Jesus is God

[Light of Life]

Hello I am fairly new to this group of people, knowing only one person who I have been going back and forth with on this issue. I came to the site and i read the Jesus is God site. And i beleive i had a good argument that eveyone should hear, so that it is herd because it blows the whole theory out of the water. Ok So i saw that you had all these scriptures lined up and such so that it seems like Jesus is God, but i found two verses in which it is undeniable that there is no way in which Jesus is God. The Verse are these:

Jas 1:13 "Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man"

then this

Mark 1:13 "And he[Jesus] was there in the wilderness forty days, tempted of Satan.."

Now i have already Got the argument that God was tempted many times, but the point i made in respect to that was that God was tempted by his people, not by the devil/evil.


I got another argument, but i cannot remember what it was. I was discussing this with Richard Deem. But just wanted to know your thoughts on it. Because Richard was having difficulty proving me wrong so i thought i would ask the whole group so that my theory could be tried. In my mind this completly "Blows that theory" as richard would say.

[August]

Hi, welcome to the site.

I want to propose an answer, and let's proceed from there.

The greek for tempt here is:
πειράζω
peirazō
pi-rad'-zo
to test (objectively), that is, endeavor, scrutinize, entice, discipline: - assay, examine, go about, prove, tempt (-er), try.
The root of the word is from "test" and the primitive from "to pierce".

I think we agree that God cannot be tempted with evil, right? So why would that be? There must be some moral disorder in order to be tempted, some impurity or shortcoming. Can we again agree that God does not possess any of those shortcomings, which is why He cannot be tempted?

Those shortcomings, which can lead to temptation, are inward manifestations of human imperfection, again, God cannot conceivably possess these. Because these are inward manifestations, human temptations comes from within, from our sinful nature, and connects itself to these imperfections.

In the case of Jesus being tested, it was temptation by external solicitation.

You can see the difference between the two different types of temptation when reading the two passages a bit wider:
(Mar 1:13) And he was in the wilderness forty days, being tempted by Satan. And he was with the wild animals, and the angels were ministering to him.
(Jam 1:13) Let no one say when he is tempted, "I am being tempted by God," for God cannot be tempted with evil, and he himself tempts no one.
(Jam 1:14) But each person is tempted when he is lured and enticed by his own desire.

Jesus clearly was not tempted by His own desire, but by external assault, while the context of James confirms, rather than deny, the fact that temptation that God cannot be tempted with is that from within.

[Light of Life]

Alright, well honestly that told me nothing. No offence but you can go into the greek and all thats cool with me. But all im trying to say is that there is no way that satan could have even been in the presence of God, absolutly no way. If Jesus was God, Satan wouldn't have even tried, nor would he be able to even be tempted becuase he's God. I have no idea which way you are even going if you think he is or isn't but it is undeniable that Jesus is not God

[August]

Alright, well honestly that told me nothing.

Uh, ok. What part did you not understand?

No offence but you can go into the greek and all thats cool with me. But all im trying to say is that there is no way that satan could have even been in the presence of God, absolutly no way.

Scripture please.

If Jesus was God, Satan wouldn't have even tried, nor would he be able to even be tempted becuase he's God.

Do you believe in the gospel message?

I have no idea which way you are even going if you think he is or isn't but it is undeniable that Jesus is not God

Ok, who do you say Jesus is?

[FFC]

Alright, well honestly that told me nothing. No offence but you can go into the greek and all thats cool with me. But all im trying to say is that there is no way that satan could have even been in the presence of God, absolutly no way. If Jesus was God, Satan wouldn't have even tried, nor would he be able to even be tempted becuase he's God. I have no idea which way you are even going if you think he is or isn't but it is undeniable that Jesus is not God

Jesus was completely God, but He was also completely man. His Glory was veiled which enabled him to tempted as we all are tempted so that He could understand and commiserate with what we go through.

Hebrews 14:15 says

"For we have not an high priest which cannot
be touched with the feeling of our infirmities;
but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin."

Jesus, who is God, in His human flesh with His human nature most certainly could be tempted and still be God because it wasn't the God part of Him that was tempted. Satan is much too intelligent to think He could ever tempt God directly.

The same thing goes for his death on the cross. Jesus who was one with the father, equal with God, the representation of God in every way became a sinner for us on the cross, a curse Paul says. It wasn't the god part of Him that became sin, it was His human flesh with it's human nature that did.

I'm sure that won't help because I sense that your mind is already made up, but that is my take on it anyway.

