FFC wrote:I was raised Baptist and I was always that we have to take the scriptures literally unless the scriptures themselves indicated otherwise. I do believe that Hell is a place of punishment and torment, but I'm not so sure anymore that it is an physical eternal torture chamber. to me that seems a little too sadistic.
I think it would be torture enough to be separated from God for all eternity without the possibility of a reprieve knowing that you had so many chances to enter His kingdom without the physical element. God is holy and can not have sin in His presence, but He does continue to be loving and merciful.
First, hell is not an eternal torture chamber - it is a place of containment where just recompense is due…
Isaiah 24:21-22:
On that day the LORD will punish the host of heaven, in heaven, and the kings of the earth, on the earth. 22 They will be gathered together as prisoners in a pit; they will be shut up in a prison, and after many days they will be punished."
Note: Revelations 20:14-15
Kiel & Delitzsch Commentary of the OT states this about these verses:
Isa 24:22-23
Isa_24:22 announces the preliminary punishment of both angelic and human princes: 'asēphâh stands in the place of a gerundive, like taltēlâh in Isa_22:17. The connection of the words 'asēphâh 'assir is exactly the same as that of taltēlâh gâbēr in Isa_22:17 : incarceration after the manner of incarcerating prisoners; 'âsaph, to gather together (Isa_10:14; Isa_33:4), signifies here to incarcerate, just as in Gen_42:17. Both verbs are construed with ‛al, because the thrusting is from above downwards, into the pit and prison (‛al embraces both upon or over anything, and into it, e.g., 1Sa_31:4; Job_6:16; see Hitzig on Nah_3:12). We may see from 2Pe_2:4 and Jud_1:6 how this is to be understood. The reference is to the abyss of Hades, where they are reserved in chains of darkness unto the judgment of the great day. According to this parallel, yippâkedu (shall be visited) ought apparently to be understood as denoting a visitation in wrath (like Isa_29:6; Eze_38:8; compare pâkad followed by an accusative in Isa_26:21, also Isa_26:14, and Psa_59:6; niphkad, in fact, is never used to signify visitation in mercy), and therefore as referring to the infliction of the final punishment.
This punishment is described as recompense in the bible and elsewhere.
Job 34:11 sums it up well: “
For according to the work of a man God will repay him, and according to his ways he will make it befall him.” ESV
Sin is described in
Romans 5:12: “
Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned.”
What is sin? Is it so trite as to brush it away as having no lasting eternal effect?
People manipulate God's goodness and mercy everyday, misuse his own 'slow to angerness' and 'love' to keep sin alive. We hear and often use these excuses to nullify truth of God's word:
"Oh, We are not so bad, just human, sigh. God understands he will not hold me accountable for sin. He will not punish me for eternity! God will prove his love to me by letting me in heaven, after all, I am only human and can't help myself. All will be well."
Will it? As an eternal being, a person would manipulate God's own goodness and mercy and love for there own gain — after all they can't help it. They learned to do so on-this earth, in this mortal life.
Problem is we do not see our sin as all corrupting and as well as how egotistically demandingly manipulative it is.
People think, God will change them in the afterlife and make everything all okay.
Would you open your own home to someone unknown to you — a criminal - because this stranger demands you too because you're a Christian who is supposed to love everyone, give the shirt off your back?
Why you would slam and bar the door — call the police and have this criminal taken to the nearest jail --- banished away from you forever!
That is why bible tells why there is no such thing as Universal afterlife salvation…
Nahum 1:3 , “
The Lord is slow to anger and great in power, he will not at all acquit the guilty “ NKJV
Isaiah 48:22, “There is no rest/peace," says the LORD, "for the wicked." ESV
Think of it this way: Here is God who…
“…
God! "The Rock, his work is perfect, for all his ways are justice. A God of faithfulness and without iniquity, just and upright is he.” Deu 32:3-4 ESV
"Therefore, hear me, you men of understanding: far be it from God that he should do wickedness, and from the Almighty that he should do wrong. 11 For according to the work of a man he will repay him, and according to his ways he will make it befall him. 12 Of a truth, God will not do wickedly, and the Almighty will not pervert justice” Job 34:10-12 ESV
Think of God who is perfect in all he does, whose ways are just, faithful, without iniquity, who never does wickedly, nor ever perverts justice. Think how easy it could be to manipulate God's own-nature and character for selfish gain.
We do so on this very earth everyday!
His gifts are irrevocable — he gave you the gift of life. You will not be destroyed into non-being as this would make this gift revocable as well as prove he cannot keep his promises or his own word — God would be proven unfaithful.
How would you manipulate this? With sin in you heart you would do so eternally. That is how and why the Devil and his followers got away with sins rebellion.
They manipulate God's own goodness and integrity in an attempt to overthrow him as they understand that God will never do wrong, always be just, etc. Such Love is manipulated and exploited, much how a common criminal uses the law to combat the law to get off the hook.
Now when people proclaim: “
Oh, We are not so bad, just human, sigh. God understands he will not hold me accountable for sin. He will not punish me for eternity! God will prove his love to me by letting me in heaven; after all, I am only human and can't help myself. All will be well....
Do you see why hell — that prison is eternal? How could it be not? God will not pervert justice for me or you or anyone.
Hell maybe very unpalatable to our human psyche but do we understand the nature of sin as well as God? The nature of sin that tests manipulates God's own nature of love everyday?
Do some of the readers desire God to exterminate into non-existence the gift of life he gave? Why God's gifts, this gift of life, are irrevocable. So in essence you join the rebellion wearing scripture on your sleeve to make God deny himself! Or does the reader demand that God let all in heaven, unrepentant, due to his love! How manipulative to demand God to pervert justice so you can remain in your sins.
Isaiah 26:10, “
If favor is shown to the wicked, he does not learn righteousness; in the land of uprightness he deals corruptly and will not see the majesty of the LORD.” ESV
I praise God He is greater than your theology! I can worthily praise the Lord of Host who is faithful, keeps all his word, promises, and gifts, who does no wrong and will never pervert justice.
He sent Christ to save us and change us into his child in this mortal life because in eternity you understand who God is and what He is like. He will not be manipulated to keep sin alive nor will he renege his gift of life. He will never pervert justice!
Hell is a place where ones manipulative sin nature is completely exposed just as Job 26:5-6 states. It is just recompense…
One last thing —
People love to think that everyone is God's child and since so, no one would ever toss his own child into hell. People error in their manipulative justifications in this manner — do you love your neighbor's child as your own?
You think yes? Well, do you take care of them, nurture them, provide all their meals, take them to all doctor appointments and pay for these? Go and cheer them at their sports games? No — you do not love your neighbors child as you do your own.
Jesus said that there are Children of the devil and children of God. Jesus and the Apostle Paul made a distinction between children of light and children of darkness (John 12:36, Eph 5:8, 1 Thess 5:5).
Bible tells us we are all children of wrath (Eph 2:3) but now through Jesus Christ we can become God's child through adoption:
Eph 1:5, "
he predestined us for adoption as sons through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of his will..."
It is true, God will never send his own adopted Child into hell. Question, what child are ye? Light or darkness?
One who learns to manipulate to get there way? Abuse their parents love? Who love such darkness thinking daddy will always bail me out — he loves sooo…
One who loves comes to the light seeing how manipulative and dark they really are and cry's out to be changed — now — adopted back into God's favor and learn to live as partakers of his divine nature...
Too any reader - which child are ye?
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