Why Doesn't America believe in Evolution?

[Canuckster1127]

http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns? ... news_rss20

Here's a scientific community response to that question.

Any thoughts?

[AttentionKMartShoppers]

Religious fundamentalism, bitter partisan politics and poor science education have all contributed to this denial of evolution in the US, says Jon Miller of Michigan State University in East Lansing, who conducted the survey with his colleagues.

Evolution is preached dogmatically in schools and colleges, and any attempt to show that there is evidence against evolution and there's little for it is silenced by legal proceedings. How is education to blame exactly? Or are they saying maybe people are educated enough to realize there are some reasons to be skeptical of such claims?

[Canuckster1127]

Religious fundamentalism, bitter partisan politics and poor science education have all contributed to this denial of evolution in the US, says Jon Miller of Michigan State University in East Lansing, who conducted the survey with his colleagues.

Evolution is preached dogmatically in schools and colleges, and any attempt to show that there is evidence against evolution and there's little for it is silenced by legal proceedings. How is education to blame exactly? Or are they saying maybe people are educated enough to realize there are some reasons to be skeptical of such claims? And whose religious fundamentalism? The Darwinist's?

Well, I think the article is wondering why evolutionism remains so controversial in the US when the rest of the world, from their perspective, pretty much accepts it.

They seem to believe that Christian fundamentalism is partly to "blame." Then they seem to be saying that it has been made a political issue which takes it out of the "pure" realm of science. Then the trump card is seemingly played. Those in disagreement must be poorly educated and unable to see how "right" it is.

I see a few things in this article that are revealing.

1. There's no differentiation between evolution in terms of scientific theory and the then further extrapolation of that tied with spontaneous generation of first forms, (Sometimes differentiated as micro vs macro evolution.) There is what I see as a usual scientific community bias that the two are inseparable.

2. Religious Fundamentalism has been in the US overall declining and moderating and yet, it appears that the position of the general US population (based on other articles I've seen, some of which are posted here) has held steady.

3. Perhaps the strategy of separation of Church and State in this regard by those vehemently attempting to keep any and all mention of God, even in the context of simple history and the influence of religious thought and philosophy, out of the schools, has backfired?

By seeking to present science and religion as incompatable, the result, rather than enhancing science has been to increase the appeal of religious thought, and by their own rules, they are not able to address the concerns or answer the questions raised?

Just a thought.

Bart

[Turgonian]

While Catholics, European Protestants and so-called mainstream US Protestants consider the biblical account of creation as a metaphor, fundamentalists take the Bible literally, leading them to believe that the Earth and humans were created only 6000 years ago.

Well, I've repeatedly said that I'm no scientist, and I'm no expert at topography, but I do know that the Netherlands are situated in Europe, and that thousands of Christians here believe in Creationism.
And they seem to be unaware of OEC, too.

[godslanguage]

Personally, I am catholic and the idea or notion that only christians in America are skeptic yet the rest of the world accepts evolution is complete nonsense. Only Christians stood up and take the claims of science and put them to the test. Science is good for society, but I feel that it has been pushed away so far from religion that it has become a religion that has adopted all of its teachings as a credit to atheism alone. The idea that christians are stupid just because they don't believe in the unproved theory, that to me makes no sense whatsoever. I mean, I believe in God and I am in the science field of electronics, does that mean that just because I can measure current flowing through a circuit or the time it takes for a capacitor to charge at an applied frequency, does this mean that I'm stupid because I'm not going to admit that evolution is true because I'm in a fieled that deals with technology that ties in with science. Should we give technology credit to evolution, should we give surgery credit to evolution, should we give medicine credit to evolution. Do all the good doctors have to know the evolution theory of how an ape turned into a man given enough time, in order to be a good surgeon do you have to know how a rat turned into a horse, how a plant turned into a fish and later on after billions of years, created man. I mean, these are huge claims the evolutionists are making and they need more than just computer animation (which they take credit for because its science, and all science is only viable and reasonable to those who don't believe in God), its just disturbing to me, even as a catholic, which the article states is okay for, not for me. If they can't prove the theory, that it takes millions or bllions of years and equate it with an experiment to shift the geologic column, than because they can't prove it, we must believe in it, is not only the subject that it IS a religion, but it is cowardly to use all the areas of science in order to push the theory, in my opinion.