[YLTYLT]

Who is the man speaking in Proverb 8?
Whoever is speaking has a Lord that pocessed (not created) from the beginning before any of the Lords creation had been.
Especially look at verse 35.

Prov 8:18-35
Sounds like Jesus to me.

[Light of Life]

I don't want to make you feel like im on a single tracked mind here or anything. I am open to what ever you have to put forward. All i am saying is that the scripture i gave is plain and simple. You read it and you understand it. There is no need to show off you wisdom, what you see is what you get in this. I know it is nice to believe that Jesus was God, or Man/God. Because it makes us beleive that we cannot overcome sin, because we are just Flesh. And to answer u August what i dont understand is why you have to try to get all in depth with it. Remember that the wisdom of men is foolish to God. So i therefore ask you to give me scriptural proof that Jesus is God; or even half man half God. And don't do that whole Jesus said this and it is the same as what God said buisness like the website. I have read that and the only way that proves anything is if you assume alot of things. The proof i give it clear and easy to understand, black and white. You dont need to assume anything. To think that Jesus can just turn off his God side is grossly nieve. Either you are God or you are Man the two thngs conflict with each other. One is Perfect in all ways, and one is born into sin. So You asked me for scripture of what i said, well you know what i can't. And neither can you. You just throw in some of your own wisdom about shortcomings. So I ask you to give me scriptural proof of your Theory, because i have given mine and you have only been able to give me your wisdom and no scripture. So where in the bible does it say Jesus is God? Please give me your thoughts.

Side note: I thought you guys would like this. You want to know who is the antichrist in the world...

'Hereby know you the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God: 3 And every spirit that confesses not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is the spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.' (1 Jn.2.18; 4.1ff)

Wow! So if you believe that Jesus christ came not in the flesh you are what.

You want to know what your Internation standard Bible encylopedia says about the whole trinity here you go:
' The term "Trinity" is not a Biblical term, and we are not using Bible language when we define what is expressed by it as a doctrine that there is one only and true God, but in the unity of the Godhead there are three coeternal and coequal Personsthe doctrine of the Trinity is given to us in Scripture, not in formulated definition, but in fragmentary allusions...'

Fragmentary allusions huh.. sounds like what your Jesus is God website is, just a bunch of fragmentary illusions.

Just to add to the goodness i have found these scriptures for your mind to boggle over.

Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared; 8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; 9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him.(Heb.5.7ff)

He learned obedience by the things he suffered. If he were God he would know how to be obediant with out having to suffer.

But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man. 10For it became himto make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings

I dont think God is lower than angels.


14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same.(Heb.2:14)

There you have it Jesus is Flesh, and Blood. Just like you and me.

18 For in that he himself has suffered being tempted, he is able to help them that are tempted.(Heb 2:18)

Just to support the fact that Jesus was temted.

Anyways just remember that if you don't beleive that Jesus came in the Flesh YOU ARE THE ANITCHRIST.(1 Jn.2.18; 4.1ff)

Sorry if i seem disgruntled, but if you can give me any evidence with scripture provided that Jesus was God, or half man half God please do so because i would love to see it and don't give me any of those fragmentary allusions (smile)

Be happy. Im not trying to make you look like a fool, im just telling you that some of these beleifs are foolish because their is really no proof that Jesus is God.

[Light of Life]

YLTYLT

Call me stupid. But where are you going with that. Are you trying to say that Jesus was there in the beginning of time. If so i want to add in verse 35 when it says "For whosoever findeth me findeth Life.." It is talking about you actually being alive. because in Gods eyes when you sin you are dead, therefore if you find Jesus, who is the word of God, then you find life. if you need scripture to back up my statments just ask and you shall receive (smile)

[Light of Life]

The same thing goes for his death on the cross. Jesus who was one with the father, equal with God, the representation of God in every way became a sinner for us on the cross, a curse Paul says. It wasn't the god part of Him that became sin, it was His human flesh with it's human nature that did.

I just read what you wrote and it really shocked me. So you say that Jesus sinned. Well first off what you wrote is one of those inconsistancies that i love so much. You are saying that Jesus' Human side sinned, well first find me scriptural proof where jesus sinned. Secondly If he did sin, how could he be even part God. The statment you made is very interesting because you say he sinned therefore he is imperfect, but he is God also. If God is perfect how can he be imperfect also. Please tell me how that works. And if Jesus' Godly part was hidden behind a veil please give me scripture to back that up.

