Evidence for God from Science

Canuckster1127 wrote:I'm thinking maybe those who want to make tongues now the sign of salvation (despite the fact that Acts 2, 8, 9, 10 and 19 speak of the Holy Spirit coming on people and only 3 of the 5 mention tongues so are we to conclude that the 2 where that is not mentioned are not real) ...

So, unless God repeats the same detail every time you won't believe?

For some people, once from God is enough, the unbeliever will always loook for an excuse not to take correction:

"Then came the Jews round about him, and said unto him, How long dost thou make us to doubt? If thou be the Christ, tell us plainly. Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not" (John 10:24-25)

The way of salvation was clearly set out in Acts 2. The same apostles were ministering the same throughout Acts.
Did you ever do an academic course, or read a book or get to know a person?
Did you ignore the details they previously gave you unless they repeated them again?

God says "in the mouth of 2 or 3 witnesses shall wevery word be established"

There are 3 accounts that describe what happens when people receive theb Spirit, God has been true to his word.

People that believe the first time don't need God to repeat all the details again!

This thread may show who the biggest unbeliever is, I won't be betting, I'm not sent to such.

Canuckster1127 wrote: ... It's amazing that something that important would not have been mentioned by Christ directly Himself, don't you think? Especially something that was so key as to the the initial sign of salvation.

Jesus said:
"Ye must be born again. The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit." (John 3:7-8)
- what is he referring to?

Be honest, do you know?

in v12 hge explains that he is talking about something earthy, something our natural senses can perceive.


In John 14:20 Jesus says:
"At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you"
- what was that day when Jesus would be in them?
- how did they know?

Canuckster1127 wrote:I mean, Christ was baptized and despite John the Baptists protestations that it wasn't necessary. When did Christ speak in tongues if this was such a vital sign? Pretty glaring ommission to leave out of the inspired word of God don't you think for something so "absolutely vital"? If Christ modeled baptist to perform all righteousness, then why didn't he model tongues?

The inspired word of God says that Jesus was born under the law and that the New Testament cound't begin until after the death of the testator.

The price had to be paid before the sould could be purchased.

Canuckster1127 wrote:Religious performance as the basis for God's love and acceptance is just the saddest way to live. And yet there's some sort of pride in the human heart that just rebels against the idea that God loves us and Christ has paid the entire price. We want to "do" something other than accept what Christ has done for us,

People could not understand or accept what Christ had done until after he had done it.
The true disciples did at Pentecost, sadly many today are still missing the point and fighting against the way of grace.

Canuckster1127 wrote: because that way we can say we're enough apart from God that God will just elevate us above others so we can feel better than others. It's the same spirit that drove James and John to ask Christ if they could sit on the thrones beside Christ when he came into his kingdom. At least they asked. Legalism shows up before God and expects to be seated on its own merit.

Legalism meant that the Pharisees couldn't accept that they had got God wrong when someone came along and told them, from the scriptures, backed up with God's signs!
- Nothing has changed

Ephesians 2:8-9 "For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith - and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God - not by works, so that no-one can boast."

Rom. 3:20,28 "Therefore no-one will be declared righteous in his sight by observing the law; rather, through the law we become conscious of sin." 28 "For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from obseving the law."

Matthew 19:16-17 "...Teacher, what good thing must I do to get eternal life?" "Why do you ask me about what is good?" Jesus replied. "There is only One who is good. If you wish to enter life, keep the commandments."

Isn't it correct to say that we are justified by faith but that faith must be alive? The Law cannot save us because we are incapable of keeping it. Therefore, salvation is by grace through faith. We are to have absolute faith. But we are not to sit on our hands, smug and self-satisfied. Isn't this the right way?

DannyM wrote:Ephesians 2:8-9 "For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith - and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God - not by works, so that no-one can boast."

Rom. 3:20,28 "Therefore no-one will be declared righteous in his sight by observing the law; rather, through the law we become conscious of sin." 28 "For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from obseving the law."

Matthew 19:16-17 "...Teacher, what good thing must I do to get eternal life?" "Why do you ask me about what is good?" Jesus replied. "There is only One who is good. If you wish to enter life, keep the commandments."

Isn't it correct to say that we are justified by faith but that faith must be alive? The Law cannot save us because we are incapable of keeping it. Therefore, salvation is by grace through faith. We are to have absolute faith. But we are not to sit on our hands, smug and self-satisfied. Isn't this the right way?

Now THAT deserves a while standing.

