Meaning and purpose to Atheists...

[Canuckster1127]

What you call assumptions, others refer to as revealed truth.

[whynot]

The more I read this thread, the more confused I get. It feels like a dozen different things are being discussed, and as soon as we respond to something, the topic changes again. Its getting really frustrating. Brevity is the soul of wit 'whynot'. For the sake of us who don't have tons of time on our hands please try to be clear, brief, and to the point.

whynot: I'm sorry Marcos...was there an argument in there somewhere that actually addresses my response, which was based on "purpose and reason"?

[whynot]

What you call assumptions, others refer to as revealed truth.

whynot: Indeed, the most "utilitarian epistemic approach" one can embrace. I only wish the source was more democratic in its deployment. Playing favorites in the methodology is anything but morally commendable. Just look at the confusion and bloodshed this has engendered down through the ages.

[B. W.]

How...do atheists expect themselves or others to find meaning and purpose in life when meaning and purpose are eliminated when you take God out of the equation?...

I think the ol 1960's song refrain sums it up best:

"La,La, La, live for today..."
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[Murray]

Atheist would do anything to preserve their life(as they believe it is the only one they have), including cowardice, this is why I would have a hard time serving in the military with them.

[Canuckster1127]

What you call assumptions, others refer to as revealed truth.

whynot: Indeed, the most "utilitarian epistemic approach" one can embrace. I only wish the source was more democratic in its deployment. Playing favorites in the methodology is anything but morally commendable. Just look at the confusion and bloodshed this has engendered down through the ages.

That's a human characteristic and it applies in many areas, including religion, but there's no shortage of examples of those who have take a militant bent on atheism and killed in that vein as well.

[Murray]

What you call assumptions, others refer to as revealed truth.

whynot: Indeed, the most "utilitarian epistemic approach" one can embrace. I only wish the source was more democratic in its deployment. Playing favorites in the methodology is anything but morally commendable. Just look at the confusion and bloodshed this has engendered down through the ages.

That's a human characteristic and it applies in many areas, including religion, but there's no shortage of examples of those who have take a militant bent on atheism and killed in that vein as well.

Stalin, hitler, mao, pol pot, lenin, are all wonderful atheist.

Get a history lesson, crusades were needed 1) to stop muslim aggression into europe, 2) to destroy knights who ignited wars in middeval europe.

[whynot]

How...do atheists expect themselves or others to find meaning and purpose in life when meaning and purpose are eliminated when you take God out of the equation?...

I think the ol 1960's song refrain sums it up best:

"La,La, La, live for today..."
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Then it's your position that atheists are unable to look forward and plan for tomorrow? The only thing taken out of the equation of meaning and purpose sans God is whatever meaning and purpose each believer believes he/she has derived from their god belief...and that is all. Each of us will still behave according to the previous axioms I've already articulated, unless we engage in behaviors that mitigate against our own existence or have no desire to improve our lives. Since most sinners turn to God for salvation, which is defined as becoming a new creature, in so doing admit to the lack of value derived from their old sin nature, so being a new creature must necessarily be an improvement to their lives, thereby belying the desire to find a life they can live with.

[whynot]

Atheist would do anything to preserve their life(as they believe it is the only one they have), including cowardice, this is why I would have a hard time serving in the military with them.

whynot: Yeah, with an after-life waiting or 72 virgins...depending on your flavor...strap on them explosives and go git 'er done cowboy.

[B. W.]

How...do atheists expect themselves or others to find meaning and purpose in life when meaning and purpose are eliminated when you take God out of the equation?...

I think the ol 1960's song refrain sums it up best:

"La,La, La, live for today..."
-
-
-

Then it's your position that atheists are unable to look forward and plan for tomorrow? The only thing taken out of the equation of meaning and purpose sans God is whatever meaning and purpose each believer believes he/she has derived from their god belief...and that is all. Each of us will still behave according to the previous axioms I've already articulated, unless we engage in behaviors that mitigate against our own existence or have no desire to improve our lives. Since most sinners turn to God for salvation, which is defined as becoming a new creature, in so doing admit to the lack of value derived from their old sin nature, so being a new creature must necessarily be an improvement to their lives, thereby belying the desire to find a life they can live with.

When ya die ol buddy roo Mr. Atheist - you've become a toxic pickle till the ages grind ya to dust all after all you've become'n a dead hunk of meat when ya die - nothing is all there is - why be moral - who cares - when ya die that's it... so what?.

All good clean live'n what a waste - same with all bad live'bn too - no one will remember you. who cares - why should I care for you or you mee - when we die - we die - dead hunk of meat

La La La - Live for today...
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Note: Being Very Sarcastic in this post…

[Murray]

Atheist would do anything to preserve their life(as they believe it is the only one they have), including cowardice, this is why I would have a hard time serving in the military with them.

whynot: Yeah, with an after-life waiting or 72 virgins...depending on your flavor...strap on them explosives and go git 'er done cowboy.

Sadly , we are not the perverted religon that believes in 72 virgins after death

[whynot]

How...do atheists expect themselves or others to find meaning and purpose in life when meaning and purpose are eliminated when you take God out of the equation?...