[FFC]

The same thing goes for his death on the cross. Jesus who was one with the father, equal with God, the representation of God in every way became a sinner for us on the cross, a curse Paul says. It wasn't the god part of Him that became sin, it was His human flesh with it's human nature that did.

I just read what you wrote and it really shocked me. So you say that Jesus sinned. Well first off what you wrote is one of those inconsistancies that i love so much. You are saying that Jesus' Human side sinned, well first find me scriptural proof where jesus sinned. Secondly If he did sin, how could he be even part God. The statment you made is very interesting because you say he sinned therefore he is imperfect, but he is God also. If God is perfect how can he be imperfect also. Please tell me how that works. And if Jesus' Godly part was hidden behind a veil please give me scripture to back that up.

2Cr 5:21 For he hath made him [to be] sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Gal 3:13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed [is] every one that hangeth on a tree:

Did I say Jesus ever sinned? No. I said he became a sinner for us on the cross. You really need to read more carefully. This may be a big part of your problem. You come with guns blazing and your accusations flying, only to keep your flawed theology going. Be a little more open minded. It goes a long way.






Phl 2:5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:


Phl 2:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:


Phl 2:7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:


Phl 2:8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.


Phl 2:9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:


Phl 2:10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of [things] in heaven, and [things] in earth, and [things] under the earth;


Phl 2:11 And [that] every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ [is] Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

Did I blow you away?

[Gman]

You want to know what your Internation standard Bible encylopedia says about the whole trinity here you go:

Just curious, this sounds like either the Jehovah Witnesses, Way International, or CES teachings. Which one are you? I also use to struggle with the Trinity after learning from these groups, but now I accept the Trinity.

If you could tell me, maybe I could help..

Gman

[August]

Hang on there, friend. Why don't you answer my simple questions?
1. Do you believe in the gospel message?
2. Who do you say Jesus was?

I don't want to make you feel like im on a single tracked mind here or anything. I am open to what ever you have to put forward. All i am saying is that the scripture i gave is plain and simple. You read it and you understand it. There is no need to show off you wisdom, what you see is what you get in this. I know it is nice to believe that Jesus was God, or Man/God. Because it makes us beleive that we cannot overcome sin, because we are just Flesh. And to answer u August what i dont understand is why you have to try to get all in depth with it.

So let me get this straight. You come here with 2 passages from Scripture which you claim shows that Jesus is not God. When you hear the explanation on why you are wrong, that suddenly becomes too "in depth" for you? I already asked you which part of my explanation you didn't get, and you did not bother to reply.

Remember that the wisdom of men is foolish to God.

Are you saying I am a fool?

So i therefore ask you to give me scriptural proof that Jesus is God; or even half man half God. And don't do that whole Jesus said this and it is the same as what God said buisness like the website. I have read that and the only way that proves anything is if you assume alot of things. The proof i give it clear and easy to understand, black and white.

No sweetheart, you are not understanding the black and white you are reading. You are the one assuming that the one is like the other, which they are not, as I explained already.

You dont need to assume anything. To think that Jesus can just turn off his God side is grossly nieve.

So who was Jesus? Please show from Scripture.

Either you are God or you are Man the two thngs conflict with each other. One is Perfect in all ways, and one is born into sin. So You asked me for scripture of what i said, well you know what i can't.

Oops.

And neither can you. You just throw in some of your own wisdom about shortcomings. So I ask you to give me scriptural proof of your Theory, because i have given mine and you have only been able to give me your wisdom and no scripture. So where in the bible does it say Jesus is God? Please give me your thoughts.