DannyM wrote:Ephesians 2:8-9 "For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith - and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God - not by works, so that no-one can boast." ...

Hi Danny,
Paul, and the Ephesian church who he was writing to had all received the grace that saves by receiving the Holy Spirit, evidenced by speaking in tongues - that's how they all knew precisely when they received.

Please read Acts 19:1-6

- have you received the same?

Really? Where do you find evidence that Paul spoke in tongues as the evidence of saving faith? Are you suggesting Paul was saved at the same time as the Ephesians or are you presuming he did before based upon inference and your over-riding assumption?

Canuckster1127 wrote:Really? Where do you find evidence that Paul spoke in tongues as the evidence of saving faith? Are you suggesting Paul was saved at the same time as the Ephesians or are you presuming he did before based upon inference and your over-riding assumption?

I see you have not responded to my previous responses to your asertions.
When you do, either to agree or disagree saying why, I will know you are here to find truth not to promote error, and I will be willing to spend more time talking to you.

TallMan wrote:

DannyM wrote:Ephesians 2:8-9 "For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith - and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God - not by works, so that no-one can boast." ...

Hi Danny,
Paul, and the Ephesian church who he was writing to had all received the grace that saves by receiving the Holy Spirit, evidenced by speaking in tongues - that's how they all knew precisely when they received.

Please read Acts 19:1-6

- have you received the same?

Hi TM,

That is all well and good, but do you realise what "grace" actually means? It means we are given the unmerited favour of God. This is divine intervention of the highest order. This is the ULTIMATE act of goodwill. Like I said, our faith must be alive; we must be neither smug nor self-satisfied whether in our faith or in our works. No-one may boast before the LORD.

Are you asking if I have received grace, or tongues?

God bless

DannyM wrote: ...Are you asking if I have received grace, or tongues? ...

I'm asking if you have received God's Spirit, evidenced by speaking in tongues, just like all Jesus disciples (Acts 2:4, 33, 39; 10:44-48, 19:1-6) and me & all in the church I'm in.

TallMan wrote:

DannyM wrote: ...Are you asking if I have received grace, or tongues? ...

I'm asking if you have received God's Spirit, evidenced by speaking in tongues, just like all Jesus disciples (Acts 2:4, 33, 39; 10:44-48, 19:1-6) and me & all in the church I'm in.

No, I do not speak in tongues.

DannyM wrote:

TallMan wrote:

DannyM wrote: ...Are you asking if I have received grace, or tongues? ...

I'm asking if you have received God's Spirit, evidenced by speaking in tongues, just like all Jesus disciples (Acts 2:4, 33, 39; 10:44-48, 19:1-6) and me & all in the church I'm in.

No, I do not speak in tongues.

Perhaps, TallMan, you can explain what it means to speak in tongues? What does it exactly entail? Are there specific things to be said? How do we know someone is actually speaking in tongues and not gibberish?

DannyM wrote:

TallMan wrote:

DannyM wrote: ...Are you asking if I have received grace, or tongues? ...

I'm asking if you have received God's Spirit, evidenced by speaking in tongues, just like all Jesus disciples (Acts 2:4, 33, 39; 10:44-48, 19:1-6) and me & all in the church I'm in.

No, I do not speak in tongues.

Well, you speak one tongue (English). If you learn another, then you're all set!

Kurieuo wrote:

DannyM wrote:

TallMan wrote:

DannyM wrote: ...Are you asking if I have received grace, or tongues? ...

I'm asking if you have received God's Spirit, evidenced by speaking in tongues, just like all Jesus disciples (Acts 2:4, 33, 39; 10:44-48, 19:1-6) and me & all in the church I'm in.

No, I do not speak in tongues.

Well, you speak one tongue (English). If you learn another, then you're all set!

In that case, I'm definitely all set. I speak 3 tongues .

Byblos wrote:

Kurieuo wrote:

DannyM wrote:

TallMan wrote:

DannyM wrote: ...Are you asking if I have received grace, or tongues? ...

I'm asking if you have received God's Spirit, evidenced by speaking in tongues, just like all Jesus disciples (Acts 2:4, 33, 39; 10:44-48, 19:1-6) and me & all in the church I'm in.

No, I do not speak in tongues.

Well, you speak one tongue (English). If you learn another, then you're all set!

In that case, I'm definitely all set. I speak 3 tongues .

Do we count Ebonics, cause while I'm not fluent, I can get by well enough.
And what about Spanglish or Pig-latin?
.
.