I think the ol 1960's song refrain sums it up best:

"La,La, La, live for today..."
-
-
-

Then it's your position that atheists are unable to look forward and plan for tomorrow? The only thing taken out of the equation of meaning and purpose sans God is whatever meaning and purpose each believer believes he/she has derived from their god belief...and that is all. Each of us will still behave according to the previous axioms I've already articulated, unless we engage in behaviors that mitigate against our own existence or have no desire to improve our lives. Since most sinners turn to God for salvation, which is defined as becoming a new creature, in so doing admit to the lack of value derived from their old sin nature, so being a new creature must necessarily be an improvement to their lives, thereby belying the desire to find a life they can live with.

BW: When ya die ol buddy roo Mr. Atheist - you've become a toxic pickle till the ages grind ya to dust all after all you've become'n a dead hunk of meat when ya die - nothing is all there is - why be moral - who cares - when ya die that's it... so what?.

All good clean live'n what a waste - same with all bad live'bn too - no one will remember you. who cares - why should I care for you or you mee - when we die - we die - dead hunk of meat

whynot: Or you can embrace the fairytale of angels wings...without a shred of evidence...harshly judge everyone who, for whatever reason, does not subscribe to your fantasy, and go through life pretending you're all that moral, when in reality you can't even contain the urge to exhibit sarcasm, in spite of all these claims to a moral and ethical advantage. You would think a mod would lead by example. There's really nothing in my previous response that warrants a sarcastic knee jerk reaction. If you don't wish to entertain conflicting positions then shut down this site and go bury your head back in the sand.

The fact that I can and do care, without a god belief, remains uncontestable. You don't have the ability to "believe" those facts out of existence.

La La La - Live for today...

whynot: I do...and tomorrow...and every continuous day thereafter.-
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Note: Being Very Sarcastic in this post…

Postscript: For no apparent reason other than you can. Is this an example of objective morality under the influence of god belief?

[whynot]

What you call assumptions, others refer to as revealed truth.

whynot: Indeed, the most "utilitarian epistemic approach" one can embrace. I only wish the source was more democratic in its deployment. Playing favorites in the methodology is anything but morally commendable. Just look at the confusion and bloodshed this has engendered down through the ages.

That's a human characteristic and it applies in many areas, including religion, but there's no shortage of examples of those who have take a militant bent on atheism and killed in that vein as well.

whynot: Yabut...if God is able to divinely inspire/reveal his central truths to some men...why not just do so for all men? Why play favorites? If all men were treated equally by God there'd be no atheism, competing religions or even denominations...yes?

[B. W.]

Then it's your position that atheists are unable to look forward and plan for tomorrow? The only thing taken out of the equation of meaning and purpose sans God is whatever meaning and purpose each believer believes he/she has derived from their god belief...and that is all. Each of us will still behave according to the previous axioms I've already articulated, unless we engage in behaviors that mitigate against our own existence or have no desire to improve our lives. Since most sinners turn to God for salvation, which is defined as becoming a new creature, in so doing admit to the lack of value derived from their old sin nature, so being a new creature must necessarily be an improvement to their lives, thereby belying the desire to find a life they can live with.

Or you can embrace the fairytale of angels wings...without a shred of evidence...harshly judge everyone who, for whatever reason, does not subscribe to your fantasy, and go through life pretending you're all that moral, when in reality you can't even contain the urge to exhibit sarcasm, in spite of all these claims to a moral and ethical advantage. You would think a mod would lead by example. There's really nothing in my previous response that warrants a sarcastic knee jerk reaction. If you don't wish to entertain conflicting positions then shut down this site and go bury your head back in the sand.

The fact that I can and do care, without a god belief, remains uncontestable. You don't have the ability to "believe" those facts out of existence.

La La La - Live for today...

whynot: I do...and tomorrow...and every continuous day thereafter.

So what if you care about tomorrow...and every continuous day thereafter what makes that morally superior when moral superiority does not count one iota? When you die you die – that’s it...

How can you judge what behaviors mitigate against our own existence and the behaviors that produce no desire to improve one’s life – what standard do you use? Selfishness? Is that your standard?

If one thinks it is morally superior to steal every penny you have – are not they meeting your criteria for bettering one’s life? After all, such robbing and plundering of you does indeed improve the robber’s life. There is no right or wrong, is there?

When you die – you die – that’s it – who cares as long as a person does desire to improve one’s life through whatever means possible as that does not mitigate against their own existence!

But wait, after you die – you cease to exist and if you cease to exist, then you claim that anything that mitigates against our own existence is wrong, then would not the concept of the afterlife that atheist have be wrong then – it does mitigate against one’s own existence – does it not??
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[Canuckster1127]

What you call assumptions, others refer to as revealed truth.

whynot: Indeed, the most "utilitarian epistemic approach" one can embrace. I only wish the source was more democratic in its deployment. Playing favorites in the methodology is anything but morally commendable. Just look at the confusion and bloodshed this has engendered down through the ages.

That's a human characteristic and it applies in many areas, including religion, but there's no shortage of examples of those who have take a militant bent on atheism and killed in that vein as well.

whynot: Yabut...if God is able to divinely inspire/reveal his central truths to some men...why not just do so for all men? Why play favorites? If all men were treated equally by God there'd be no atheism, competing religions or even denominations...yes?

That presumes salvation isn't available to all men and further it presumes man can be possessed of free will without the ability to choose against God. It's a common argument of atheists that I've seen many times and it does an effective job of turning the deterministic forms of some elements of Christianity, but alas, in me you're meeting a Christian who doesn't subscribe to the determinism from either direction.