Oops again. Here you go:
Jesus as Jehovah. Isaiah 40:3; Matthew 3:3
• Jehovah of glory. Psalm 24:7; Psalm 24:10; 1 Cor. 2:8; James 2:1
• Jehovah our righteousness. Jeremiah 23:5-6; 1 Cor. 1:30
• Jehovah above all. Psalm 97:9; John 3:31
• Jehovah the first and the last.
• 1. Isaiah 44:6; Rev. 1:1-20
• 2. Isaiah 48:12-16; Rev. 22:13
• Jehovah's fellow and equal. Zech. 13:7; Phil. 2:6
• Jehovah of hosts.
• 1. Isaiah 6:1-3; John 12:1-50
• 2. Isaiah 8:13-14; 1 Peter 2:8
• Jehovah. Psalm 110:1; Matthew 22:42-45
• Jehovah the shepherd. Isaiah 40:10-11; Hebrews 13:20
• Jehovah, for whose glory all things were created. Proverbs 16:4; Col. 1:16
• Jehovah the messenger of the covenant. Malachi 3:1; Luke 2:27
• Invoked as Jehovah. Joel 2:32; 1 Cor. 1:2
• Invoked as the eternal God and Creator. Psalm 102:24-27; Hebrews 1:8; Hebrews 1:10-12
• Invoked as the mighty God. Isaiah 9:6
• Invoked as the great God and Saviour. Hosea 1:7; Titus 2:13
• Invoked as God over all. Romans 9:5
• Invoked as God the Judge. Eccles. 12:14; 1 Cor. 4:5; 2 Cor. 5:10; 2 Tim. 4:1
• Invoked as Emmanuel. Isaiah 7:14; Matthew 1:23
• Invoked as King of kings and Lord of lords. Daniel 10:17; Rev. 1:5; Rev. 17:14
• Invoked as the Holy One. 1 Samuel 2:2; Acts 3:14
• Invoked as the Lord from heaven. 1 Cor. 15:47
• Invoked as Lord of the Sabbath. Genesis 2:3; Matthew 12:8
• Invoked as Lord of all. Acts 10:36; Romans 10:11-13
• Invoked as Son of God. Matthew 26:63-67
• Invoked as the only begotten Son of the Father. John 1:14; John 1:18; John 3:16; John 3:18; 1 John 4:9
• His blood is called the blood of God. Acts 20:28
• One with the Father. John 10:30; John 10:38; John 12:45; John 14:7-10; John 17:10
• As sending the Spirit equally with the Father. John 14:16; John 15:26
• As unsearchable equally with the Father. Proverbs 30:4; Matthew 11:27
• As Creator of all things. Isaiah 40:28; John 1:3; Col. 1:16
• As supporter and preserver of all things. Neh. 9:6; Col. 1:17; Hebrews 1:3
• Acknowledged by Old Testament saints. Genesis 17:1; Genesis 32:24-30; Genesis 48:15-16; Judges 6:22-24; Judges 13:21-22; Job 19:25-27; Hosea 12:3-5
Random Scriptures dealing with the trinity and the deity of Jesus:
Genesis 1:1; Exodus 23:20-21; Numbers 21:6; Psalm 24:10; Psalm 45:6-7; Psalm 102:1-14; Psalm 102:24-27; Psalm 110:1; Isaiah 6:1; Isaiah 7:14; Isaiah 8:13-14; Isaiah 9:6; Isaiah 40:3; Isaiah 40:9-10; Malachi 3:1; Matthew 1:23; Matthew 3:3; Matthew 8:29; Matthew 9:6; Matthew 11:10; Matthew 22:43-45; Matthew 28:17-18; Mark 5:6-7; Luke 4:12; Luke 4:33-34; Luke 8:28; Luke 9:43-44; John 1:1-2; John 5:17-18; John 5:21-23; John 10:30-33; John 12:41; John 12:45; John 20:28; Acts 7:37-39; Acts 20:28; Romans 1:7; Romans 9:5; 1 Cor. 1:3; 1 Cor. 2:8; 1 Cor. 8:6; 1 Cor. 10:9; 1 Cor. 15:47; 2 Cor. 1:2; Galatians 1:1; Galatians 1:3; Ephes. 1:2; Ephes. 6:23-24; Phil. 1:2; Phil. 2:5-11; Col. 1:2; 1 Thes. 1:1; 1 Thes. 3:11; 2 Thes. 1:1-2; 2 Thes. 2:16-17; 1 Tim. 3:16; 2 Tim. 1:2; Titus 2:13; Hebrews 1:8; Hebrews 1:10; 1 Peter 2:8; 1 John 5:20;Genesis 1:26; Genesis 3:22; Isaiah 6:3; Isaiah 6:8; Isaiah 11:2-3; Isaiah 42:1; Isaiah 48:16; Isaiah 61:1-3; Isaiah 63:9-10; Matthew 1:18; Matthew 1:20; Matthew 3:11; Matthew 3:16; Matthew 12:18; Matthew 12:28; Matthew 28:19; Mark 1:8; Luke 1:35; Luke 3:16; Luke 3:22; Luke 4:1; Luke 4:14; Luke 4:18; John 1:32-33; John 3:34-35; John 7:39; John 14:16-17; John 14:26; John 15:26; John 16:7; John 16:13-15; John 20:22; Acts 1:2; Acts 1:4-5; Acts 2:33; Acts 10:36-38; Romans 1:3-4; Romans 8:9-11; Romans 8:26-27; 1 Cor. 2:10-11; 1 Cor. 6:19; 1 Cor. 8:6; 1 Cor. 12:3-6; 2 Cor. 1:21-22; 2 Cor. 3:17; 2 Cor. 5:5; 2 Cor. 13:14; Galatians 4:4; Galatians 4:6; Phil. 1:19; Col. 2:2; 2 Thes. 2:13-14; 2 Thes. 2:16; 1 Tim. 3:16; Titus 3:4-6; Hebrews 9:14; 1 Peter 1:2; 1 Peter 3:18; 1 John 5:6-7; Rev. 4:8

