goodbye

[DannyM]

Goodbye, friends, non-friends and those indifferent. I’ve struggled for a long time to try and show humility towards others but still falter. I have tried to become a better person but cannot do it on my own, and it just seems that the help of God is either missing or I’m not catching on to it. I had hoped that over the years I would mellow, but I debate atheism with atheists and I’m still an attack dog. I loathe the atheist position and everything it stands for - I end up loathing the atheist himself and my Christian humility is completely absent. I’m not changed; I’m not in the process of changing - there is no process! So I’ve decided that I can’t go on as a member of a humble and decent Christian debating board, mixing among some truly wonderful people, all the while being so disjointed myself. I aim to return to my closet and pray for the humility I need to level out as a human being and as a Christian.

God Bless

[Canuckster1127]

Danny,

Take time out or stop participating in the threads.

You're demanding more of yourself than God does.

Whether you realuze it or not, you're growing a lot and it's evident. Please don't leave. You're a part here and belong.

Bart

[neo-x]

Hi Danny,

I do not think you are giving yourself any credit, a lot us feel disjointed at times. Nothings wrong with that, you don't have to go. I think your posts carry insights as well as a good understanding of the scriptures.

[Byblos]

Goodbye, friends, non-friends and those indifferent. I’ve struggled for a long time to try and show humility towards others but still falter. I have tried to become a better person but cannot do it on my own, and it just seems that the help of God is either missing or I’m not catching on to it. I had hoped that over the years I would mellow, but I debate atheism with atheists and I’m still an attack dog. I loathe the atheist position and everything it stands for - I end up loathing the atheist himself and my Christian humility is completely absent. I’m not changed; I’m not in the process of changing - there is no process! So I’ve decided that I can’t go on as a member of a humble and decent Christian debating board, mixing among some truly wonderful people, all the while being so disjointed myself. I aim to return to my closet and pray for the humility I need to level out as a human being and as a Christian.

God Bless

Danny,

None of us, let me repeat, NONE of us are any better Danny. And I venture to say some are a lot worse (meaning me). Please don't make assumptions and try to compare yourself to others, it's just not fair. Your presence here is important Danny. Whether you know it or not, you are making a difference if not in your own life (although I don't believe that for a minute) but in the lives of others who read your words. We are a community of sorts here even though it is impersonal but a community we are and when a valued member of this community leaves it affects us all, very deeply. I implore you, please reconsider. If you need to talk privately please contact any one of us any time.

Blessings,

John.

[August]

Danny, I don't know if you wanted a word of advice or not...but you are going to get it anyway.

We are all disjointed, imperfect, in dire need of some Christian humility and lacking in our earthly ways. No-one here is perfect by any stretch of the imagination. That is why we have places like this.

These debates take a lot out of one. The lesson I learned through many debates was that one should not take the counter-argument by atheists personally. Remember, they are blind, and we (hopefully) don't get angry at blind people for stumbling into furniture. Does it sometimes get us annoyed that they can be so stubborn and willfully obtuse? Of course it does. Do I sometimes find myself caught up in winning the debate more than glorifying God? Yup.

It is good that you recognize your need for humility. It is great that you are so passionate about God that you feel slighted, insulted and angry at those that insult Him.

Remember also that you cannot change any person, only God can. You can only plant seeds of doubt in his atheist position, and you may turn out to be the instrument that God uses to change that person. If you keep that in mind, and dismantle their arguments in a calculated and logical fashion, without showing that you feel angry, impatient or annoyed, that not only exposes the weakness of the atheist position, but also elevates you in the eyes of those who are witnessing this exchange.

We are here as a community of Christians to help each other, and we need your fellowship as much as you need ours. Hang around, and if you get angry or want to vent while in a debate, pm any of the mods and we will vent with you.

[DannyM]

Thank you all for your encouragement, but I’m definitely taking a leave. Some lessons in humility are in order. It’s one thing to defeat the smug atheist with a step-by-step destruction of his worldview, but it is another to do so without rock solid humility. I’ve realised that, rather than ‘catching’ the neutral observers during these debates, I’ve probably more often than not lost them, even though I‘d ‘won’ the debate. This is because I sometimes rise to the bait and end up practically ridiculing their worldview. So I think I’ve actually wasted the opportunities. I really need to hone my attitude, and if I can’t hone it on here among some of the coolest and calmest debaters I have had to pleasure to mix with, then I’ll retreat to the closet and hone it within. I love you all and thank you for your love, support, help and advice over the last few years. I will of course keep up with the board, and hopefully return more humble some day.

God Bless

[Proinsias]

Take a step back to reflect if needed but don't go.

What you're describing seems a fairly common trait from those on both sides of the debate, even at the highest levels.

From someone who has had a few long winded discussions on both atheist and Christian boards taking the time to get to know people is often more valuable than scoring the most points. There's a lot to be learned from those you disagree with the most, perhaps approach an atheist forum more as a considerate guest looking to both learn and contribute than an attack dog looking to tear down everything in sight as efficiently as possible.

[B. W.]

Danny take a break and remember this verse:

Proverbs 27:17, "Iron sharpeneth iron; so a man sharpeneth the countenance of his friend." JPS

The ESV read:

Proverbs 27:17, "Iron sharpens iron, and one man sharpens another" ESV

That is what happens on Forums such as this - look forward to your return. What you wrote inspired me and helped me learn! Thanks friend!

B. W. Melvin
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[jlay]

Danny,

Your post demonstrates that you have more humility than you realize. Anyway, I've taken several breaks from this board. I think it's a healthy thing to do.

[narnia4]

I think a break can be good and healthy, but as others have said I also believe that your post does demonstrate growth and a desire to grow in the Lord. Hopefully you can keep it up and find peace. I'm one who finds myself scoffing at atheists as well and laughing at them at times, largely because so many ridicule Christ and his followers. Its hard to remember that they are the lost, just as any who may believe in a god but doesn't know Christ. Ultimately, I think they have far more in common with every other sinner than either side realizes at times.

God bless.