hell's population

Anonymous · Post by **Anonymous** » Fri Apr 15, 2005 3:41 am

From a chirstian's prespective are people like gandhi, mohammed, buddha, dogen to name a few 'saints' all casted into the depths of hell ?

Does this not contradicts with the christian's moral concept of justice?

Kurieuo · Post by **Kurieuo** » Fri Apr 15, 2005 4:52 am

Everyone on their own is condemned before God for all have sinned no matter how much good they have done. God would be quite just in casting every one of us out from His presence.

Kurieuo.

Mastermind · Post by **Mastermind** » Fri Apr 15, 2005 4:54 am

Anonymous · Post by **Anonymous** » Fri Apr 15, 2005 7:53 am

I see, i see...

its true that everybody must have at one point in time committed what would be defined as 'sin' by chirsitians.

So I guess that the chirstian god makes exceptions to those who repent through jesus?

Felgar · Post by **Felgar** » Fri Apr 15, 2005 8:03 am

nameless wrote:So I guess that the chirstian god makes exceptions to those who repent through jesus?

God will forgive the sin of anyone who turns to Him, yes. And one does that by repenting through Jesus. Forgiveness is a free gift from God, it need only be accepted.

Mastermind · Post by **Mastermind** » Fri Apr 15, 2005 8:04 am

Yes, as well as those who have never heard of Jesus but still listened to their conscience and did good.

From your list, I would give the following comments:

gandhi - He was quite aware of Jesus and his teachings, yet rejected his divinity. Not much hope.

Mohammed - If the qur'ran is what he actually thought, i don't think there is much hope for him. His teachings go directly against jewish and christian teachings.

buddha - Predates Jesus, so I don't see why he wouldn't be saved since his teachings were good (from my limited experience anyway)

dogen - I know close to nothing about him, so i can't tell. If he had no contact with christianity, he would probably be saved as well.

Anonymous · Post by **Anonymous** » Fri Apr 15, 2005 8:11 am

i guess its non applicable to pose the question as to why god does not create what I deem would be a fairer system where ppl can earn their way to heaven if they commit say 'X amount of good deed' etc as an alternative to repenting through jesus christ...

Mastermind · Post by **Mastermind** » Fri Apr 15, 2005 8:19 am

nameless wrote:i guess its non applicable to pose the question as to why god does not create what I deem would be a fairer system where ppl can earn their way to heaven if they commit say 'X amount of good deed' etc as an alternative to repenting through jesus christ...

Your system is idiotic. Jesus's system allows everybody to be saved no matter what time in their life this occurs. With your system somebody who was a criminal their entire life would be stupid to come to Christ because he'd get into Hell anyway. Jesus gives anybody who is alive the opportunity to be saved. And what makes you think you do more good things than bad, or that you do a lot of good to begin with? Do you give money to every homeless person you meet? Do you volunteer your spare time? What sacrifices do you make that are worthy of Heaven? Simply "living your life" does not qualify as a good deed. Helping out friends and family does not qualify as good deeds because even the most wicked do that.

Felgar · Post by **Felgar** » Fri Apr 15, 2005 8:45 am

nameless wrote:i guess its non applicable to pose the question as to why god does not create what I deem would be a fairer system where ppl can earn their way to heaven if they commit say 'X amount of good deed' etc as an alternative to repenting through jesus christ...

Good post on the fact that people would not repent even with proof of God.
http://discussions.godandscience.org/vi ... ight=#8338

Or, see this discussion which addresses the very same issue. I'm hoping to finish my response to that thread today...
http://discussions.godandscience.org/vi ... highlight=

Kurieuo · Post by **Kurieuo** » Fri Apr 15, 2005 9:07 am

nameless wrote:i guess its non applicable to pose the question as to why god does not create what I deem would be a fairer system where ppl can earn their way to heaven if they commit say 'X amount of good deed' etc as an alternative to repenting through jesus christ...

I'd agree that the current system is unfair for all deserve the same end—to be outcast from God. Yet, God used something foolish to those who don't believe, to offer grace to those who do. That is, God used Christ who died in our place to redeem those who accept such a gift from their own sin. All one has to do is choose to accept this gift.

Now imagine two clubs. One says people can only come if they have earned membership. To earn membership one must obtain superior wisdom, fulfill a long list of demands, or acheive a certain level of spirituality. Despite the best efforts of many a lot of people aren't going to gain membership and will be excluded. That is generally what all other religions besides Christianity teach. You must do something to earn your way to God.

On the other hand, the second club says anyone who wants to come in can because Jesus has already paid for your membership. Regardless of ethnic heritage, where you live, or your past history... the doors are open and anyone can come in. Entry is not based on qualifications, but only accepting Christ's gracious gift. What could be fairer to all? The matter is left up to each of us to decide. The question is, what will you ultimately decide?

Kurieuo.

Anonymous · Post by **Anonymous** » Fri Apr 15, 2005 9:11 am

Your system is idiotic

what I meant was a 2 path system, one repent through christ, and the second would be being a 'very good' person in general. That way people who are very good such as gandhi himself wouldnt go to hell. Sort of like a fail safe. The criteria of 'very good' of course being set up by god as defined by his moral system.

If I was god I would have such a system.

Good post on the fact that people would not repent even with proof of God.

Hmm... actually I would not repent if there was a proof of christian god as I disapprove of his conduct

Kurieuo · Post by **Kurieuo** » Fri Apr 15, 2005 9:15 am

nameless wrote: what I meant was a 2 path system, one repent through christ, and the second would be being a 'very good' person in general. That way people who are very good such as gandhi himself wouldnt go to hell. Sort of like a fail safe. The criteria of 'very good' of course being set up by god as defined by his moral system.

Ahh, but there is a two path system. Accepting Christ's gift, or being perfect and without any wrong.

Kurieuo.

Anonymous · Post by **Anonymous** » Fri Apr 15, 2005 9:15 am

kk, I see how the christian system works then.
Thanks

well then 3 paths..

Anonymous · Post by **Anonymous** » Fri Apr 15, 2005 9:42 am

hmm... why does god need to send jesus down to pay the membership,
couldnt he equally grant membership to people who believe in him without jesus having to die etc... is this one of the inexplicable nature of god again?

Mastermind · Post by **Mastermind** » Fri Apr 15, 2005 9:55 am

It's not inexplicable. It's a symbol of God's love.