[sandy_mcd]

But the question isn't whether doctors and computerists need to believe in evolution or even whether evolution is true.
The question is, assuming that the poll results are valid - same question was asked in the same way, random sample, etc - why is the US near the bottom of the list, with a significantly different response?

[godslanguage]

But the question isn't whether doctors and computerists need to believe in evolution or even whether evolution is true.
The question is, assuming that the poll results are valid - same question was asked in the same way, random sample, etc - why is the US near the bottom of the list, with a significantly different response?

Catholics, buddhiists, Muslims etc... seem to accept that evolution is right because of the idea that all of science claims it. Or, they don't bother with the theory, that is, they don't care much about it, whether evolution is true or not, . In Europe, for example, many countries don't try to tie evolution with everything in their lives, life is differant there, the culture of the countries even accept God without any doubts, without any substitutes, yet they take evolution as a science in a second because they don't worry as much as for the threat to there faith. In America, it looks like there is an push-and-pull contest going on, either the evolutionists or christians try to push their beliefs in every single corner with every available source, or they try to pull away with all what the other has claimed. Since America is the most technologically advanced country in the world, many evolutionists try to make it more sophisticated, try to imply the message, that we don't have any proof that God exists, we think its all science and that all religion is incompatible with science etc...Why don't they say, we don't know if God exists or not, he may exist, but I am skeptic (Instead they say, the WHOLE scientific community is skeptic, that all the scientists share the exact same view, and perhaps all of America), this is why christians have a problem with this popular concept. In this case, you have a more spiritual response than anything else, especially from the christians in America, which I feel take the worst beating. In the end. a response is needed to keep up with the media, the attacks are endless. The American people recognize these attempts and while the theory is pushing forwards, the American people are going backwards because the attempts made so far as evidence for the theory of evolution are really one-sided atheistic views being promoted in addition have not been fully proven, and that is the problem. Basically, HUGE CLAIMS using HUGE SOURCES without HUGE proof. It takes more than imagination to promote evolution which makes HUGE claims which seem to be aimed towards defeating relgion from the world.

[AttentionKMartShoppers]

But the question isn't whether doctors and computerists need to believe in evolution or even whether evolution is true.
The question is, assuming that the poll results are valid - same question was asked in the same way, random sample, etc - why is the US near the bottom of the list, with a significantly different response?

Maybe because America hasn't become as secular as Europe? Maybe it's the 60's in reverse? It's "question authority" but we're not questioning the conversatives this time? Maybe people in other countries just believe what they're taught in school and college, and don't realize that the arguments are bad and the evidence worse? Maybe because if you're dumb enough to think socialism works, you'll believe anything? These are just some ideas. There are more if you need them. I'm a fountain of knowledge you know.

My question is why Iceland is at the top of the list.

[Canuckster1127]

Iceland is an very secular nation. They are very highly educated. I know this from my earlier years when I played international chess. Never went to iceland, but interacted with several icelander's. Almost perfect literacy. Probably the highest level of higher education as well.

[FFC]

My question is why Iceland is at the top of the list.

Maybe it's so stinking cold they can't think straight.

[angel]

Why doesn't America believe in evolution?

This one may help with some data:
http://www.waronscience.com/home.php

though i doubts that it is enough

[thereal]

Maybe because America hasn't become as secular as Europe? Maybe it's the 60's in reverse? It's "question authority" but we're not questioning the conversatives this time? Maybe people in other countries just believe what they're taught in school and college, and don't realize that the arguments are bad and the evidence worse?

