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Posted: Tue Aug 29, 2006 1:03 am
by angel
Do you believe that only that which is scientifically provable is "real" or "true."
I use "real" as "scientifically observable". Thus I suppose the answer is yes.
Though I accept other things to be considered, important, sometimes essential even if they do not "exist" as "real" things.
God is one of that.
I'm aware it is contradictory, though I think logic applies to "real" things only.

I think this is the message of the bible. I believe paradox (or better antinomy) is often used in the bible to point out this fact.
It is also in the tradition of the Talmud, I think. IMO.

Can you think of anything in your life which you accept and rely upon that is not scientifically oriented?
I probably was not clear enough in the past. I do believe in resurrection.
Just I don't think it happened. In particular I don't think resurrection is a matter of atoms going up, or disappearing here to appear again there.

Let me reverse the question to you.
What if the resurrection were to be demonstrated as provable or at least highly reasonable?
What basis would you require to consider that in terms of your own life and beliefs?
As I said, I do believe in resurrection.
Maybe you may want to ask which basis I would need to accept it as a "real" thing.
Well I need to observe it according to scientific standard. By definition, I would add.
For example I write a number on a piece of paper, see it vanishing, and then observe the corresponding pulses on the cosmic background radiation.
Or in the expansion of pi (so that it is statistically relevant).
Or that God appears to you and tell you the number (for a number of times so that I can exclude you cheat).
I can think of dozens of possible ways god could show me it is "real".
Just I know it did not want to.
I haven't read Contact, the book. That is by Sagan, right?
Right. You should read it. It is significantly different from the movie
(which is worth seeing anyway). All for about 10$.
My position is exactly depicted there. (Though it does not come from there...)
I don't feel threatened at all by your posting.
Please consider the offer valid for the future at any time.

Have you looked closely at that yourself at any time in your life?
Well, it depends on what you mean by "looked closely". But I think you can guess what I mean by what I wrote above.