Was Jesus actually the Messiah?

[jasonmar]

There are a lot of phophecies about the Messiah, but does Jesus actually fullfil them? I want to know where in the bible it shows that Jesus was a descendant of Abraham, Issac, Jacob and David. And please don't tell me the first chapter of Matthew or the 3rd chapter of Luke. Those both trace back the genealogy of Joseph. And since Jesus was not Joseph's son, where does it prove he was of the house of David?

[Jac3510]

Actually, Luke's gospel goes back through Mary, not Joseph, to David. And Matthew's gospel goes through Jesus' legal father. In fact, you have two prophetic fulfillments there. Other than Jesus being in the line of David, we also have Him being born of a virgin, which fulfills both Isaiah's and Moses' predictions (see Gen 3:15).

In the "for what it's worth" column, you may not want to tell people in your posts "Please don't use X as evidence," especially when your statement demonstrates that you don't understand the particular X you are forbidding.

[imoneru?]

There are a lot of phophecies about the Messiah, but does Jesus actually fullfil them? I want to know where in the bible it shows that Jesus was a descendant of Abraham, Issac, Jacob and David. And please don't tell me the first chapter of Matthew or the 3rd chapter of Luke. Those both trace back the genealogy of Joseph. And since Jesus was not Joseph's son, where does it prove he was of the house of David?

The genealogy aside,what gives me reason to believe that Jesus was the Messiah was his own statement in John 4:25,26 where He tells the women at the well that He is, of course He could have been delusional and only thought He was , But I choose to believe Him...Ray

[B. W.]

John the Baptist stated that Jesus was before him.

John 1:30 , "This is he of whom I said, 'After me comes a man who ranks before me, because he was before me." ESV

How can that be since John the Baptist was born before Jesus (Luke 1:16, 36,41,76,80)?

That question helped me explore who Jesus was. From this began for me an unlocking of the Old Testament prophesies about the Messiah and how he was to be identified. I'll share a little with you all here. Please read slowly and look up the verses. There is more here than I can adequately write.

The ancient Israelites just before Jesus appeared in mortal form were looking for the Messiah. How was he to be identified? One way was through the signs contained in the sacred writings we know now as the Old Testament.

They read where many people saw God and lived to tell about it. From this, the Messiah was revealed and who He is, as well as what He will do. John the Baptist could boldly say, “After me comes a man who ranks before me, because he was before me” because he knew that Jesus existed before he was ever born…

For example, Moses and seventy elders went up to the mountain together and they all saw God and ate and drank in his presence and with God (Exodus 24:9, 10, 11). Yet, God told Moses later in Exodus 33:20 God told Moses that no-one can see God in his full glory and live. So the Lord sent His Goodness, Exodus 33:19, to pass before Moses proclaiming the name of Yahweh. In Exodus 33:14, 15 it describes the Goodness of one of the presences (Hebrew word translated presence is the plural word Panim — faces, presences) of Yahweh.

Why is this important? Answer: God appeared in Goodness to Abraham in Genesis 17:1-3. The Lord appeared again to Abraham in Genesis 18:1-2 in the form of three. God's Goodness spared Lot as Yahweh did say in Genesis 18:21 he was personally going to Sodom to see for himself the outcry against this place was as it was, yet, two others went one, God's Goodness to spare Lot and the Ruach of Yahweh to give final power of judgment's execution over the matter.

Abraham did not die when he saw God — what gives? In Exodus 33:20 the context of the verse stated that Moses wanted to see God in his full manifested glory — His Three Panim (Presences) in united full glorious from. This would be impossible for a mortal to behold so God reveals himself in manners in which people can see him and live. Therefore God's Panim (presence, face) of Goodness passed before Moses revealing Yahwehs character and nature (name).

Later Jacob wrestled with the Lord's Goodness in Genesis 32:24 describes as being in the form of a man. Why do I saw Goodness? Genesis 32: 30 describes why I say this: Jacob saw God —Face to Face (paimin to panim) and was spared!

The English translations in Genesis 32:1 use the English word angel to translate the Hebrew word Malak. Malak means messenger — a word bearer sent to do a task. A Malak does not always imply an angelic being and many people sadly miss the import of the Messianic sign that reveals who this "Jesus" is whom John the Baptist stated as coming before him.

This word Malak is so oft translated as angel that people no longer use the word properly. Context of scripture define if a Malak is an angelic being, or human being, or God himself. Please become aware of how this word is used in the Old Testament. For example, Abraham sent a Malak out to find Isaac a wife and that Malak was a human being — not an angelic one! Therefore, Malaks are not always angelic beings!

