The Lords supper

Poetic_Soul · Post by **Poetic_Soul** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 10:14 pm

Mastermind said:
I have read through that topic, no need to repost it.

I beg to differ. Maybe it could shed light for those who didn't read it. Besides, it shows how Christ alone becomes our Saviour, not Mary.

Mastermind · Post by **Mastermind** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 10:14 pm

You mean John the Baptist.

Same thing.

I believe Jesus being in human form still had to be obedient to the Father. One must remember that Jesus came to serve mankind. And in by showing and being a servent to mankind we can follow and express what was being taught by Christ. Besides;...the baptism was getting Jesus prepared for his 40 day fast in the wilderness.

I was under the impression that baptism had something to do with the original sin...

Poetic_Soul · Post by **Poetic_Soul** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 10:19 pm

All baptism does is show the faith that you follow. Baptism becomes an expression of your belief. It has nothing to do with salvation. If that was the case the the thief on the cross would of never been allowed in paradise with Christ. A promise that Jesus gave to a sinner on the cross.

Felgar · Post by **Felgar** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 10:20 pm

Absolutely Poetic - this follows the exact line of thinking that I've been trying to get accross in the thread about Jews with my discussion with Chela. Simply being born human means we are sinners... (which is why Jesus could not have been born from the seed of man)

I personally feel that Mary is of the same stature as John. Yes she was certainly special... Recall that everyone else questioned how this virgin could give birth - yet Mary simply acknowledged that she was the Lord's servant, and that's certainly a remarkable act of faith. Clearly the Lord utilized her in His plan, in much the same way that John was 'destined' to serve the Lord's will by preparing the way for the light. They were both absolutely very special, but then they're not God so I'd never pray to them.

Mastermind · Post by **Mastermind** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 10:23 pm

I'm not suggesting praying to Mary. I'll finish this tomorrow, I need some sleep now.

Poetic_Soul · Post by **Poetic_Soul** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 10:27 pm

Felgar said: Clearly the Lord utilized her in His plan, in much the same way that John was 'destined' to serve the Lord's will by preparing the way for the light.

Absolutely. I just preached about this Sunday that just past. To take it a step further I believe everyone has a special destiny from God. The problem is, they never hear their call from God.

Felgar · Post by **Felgar** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 8:26 am

Poetic_Soul wrote:Absolutely. I just preached about this Sunday that just past. To take it a step further I believe everyone has a special destiny from God. The problem is, they never hear their call from God.

Interesting way to look at it...

Kurieuo · Post by **Kurieuo** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 9:34 am

Poetic_Soul wrote:Absolutely. I just preached about this Sunday that just past. To take it a step further I believe everyone has a special destiny from God. The problem is, they never hear their call from God.

Two problems I see here though.

The first is that if God is all-powerful, then it seems to me if God planned a "special destiny" He wants a person to know, then He will ensure a person knows it. Therefore I disagree that if there is a special destiny for everyone, that we can do not hear it.

The second problem relates to how God knows everything, including whether a "special destiny" would be carried out. So if God knows that a "special destiny" would not be carried out, then it seems foolish for God to have planned something that would never have taken place. Additionally, anything God plans would take place, otherwise God's plans fail meaning He is to some extent impotent. Since God isn't impotent, if God plans for someone to fulfill a special destiny, then such will be fulfilled.

Kurieuo.

Poetic_Soul · Post by **Poetic_Soul** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 1:05 pm

Well, Kurieuo. Here is how I look at it. The prophesy of Jesus' birth is in Gen 3:14-15. Look at all the things that happened betwwen the times of Eve to Mary. Judah slept with a prostitute who was in all actuality his daughter in law (Tamar). Rahab, another prostitute that was not even Hebrew bore two children by Boaz. One by the name of Salmon. David coveted another mans wife and bore Solomon. Yet with all this, Gods patience held out within the nation of Israel; even through the tribe of Judah to bring us our Savior.

I sereiously doubt that it was Gods plan to have it that way. Many are called but few are chosen. The reason why they were not chosen is because they did not heed to their call. Jonah had to be swallowed by a whale because he was not obedient to his calling.

