dying day Calvin preached and taught from his works. By no means an aged man, he was worn out in these frequent controversies. On April 25, 1564, he made his will, leaving 225 French crowns, of which he bequeathed ten to his college, ten to the poor, and the remainder to his nephews and nieces. His last letter was addressed to Farel. He was buried without pomp in a spot which is not now ascertainable. In the year 1900 a monument of expiation was erected to Servetus in the Place Champel. Geneva has long since ceased to be the head of Calvinism.

John Calvin's murder of people who held different doctrinal views, his failure to acknowledge or repent from his sins, his incomplete gospel, his placing of his own writings above the Bible, his distortion of God and the Scriptures, and his dependence upon infant baptism places into question his salvation. In all of his writings is not found a clear declaration of his salvation by faith in the birth, life, crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus Christ our Lord and Savior. Calvin was a cruel, murderous, tyrant who considered himself to be the pope of Geneva. The Bible never advocates harming an individual due to his unbelief or lack of understanding. Jesus taught to "turn the other cheek" instead. None of the Apostles taught action against unbelievers but instead taught the believer to seek them out to present the gospel in love.

[Jac3510]

More from wikipedia:

• Calvin's acceptance of torture in particular is reprehensible. Few persons of any position, courage or religious denomination were critical of the practice, though there certainly were exceptions such as Anton Praetorius.
  
  Calvin and Servetus
  In 1553, the Spanish scholar Michael Servetus (viewed by many Unitarians as a founding figure) was sentenced to death on the stake for the heresy of Antitrinitarianism with Calvin's approval, although he counselled the magistrate without success to mitigate the legal penalty by substituting the sword for the fire. Ironically, Servetus had arrived in Geneva while fleeing from a similar fate at the hands of the French Inquisition. Calvin stood by his position until his death,[3] as did Servetus, who proclaimed his defiance even up to the moment of his death at the stake. Many believe that Servetus' trial and execution were a form of personal revenge for his having snubbed Calvin in a debate years earlier while both men were students at the University of Paris. (See Lawrence and Nancy Goldstone's Out of the Flames, Broadway, 2002).
  
  Calvin and witchcraft
  John Calvin and the other Reformers (as well as Catholics in Middle Europe) believed that they should not permit the practice of witchcraft, in accord with their understanding of passages such as Exodus 22:18 and Leviticus 20:27. Calvin comments on these passages under his analysis of the first of the Ten Commandments, which he understands to condemn the practice of other religions. Of witchcraft in particular, he says, "God would condemn to capital punishment all augurs, and magicians, and consulters with familiar spirits, and necromancers and followers of magic arts, as well as enchanters. And...God declares that He 'will set. His face against all, that shall turn after such as have familiar spirits, and after wizards,' so as to cut them off from His people; and then commands that they should be destroyed by stoning."[4] Following this understanding of the Old Testament law, in 1545 twenty-three people were burned to death after being accused of practicing witchcraft and attempting to spread the Plague over a three year period.[5]

I'd recommend the entire article. It's well written and has a ton of good information.

God bless

[FFC]

Wow! Ye shall know them by their fruit.

[Blacknad]

It's funny but I grew up thinking Calvin was a good 'un.

The same with Martin Luther who was also guilty of reprehensible actions.

Blacknad.

[Locker]

It's funny but I grew up thinking Calvin was a good 'un.

The same with Martin Luther who was also guilty of reprehensible actions.

Blacknad.

Luther was no saint either.

St. Paul consented in the murder of Christians before conversion.

Maybe people are slaves to their times and cultures.

Calvin's crimes were no different from others in that era of time. This does not condone these crimes done in the name of religion but rather not repeat them.

To me - Calvin if alive today - would have created the Christian Taliban and would be termed with those such as David Koresh, Rev. Jones, and a host of misguided heretics.

Did Calvin do any good? Yes, He did. So did Luther and a host of other reformers did too. God will judge them? He has.

There is a bible passage in Isaiah that warned Israel not to be high minded and arongant - not sure the passage location is but we should all heed this warning too.

[puritan lad]

While your at it, you may want to do a little research on the Anabaptist movement before and during Calvin's time. (Hint: They were not the nice peaceful folks that we associate with the movement today). Names such as Thomas Muntzer and John of Leyden. Movement such as the Cathars and the Taborites. With this kind of history, Calvin's actions against Servetus were more than understandable.

(I only bring this up in case this thread was an attempt to smear "Calvinists".)

[B. W.]

While your at it, you may want to do a little research on the Anabaptist movement before and during Calvin's time. (Hint: They were not the nice peaceful folks that we associate with the movement today). Names such as Thomas Muntzer and John of Leyden. Movement such as the Cathars and the Taborites. With this kind of history, Calvin's actions against Servetus were more than understandable.

(I only bring this up in case this thread was an attempt to smear "Calvinists".)

PL, about every Christian group during those eras were guilty of murder and mayhem. It must of been the times in which they lived. Add Luther to the mix too.

It is interesting that the Apostles simply said to let the heretics go and leave then alone and not slay them. They were called to warn about them but not slay them.

In the Old Testament, it decrees the death to heretics, false prophets, and for terribly grievous sins. The Christian groups during and around those times in Calvin's era seemed to readily apply the OT law to those they did not like and fostered resentments. Many of these resentments are still felt today.

Maybe this was an act of evil fostered by Satan to stain the church? Who knows? Tragic, yes! Because of these abuses, many non-Christians fight against the Christian religion with such zeal in our courts, laws, and in the realm of ideas. Amazing!
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[puritan lad]

I agree B.W. Unfortunately, the very label "puritan" seems go conjure up labels as "witch burners", etc. That's probably the extent that most people know about puritanism.

[Grace isn't enough...]

aaaahhggrg my g/f's a calvinist...

It restricts God's Free will by his Omnipotence...whyyy?

*sighs, with a nervous lump in his stomach*

[August]

It restricts God's Free will by his Omnipotence...whyyy?

How is that?

[Canuckster1127]

aaaahhggrg my g/f's a calvinist...

It restricts God's Free will by his Omnipotence...whyyy?

*sighs, with a nervous lump in his stomach*

You're girlfriend's a calvinist? What are you going to do if you're predestined to be with her .....