Couldn't the same argument be used to explain why those in certain regions have a greater acceptance of evolution...maybe they're simply not believing everything that's taught in church, and they see the arguments provided in church as bad and the evidence even worse.

My question is why Iceland is at the top of the list.

See Canuckster's response. and consider the previously-discussed link between education and the acceptance of evolution.

In America, it looks like there is an push-and-pull contest going on, either the evolutionists or christians try to push their beliefs in every single corner with every available source, or they try to pull away with all what the other has claimed.

I have to take offense to this as a biologist...do you have scientists coming into your church trying to pressure clergy to teach evolution along with creation...I highly doubt it. Are there repeated, highly publicized attempts by scientists to force the teaching of evolution alongside creationism in Sunday school...don't think so. Those in science, and especially in the field of evolution, attempt to disseminate information within the realm of academia, where it belongs. I wouldn't describe the current scenario as push-and-pull, but rather as push-and-push.

The American people recognize these attempts and while the theory is pushing forwards, the American people are going backwards because the attempts made so far as evidence for the theory of evolution are really one-sided atheistic views...

After calming myself a bit and not launching into a tirade, I should probably just ask if you really want to make a statement such as this...it does not reflect well on your knowledge of the study of evolution nor the faction that accepts the theory. That's all I'm going ot say on this one.

Should we give technology credit to evolution, should we give surgery credit to evolution, should we give medicine credit to evolution. Do all the good doctors have to know the evolution theory of how an ape turned into a man given enough time, in order to be a good surgeon do you have to know how a rat turned into a horse, how a plant turned into a fish and later on after billions of years, created man.

Actually, evolution is being relied upon more and more in medicine, as we realize that viruses can evolve and subsequently more potent or different medications are needed to treat them. It's similar to the situation with current agricultural practices, which recognize the evolution of pest species resistance to certain pesticides. You seem to have a very limited view or knowledge of evolution if the only thing that comes to your mind is a rat turning into a horse (didn't happen) or plant turned into a fish (I really hope that was a joke).

[AttentionKMartShoppers]

Actually, evolution is being relied upon more and more in medicine, as we realize that viruses can evolve and subsequently more potent or different medications are needed to treat them. It's similar to the situation with current agricultural practices, which recognize the evolution of pest species resistance to certain pesticides. You seem to have a very limited view or knowledge of evolution if the only thing that comes to your mind is a rat turning into a horse (didn't happen) or plant turned into a fish (I really hope that was a joke).

Keep banging that drum. We have to believe that all life came about by natural means in order to believe viruses can evolve and pest species can become resistent? This is absurd nonsense. You don't have to believe in macroevolution to believe in microevolution. Evolution is not one of those miracle elixers left over before the creation of the FDA. It will not cure cancer and give you more energy.

[Turgonian]

Maybe because if you're dumb enough to think socialism works, you'll believe anything?

Sorry, but the nations of Western Europe have never been socialist.
And there are European Christians fighting Neo-Darwinism too. It's just that American fundamentalists are a lot more vocal and fanatic than Europeans. (Note: I'm talking about the yelling fundamentalists, not about the Christians who believe in civilization and calm scientific enquiry. I know they are the majority in America by far -- it's just that the madmen are more vocal...)

Being secular must have something to do with it, too. America, as a whole, likes to consider itself a Christian nation, although it's a liberal form of Christianity more often than not...

Iceland is probably secular too. From what I've heard, it's a rather closed community.

[thereal]

We have to believe that all life came about by natural means in order to believe viruses can evolve and pest species can become resistent? This is absurd nonsense. You don't have to believe in macroevolution to believe in microevolution. Evolution is not one of those miracle elixers left over before the creation of the FDA. It will not cure cancer and give you more energy.

Talk about banging on drums...the old micro- vs. macro- escape... I have no doubt that if microevolution weren't visible to the layperson, I'd have to make repeated arguments for its existence as well. Anyway, my point was to address the statement that suggested that medicine, surgery. technology, etc. have nothing to do with evolution, which is obviously false.