The Hebrew word Malak, often translated as angel, simply means a messenger. Context from the bible defines the type of messenger sent whether they be angelic, human, of God himself as the Malak (meaning simply the Messenger-Word bearer).

In Genesis 32:1 the Malak's Jacob encountered were two as revealed in Genesis 32:2 — (double camp i.e. God's camp). Again, the same two that went and rescued Lot. One of them wrestled Jacob and Jacob did say he saw 'Yahweh face to face and he preserved my life.'

The Lord's Goodness again revealed!

Gideon saw this Malak, known as Malak Yahweh in Judges 6:22-23. Note that only God can grant life and say one cannot die. Gideon also said he saw the Malak Yahweh and called the place “Yahweh Is Peace' Judges 6:24. God's Goodness brings peace…

Judges 13 tells of the Birth of Samson and how his parents saw the Malak Yahweh in Judges 13:3, 6, 8, 9. They did not recognize who this was as evidence by them seeing only a man (Judges 13:16). They called him a Malak of Yahweh not recognizing him as the Malak Yahweh who delights in the light of mankind.

Manoah wanted to know the Malak's name in Judges 13:17 and the Malak answered, “…Why do you ask my name, seeing it is wonderful?" (Judges13:18) Again Isaiah 9:6 speaks of the one who would come that was Wonderful: God's Goodness in wonderful!

The Malak went back to heaven in a flame Judges13:20 and Manoah and his wife in Judges 13:21 then knew this person was the Malak Yahweh (Note — you do not bow to an angelic being, Rev 22:8, 9). The one they heard about who revealed himself to Abraham, Jacob, Lot, Moses, Gideon — the Malak Yahweh himself came to them! Has he to you yet?.

Read Judges 13:22, 23: “And Manoah said to his wife, "We shall surely die, for we have seen God." 23 But his wife said to him, "If the LORD had meant to kill us, he would not have accepted a burnt offering and a grain offering at our hands, or shown us all these things, or now announced to us such things as these." ESV

Manoah said we shall surely die because they saw, not an angelic messenger, but rather the one known as the Malak Yahweh — the Messenger - word bearing — Yahweh who has appeared before and gives forth Goodness, Peace, Counselor, Peace, etc… to those who look upon him. They live and not die for seeing God. The Malak Yahweh gives the grace of life for seeing God and not death.

So how could Jesus come before John the Baptist? He is the one who appeared to Abraham, Jacob, Moses, Gideon, Samson's parents. He is the Messenger Yahweh known as the Word. He bears good news and does tasks.

Now read John 1:1. 2, 3, 4, 5 and understand why He is called the Word and why in him was life and the life was the light of men… Moses saw, Abraham saw, Gideon saw, Jacob saw and lived and not died!

Read John 1:14 and understand how Jesus was before John! You see, the Messiah would have to be God (Messenger Yahweh) come in Human flesh to give life back into the word darkened and polluted by sin. The Goodness of God has now appeared to all Mankind -- As it is written:

Isaiah 45:22, “Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.” KJV

We can now “Look” (turn) to the Lord and live and not die as the testimony from Abraham, Jacob, Moses, Gideon, Samson's Parents, etc testified as we know know who to Look for!

Isaiah 43:10-12, "You are my witnesses," declares the LORD, "and my servant whom I have chosen, that you may know and believe me and understand that I am he. Before me no god was formed, nor shall there be any after me. I, I am the LORD, and besides me there is no savior. I declared and saved and proclaimed, when there was no strange god among you; and you are my witnesses," declares the LORD, "and I am God.” ESV

Hosea 13:4, 5, “But I am the LORD your God from the land of Egypt; you know no God but me, and besides me there is no savior. It was I who knew you in the wilderness, in the land of drought…” ESV

When I first saw the Messianic Signs in the old Testament that testify how Jesus ( the second Person of the Godhead) appeared in the ancient times to many, I can begin to slowly comprehend why the Apostle John wrote the Gospel account the way he did as well as why he used the Greek word Logos — Word to describe who Jesus is.

John the Baptist understood better than anyone who Jesus is and could say with boldness —"This is he of whom I said, 'After me comes a man who ranks before me, because he was before me." John 1:30, ESV

Amen
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[CAT]

I suppose if you really want proof that Jesus was indeed the Messiah, read the Old Testament book of Daniel 9:24-25. It basically foretold when the Messiah will come. Daniel 9:24-25 - Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy. Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.

This date in history was known as Palm Sunday when Jesus rode into Jerusalem on a Donkey proclaiming Himself to be the Messiah. For that to have transpired, or better yet for Jesus to have conspired that beforehand is next to impossible!