As for "your own wisdom", I dealt with the the 2 verses you quoted, and showed you what it meant. You assume it means something else, so you are equally guilty of applying your wisdom, are you not?

You want to know what your Internation standard Bible encylopedia says about the whole trinity here you go:
' The term "Trinity" is not a Biblical term, and we are not using Bible language when we define what is expressed by it as a doctrine that there is one only and true God, but in the unity of the Godhead there are three coeternal and coequal Personsthe doctrine of the Trinity is given to us in Scripture, not in formulated definition, but in fragmentary allusions...'

Now what? Whose wisdom is that now? I thought the wisdom of men are foolish?

Fragmentary allusions huh.. sounds like what your Jesus is God website is, just a bunch of fragmentary illusions.

Careful with the insults there. Why are you here on this website? Did you come here just to push your faulty positions, or to engage with an open mind?

Now please back up your assertions from Scripture, I believe I delivered what you asked.

[Light of Life]

Alright well I see, alot of things in which need to be cleared up before I Begin. My intent was not to come to you and make you hate me. My intent was to try my theory because in the mind of a person who has never been to a church, who has never been or herd any of the Gospel given by the church. But don't let that deceive you because i find it a gift because then i can read the bible without bias. Therefore i came across these scriptures which tell me that Jesus was not God. I am a logical person and am 16 years old. But dont let any of this decieive you. And what really shocks me is that I came here to say what i think. I was pretty close minded i will agree, but are you all not close minded also. I came here with a few scriptures in which anyone could understand. It is simple and needs no interpretation. So i will answer/ defend my theory as the post where posted. So let me begin.

FCC: Ok i misunderstood you, sure it might be my problem. But tell me where my theory is flawed. The only flawed thing in my mind is that you are so into the thought of Jesus being a God it stops you from even thinking otherwise. I have read all the post here and given them thought. I have found things that contradict what you say, and i guess you have found things that you beleive contradict what i say. So to answer your last question No, you did not blow me away. And as i can see you seem to be very happy in the knowledge of God that you have so i would like to ask you a question and if you can tell me what it is i will never bother any of you again. So tell me FCC What is the Glory of God? if you can give me scriptural definition of what it is I will leave.


August

1) Like i said before i didn't grow up in the church so i don't know their little things so i don't know what you mean by the gospel message
2)Who do i say Jesus is, I say he is a man who God chose to be glorified by him.

To answer your next question. Your explanation is not to in depth for me at all. I am just saying that it is not needed. And that when people just throw in their wisdom of things it often confuses, and the scripture can be misused. The fact that you seem to think that your little explanation proved mine wrong is also grossly nieve. You care so much about protecting your Jesus is God theory that you will go at any lengths to try and prove me wrong and you cannot simply handle what the scripture says. JESUS WAS TEMPTED, GOD CANNOT BE TEMPTED, Wether external or internal it doesn't matter. The fact and point is that he was tempted. And how you say that when it says he was tempted agrees with James is making me do backflips. Because you don't want to hear that Jesus was a man like you or I. How you can say that it agrees with it tells me that you are very closed minded yourslef. You just ignore the things that contradict what you think. The fact is this Jesus was tempted, unless you think the scripture lies, and God cannot be tempted. What is so hard to understand. Weither internal or external it makes no differance the scriptures say he was tempted. And please PLEASE tell me what i am telling you that cannot be seen in the scriptures, Tell me what am i assuming? As for the long list of scriptures you gave me I looked up the very first one. And after that i stop completly because it shows your ignorance. Isa. 40:3 and Matt 3:3 has nothing to do with Jesus. AT ALL. The scripture was talking about a prophet by the name of Elijah. In Matt 3:3 it is stated in regard to John the Baptist, who was the prophet to get everyone ready for the first comming of Christ. Likewise Elijah will be here on earth to prepare the way before Jesus Christ Second comming. Therefore after reading that i didn't even bother because most likly you misunderstood and misused those scriptures also. Like it says in Matt 7:17
'17 Every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.' My friend the fruit you have to offer only shows your unlearnedness. You can give me a 1000 scriptures to back up what you think, but if you cannot even discern when they are talking about Jesus and when they are not, i find that your tree is not bringing forth good fruit. And just because im considerate i went through a few scriptures you gave you gave at random. So i will just throw a few of them out there so that you can give me YOUR interpretaion of what they have to do with anything. Gen 3:22, Gen 1:1, Psa 102 24-37 Psa. 24:7-10 (Hopefully you dont think that the Lord of Hosts is Jesus) If you feel the need please add any you wish to add. The only thing that i see when i look up all these scriptures are those fragmentary illusions. Peices of the bible that you throw togather, then you look at all these titles which seem to be the same titles given to God.I can see where you are coming from, and i can see how you can beleive that Christ was God. So please go over your explentation of how my theory is wrong and give it in great detail, i am alittle slow and I honestly dont understand how you can even deny the proof i give. In no way is it flawed. It requires no interpretation, not in depth study. What is so complicated i don't understand, how you feel that my scriptures only add to what you think i don't understand. And you are looking down on me as if i'm some kid who you feel the need to teach. Ok so then teach me. If you seem to know so much and you have all this knowledge. I want you to teach me these things, of course i know the answers to these questions anyways but why don't you give it a shot, and show me what kind of fruits you have.

