Abortion: Function versus Essence

[Zebulon]

I didn't know God gave anyone the right to take another human life?

Kurieuo, does God give rights?

Zebulon

[Zebulon]

and a fetus is just cells coming together to form a person, but it is not a person yet. It does not feel, it does not think, it does not rationalize, it does nothing but suck on resources and it is uncapable to do anything else.

Frankly this guy has jello as brain.

New ultrasound techniques - 3D and 4D scans are opening up a unique portal on the miracle of life that starts with just a single egg and a single sperm. With remarkable findings revealing that the foetus dreams, jumps, sucks it thumb, open it eyes and reacts to pain far earlier that ever realised before. The essential senses, hearing and seeing also develop far earlier that we had ever realised...

...Even at this early stage (less than 2 months)the foetus responds to stimulation — when prodded its tiny hands will close...

...At about 9 weeks the foetus starts announcing its existence with a series of leaps, using the walls of the uterus like a trampoline.

Okay mom here it goes Boum boum boum

Read it all it is very ...wonderfull!

http://www.firstscience.com/home/articl ... _1317.html



Zebulon

[Furstentum Liechtenstein]

and a fetus is just cells coming together to form a person, but it is not a person yet. It does not feel, it does not think, it does not rationalize, it does nothing but suck on resources and it is uncapable to do anything else.

Frankly this guy has jello as brain.

New ultrasound techniques - 3D and 4D scans are opening up a unique portal on the miracle of life that starts with just a single egg and a single sperm. With remarkable findings revealing that the foetus dreams, jumps, sucks it thumb, open it eyes and reacts to pain far earlier that ever realised before. The essential senses, hearing and seeing also develop far earlier that we had ever realised...

...Even at this early stage (less than 2 months)the foetus responds to stimulation — when prodded its tiny hands will close...

...At about 9 weeks the foetus starts announcing its existence with a series of leaps, using the walls of the uterus like a trampoline.

Okay mom here it goes Boum boum boum

Read it all it is very ...wonderfull!

http://www.firstscience.com/home/articl ... _1317.html



Zebulon

You are all over the place, Zebulon. Sometimes I think you should be banned for promoting non-Christian values, other times you (seem) to make sense. On what are your values based?

FL

[Cross.eyed]

I, however, would counsel a woman against having an abortion for quite a few reasons, and those seemingly having to do with love more than biblical discernment.

Yes...any woman looking to have an abortion would probably not be swayed by biblical arguments anyway. Well...maybe biblical arguments would work in the Bible Belt of the USA, but not where I come from: a tragic traffic accident left a young woman dead and killed her unborn baby as well after a reckless driver hit her. Predictably, average citizens found the event tragic, especially since the woman was pregnant.

My own reaction was different. When a pro-choice person expressed sorrow at the death of the unborn baby, I said «The baby? nah!...that's just a blob of protoplasm!» After they got over the shock of my answer, I confronted them: «a fetus is a human being wether it is wanted or not. Killing that human fetus is wrong either way. Do you understand?»

Not one person has yet said that they understood. They have just walked away. (Maybe I should work on my people skills...)

FL

Never mind the people skills, your communication skills are in perfect order-Bravo!

I've been asking questions around family and friends as to how we can have two different laws concerning fetus' rights.
Remember Scott Peterson? He is the guy who went to prison for murdering his wife and unborn son just a few years ago. If I recall correctly, Peterson got the death sentence for each murder.

Since noone has been able to answer this I'll put it to any reader who cares to respond; How can both laws be used in such a contradictory fashion in the same state?

Muder is murder, but abortion is also murder and legal.

[Zebulon]

You are all over the place, Zebulon. Sometimes I think you should be banned for promoting non-Christian values, other times you (seem) to make sense. On what are your values based?

FL

Ho sorry and who are you to judge my Christian values? Do I judge you because you belong to a sect (and I care not to juge it as it is often declared so) that promote Christianity? I do not belong to any Christian church or Christian group. That does not make me any less Christian than you are.

My point was to bring the fact that a foetus is very alive and kiking scientifically earlier than science believed.

On what are your values based?

Why do you ask? So you can juge if I am fit to continue to participate in the Foum as compared to what your values are?

Read John 14:2

Yes I am all over the place because there are a variety of different values in this world (this forum as well) and I do not juge you if you decide to be in one single place .

Zebulon

[zoegirl]

Zebulon,

There are very clear teachings for the Christian doctrine.

What do believe a person needs to do to be saved? Or does a person need salvation?

[Zebulon]

Zebulon,

There are very clear teachings for the Christian doctrine.

Yes and there is many, many Christian doctrines.

Last week two ladies knocked at my door. They where Jehovas Withnesses. As soon as I opened the door the younger one pointed an already underlined phrase in the bible and said something about the phrase. I asked her why she had already decided what to say to me, and: Dont you have anything else to convince me with? Then she offered me a pamphlet. I looked in her eyes and they seemed empty. I felt sad but I did not judge them.

What do believe a person needs to do to be saved? Or does a person need salvation?

Should I ask any of Jehovas Withness if they are saved, and they will probably say yes.

What do believe a person needs to do to be saved? Or does a person need salvation?

So you, Zoegirl, please tell me about it.

Zebulon

[zoegirl]

Zebulon,
why are you avoiding the question?

Does a person need salvation? Does sin prevent a right relationship with God?

What do you think the Bible says about salvation (but, according to you, the Bible is notreliable....so how do you determine this?)

And no, Jehovh's witnesses are not CHristian. They deny the trinity and the divinity of Christ.

There is a very good section on the main page called the Beliefs...
Every accepted, mainstream, orthodox Christian denomination would accept these..

http://www.godandscience.org/beliefs.html

As well as aberrant beliefs

AS for my answers.

HTe bIble is the infallible Word of God.

Mankind is sinful, we cannot have a right relationship with God.

Christ came to redeem us, died on the cross, and rose again from the dead on the third day
CHrist calls us to believe on Him and have faith in His redeeming work on the cross.

NO other pathway brings us to God. NO other religion provides the answer.

[FFC]

Zebulon,
why are you avoiding the question?

Does a person need salvation? Does sin prevent a right relationship with God?

What do you think the Bible says about salvation (but, according to you, the Bible is notreliable....so how do you determine this?)

And no, Jehovh's witnesses are not CHristian. They deny the trinity and the divinity of Christ.

There is a very good section on the main page called the Beliefs...
Every accepted, mainstream, orthodox Christian denomination would accept these..

http://www.godandscience.org/beliefs.html

As well as aberrant beliefs

AS for my answers.

HTe bIble is the infallible Word of God.

Mankind is sinful, we cannot have a right relationship with God.

Christ came to redeem us, died on the cross, and rose again from the dead on the third day
CHrist calls us to believe on Him and have faith in His redeeming work on the cross.

NO other pathway brings us to God. NO other religion provides the answer.

Amen!