Well, then we are mostly in agreement. Because when we talk to the world about religion, do you think their mind goes to the Oxford definition, or are other images and meanings conjured in their minds? I have little doubt that man would war for any number of reasons. The United States was formed over a war on taxation. Wars would not exist without man, I agree. But neither would religion, regardless of how you want to define it.DannyM wrote:Jlay, reading your post I can not really disagree with you on hierarchy and wars being fought over religion. But to take the crusades, for example, do you honestly think that without religion blood would not have been spilled over something else? It's not religion that is responsible for wars; man is responsible for war. So if man had never made religion, would man have been passive forever after? When man uses religion for his own depraved/wicked/misguided ends, why blame the vehicle on which man has ridden instead of blaming man himself?
Again, this is a matter of semantics. You are perceiving the word 'religion' to primarily pertain to YOUR personal Christian faith. No problem. That is not what I am contending with here.
I thought of including a formal definition and discussing in previous post. I am not dealing with a formal definition, but what connotations people have when they hear the word, 'religion.' I'd think they'd see more of the 'systems' that are in place. So, you won't find me arguing with you regarding the definition. But let us keep in mind that this is a general definition and refers to ANY system of faith, not just Christianity.I'll take Oxford for this one as it defines religion quite nicely...
Do Muslims need to abandon religion? Hindus? Atheists? Mormons? Did the Pharisees need to abandon their religion?So religion has been abused? I agree. But do we honestly and rationally abandon religion and all the untold good which has come from Christianity just because the relatively few have abused their position or faith? Is that rational? I don't think it is.
Seems like Jesus went through intense scrutiny and condemnation from the religious people of His day. Christianity is only a religion in that it is a particular system of faith. However, a Muslim, no matter how religious, is more lost than the least devout believer in Christ. I am also convinced that the Christian religion (if we must call it) is littered with religious people who have never personally trusted in the work of Christ. Example: talking to a person of a particualr religion, I asked if they were saved. This was not met with testimony, but with friction. "Well, I don't have to be. I've been through the Catechism. I'm covered just in case it is true. I go to mass. etc." That my friend, is the spirit of religion. Or, the countless denominations that say, their way is the right way, or they are the one, true church. Or any group that tries to say, "Jesus + X (x being their religious system)= salvation."Christianity is a religion, a movement mobilised in reverence to the miracle of our Lord Jesus Christ. Without the very first - and very determined -mobilisation of Christians Christ's Glory would have been a mere fleeting moment, long forgotten by now. I respect you a heck of a lot, Jlay, but I think you are in error here brother. I stand with you on the more ludicrous aspects of our wonderful religion. But to throw the baby out with the bath water - Why?
Paul warned,
"Therefore, if you died with Christ from the basic principles of the world, why, as though living in the world, do you subject yourselves to regulations "Do not touch, do not taste, do not handle," which all concern things which perish with the using--according to the commandments and doctrines of men? These things indeed have an appearance of wisdom in self-imposed religion, false humility, and neglect of the body, but are of no value against the indulgence of the flesh."
It is for this exact reason why I would not want to be known as just another religion. Becuase they are not all true, as we both know.Me too. So by knowing Christ and knowing the truth then one becomes a Christian. That's religion for ya!
I'm sure we can discuss that on another thread if you like, as this one is already well off topic.P.S. I'm not too interested in what James had to say.