Your probably thinking that these two examples proved your theory but look at it this way;.....God called everyone to a certain greatness, talent or destiny. They may not become rich and receive the praises of the world. But they will receive blessings abundantly. The problem that we as human beings is concerned is the fact we don't trust God to the fullest. Our disobedience prevents God from working in our lives. We become out of bounds when it comes to establishing what God has for us. You can't score a touch down and hear the cheers of the fans if your not in the game. So whether you're the best floor sweeper on the planet or the best engineer in the universe, you'll get the praises from whatever talent God has given you. But you have to be in bounds to receive the blessings from God.

Mastermind · Post by **Mastermind** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 1:21 pm

Matthew 3
5: Then went out to him Jerusalem and all Judea and all the region about the Jordan,
6: and they were baptized by him in the river Jordan, confessing their sins.

It seems to me that baptism did have something to do with sinning. One has to wonder why Jesus would require a baptism. I am certain it's not because He was a sinner but I don't seem to undertstand the meaning behind it.

Alanna · Post by **Alanna** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 3:20 pm

Just wanted to quickley post something I found in an article. If anyones interested in reading the whole thing the link is http://www.ourladyweb.com/mary-defended.html#
I shall be back later, and I'll post 'bits and pieces of it' tonight. The ones I consider 'most important.'

"Rom 3:23: "for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God..."
The problem with this is that the word 'ALL' here is the Greek word, 'PAS', which can have different meanings to the absolute that we immediately think of - as shown in other verses of Holy Scripture.

John 12:19, "All the world has gone after him!" Did everyone in the entire world really go after Christ?

Mt 3:5-6, "Then went out to Him Jerusalem, and ALL Judea, and ALL the region about the Jordan; and they were baptized by him in the Jordan, confessing their sins."
Were all of the people of Judea, and the region about the Jordan baptized?

Luke 2:1 "And an order went out from caesar Augustus that ALL the world should be counted."
Was everyone in the whole world counted?

Rom 11:26, "ALL Israel shall be saved." Will everyone in Israel truly be saved?

Rom 15:14, "...you yourselves are full of love, filled with ALL knowledge..." The only person filled with 'ALL' knowledge is God Himself.

The Greek word 'PAS' in many verses in Scripture simply means a 'great number', 'most of', or 'a lot'. So its appearance in the quoted passage can in no way be used as an objection to the sinlessness of the Virgin Mary."

Alanna · Post by **Alanna** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 3:24 pm

And one more thing I just want to make sure is clear: Catholics do not worship Mary.

Kurieuo · Post by **Kurieuo** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 5:35 pm

Alanna wrote:And one more thing I just want to make sure is clear: Catholics do not pray to Mary. we ask her to pray for us. Just as you might ask a close friend or family member etc to pray for you.
God Bless!

Like I might "pray" to God to ask Him stuff?

Kurieuo.

Kurieuo · Post by **Kurieuo** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 5:52 pm

Poetic_Soul wrote:God called everyone to a certain greatness, talent or destiny. They may not become rich and receive the praises of the world. But they will receive blessings abundantly. The problem that we as human beings is concerned is the fact we don't trust God to the fullest. Our disobedience prevents God from working in our lives. We become out of bounds when it comes to establishing what God has for us. You can't score a touch down and hear the cheers of the fans if your not in the game. So whether you're the best floor sweeper on the planet or the best engineer in the universe, you'll get the praises from whatever talent God has given you. But you have to be in bounds to receive the blessings from God.

Although there are certainly some Godly people within Scripture that God set aside for a particular purpose, I disagree that there is "one" particular destiny that God has for us which we have to discover. I believe God leaves a lot of responsibility up to us. As long as we are within His moral will with our decisions, then I believe we are within bounds to receive any blessings, or trials, God places before us. Decisions such as who to marry, where to move to, where to be educated, and so forth... all these decisions God leaves up to us to use our own wisdom He's given us, although we remain within His moral will.

Kurieuo.

PS. Have you read Decision Making and the Will of God before? If not, I would recommend it, even if you disagree with it, to be aware to a alternative view to that of us having to discover God's individual will for our lives.

Alanna · Post by **Alanna** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 8:03 pm

Here's a link telling why Catholics Believe in the Immaculate Conception and giving scriptual evidence.

http://catholiceducation.org/articles/a ... p0128.html

God Bless!
Alanna