• What is the biblical definition of grace?
  What is the will of God?
  What is the overflowing scourge spoken of in Isa 28:14-19
  What are the sins of the flesh?
  What are the sins of the spirit?
  How do you become Born from Above?
  What is the Mystery of Godliness?
  How do you aquire faith from God(Scripture included)?
  What is the Glory of God?
  What is your Eternal Life?
  How do you sit at the Table of the Lord?
  Biblical Definition of Sin (scripture included)?

I could go on but i wont. If you can answer even 2/3 of them with scripture to prove it, I will stop eveything and admit that i am wrong and that i am just stupid and have no idea what im talking abut. The point i am trying to make here is that i am not a novice to the Word of God, of course i haven't gotten there by myslef but with help for a few good men, I know the bible fairly well and i just want to make sure that im not getting ideas from a person who is only wise in vein words, and knows how to copy and paste for a website.
Also just to remind you, would you please go over with me in detail how what i said is wrong, and how Internal or External factors relate to being tempted. Im understand how you get the impression that a person can only be tempted because of their own desires, but let me ask you this does the scripture not say that he[Jesus] was tempted. Yes or No. And i want to ask you scripture proof that God is only free from temptations from within. You asked me for scripture proof that the Devil cannot be in the Presence of God well give me a scripture that says that he can or that God can only save himself from temptations within. The fact is you can't and like i said before niether can I. But again i will give you more proof that Jesus was tempted

7 Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared; 8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; 9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him(Heb 5:7ff)

Tell me if you can why he was suffering. No this is not talking about his crucifiction. His suffering was not caused by external actions, he was suffering because of things happening inside of him. Things that made him perfect. If you wish i will answer this so my theory is a little stronger, but i will not answer it until you answer my questions because in the process of telling you why he was suffering i will most likely give away some of the answers.

[Canuckster1127]

The answer to this question, in my belief and experience is found in Phill 2:5-11.

This is the primary verse that promotes what is known theologically as the "Hypostatic Union."

What is demonstrates is that Jesus was both fully God and fully Human.

Jesus did not cease to be God in the incarnation. It says that he emptied (greek word is based on "kenosis") Himself, or set aside many of the things that were due Him because of who He was, and it was in the doing of this that Christ became fully human and like us in every regard, except without sin.

So, when the Scripture speaks of his temptation, it is in the context that while He was still God, he felt the pull and the expedience of temptation to take the easier path to accomplishing the goal.

We can go into more detail if needed, but to understand the nature of Christ's temptation, you need first to understand the nature of the incarnation and Christ's humanity. It is this that in the end renders His atoning sacrifice meaningful and sufficient for us.

Blessings,

Bart

[August]

Matthew 4:1-10 (KJV)
Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil. [2] And when he had fasted forty days and forty nights, he was afterward an hungred. [3] And when the tempter came to him, he said, If thou be the Son of God, command that these stones be made bread. [4] But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God. [5] Then the devil taketh him up into the holy city, and setteth him on a pinnacle of the temple, [6] And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone. [7] Jesus said unto him, It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God.