Re: Christian Genocide
Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2011 4:07 pm
The red terror in spain is another prime example of christians being persecuted by atheist
"The heavens declare the glory of God; the skies proclaim the work of his hands." (Psalm 19:1)
https://discussions.godandscience.org/
Murray wrote:
I am however 100% certain in the soviet regime, more people were killed than the holocaust you just do not hear about it and that is what drives me insane.
"Atheism is the core of the whole Soviet system." Aleksandr I. Solzhenitsyn,Soviet Russia wasn't directly about atheism. It was about purging culture and society to make way for communism or actually dictatorship.
I think this is the most important quote you brought up. Kinda makes a person wonder whether those people were really atheists, or they declared war upon God.neo-x wrote:“We do not fight against believers and not even clergymen. WE FIGHT AGAINST GOD to snatch believers from Him.” (Vechernaia Moskva, a Soviet newspaper)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lysenkoismneo-x wrote:"The Party cannot be neutral toward Religion because Religion is something
opposite to Science." Stalin
Can you show me where any public atheist preacher, ever, with the possible exception of Sam Harris, made the claim that most wars are caused by religion?narnia4 wrote: So when atheists say that "most wars are caused by religion", honestly they're just talking out of something or other that I won't name. Absolutely no truth to it, and yet they proudly announce it wherever they go.
Very Good quotes!neo-x wrote:"Atheism is the core of the whole Soviet system." Aleksandr I. Solzhenitsyn,Soviet Russia wasn't directly about atheism. It was about purging culture and society to make way for communism or actually dictatorship.
Communism begins where atheism begins…” (Karl Marx)
“The first requisite for the happiness of the people is the abolition of religion” (Karl Marx)
“Atheism is the natural and inseparable part of Communism.” (attributed to Vladimir I. Lenin)
“Our program necessarily includes the propaganda of atheism.” (V.I. Lenin)
“We do not fight against believers and not even clergymen. WE FIGHT AGAINST GOD to snatch believers from Him.” (Vechernaia Moskva, a Soviet newspaper)
“Let us drive out the Capitalists from the earth, and God from Heaven!” (early Soviet slogan)
"The Party cannot be neutral toward Religion because Religion is something
opposite to Science." Stalin
"The Marxist worldview has a relationship to the Enlightenment. I think
that’s impossible to doubt." Christopher Hitchens
The World has never before known a godlessness as organized, militarized and tenaciously malevolent as that preached by Marxism. Within the philosophical system of Marx and Lenin and at the heart of their psychology, HATRED OF GOD is the principle driving force, more fundamental than all their political and economic pretensions. Militant atheism is not merely incidental or marginal to Communist policy; it is not a side effect, but the central pivot. To achieve its diabolical ends, Communism needs to control a population devoid of religious and national feeling, and this entails a destruction of faith and nationhood. Communists proclaim both of these objectives openly, and just as openly put them into practice.” (Alexander Solzhenitsyn)
About the putative failing of atheism, Alexander Solzhenitsyn declared:
Over a half century ago, while I was still a child, I recall hearing a number of old people offer the following explanation for the great disasters that had befallen Russia: "Men have forgotten God; that's why all this has happened." Since then I have spent well-nigh 50 years working on the history of our revolution; in the process I have read hundreds of books, collected hundreds of personal testimonies, and have already contributed eight volumes of my own toward the effort of clearing away the rubble left by that upheaval. But if I were asked today to formulate as concisely as possible the main cause of the ruinous revolution that swallowed up some 60 million of our people, I could not put it more accurately than to repeat: "Men have forgotten God; that's why all this has happened."
SnowDrops wrote:Atheism was an inseparable part of communism, because it gave people Faith, Hope and a belief in something greater than the SSSR or a dictator. However, the SSSR was about power, not destroying religion. That was not it's most direct goal. Besides, destroying religion was just a part of destroying culture. It somewhat reminds me of what was done to Indians in America. Even speaking in other languages was mostly prohibited, celebrating certain holidays, including Christmas. It was an essential part though, rather than the main goal. If Stalin could use Christianity to gain power and promote Communism he would have done that instead.
The initial goal was not "destroy religion", it was "create a communistic world and gain power". Of course, the idea immediately and logically followed that you must destroy current ideology, loyalty and culture.
I sincerely doubt that America is even close to where the SSSR was. The modern lefts' goals... Maybe. The USA as a whole... That reeks of conspiracy theorists, who we really don't need. In the SSSR, you didn't need conspiracy theorists to tell you what was going on. Really, in the last 3 centuries Russia was always heading that way and it was fairly obvious to most people.B. W. wrote:SnowDrops wrote:Atheism was an inseparable part of communism, because it gave people Faith, Hope and a belief in something greater than the SSSR or a dictator. However, the SSSR was about power, not destroying religion. That was not it's most direct goal. Besides, destroying religion was just a part of destroying culture. It somewhat reminds me of what was done to Indians in America. Even speaking in other languages was mostly prohibited, celebrating certain holidays, including Christmas. It was an essential part though, rather than the main goal. If Stalin could use Christianity to gain power and promote Communism he would have done that instead.
The initial goal was not "destroy religion", it was "create a communistic world and gain power". Of course, the idea immediately and logically followed that you must destroy current ideology, loyalty and culture.
You just descibed the modern American Left and what the USA is heading for...
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SnowDrops wrote:I sincerely doubt that America is even close to where the SSSR was. The modern lefts' goals... Maybe. The USA as a whole... That reeks of conspiracy theorists, who we really don't need. In the SSSR, you didn't need conspiracy theorists to tell you what was going on. Really, in the last 3 centuries Russia was always heading that way and it was fairly obvious to most people.B. W. wrote:You just descibed the modern American Left and what the USA is heading for...-SnowDrops wrote:Atheism was an inseparable part of communism, because it gave people Faith, Hope and a belief in something greater than the SSSR or a dictator. However, the SSSR was about power, not destroying religion. That was not it's most direct goal. Besides, destroying religion was just a part of destroying culture. It somewhat reminds me of what was done to Indians in America. Even speaking in other languages was mostly prohibited, celebrating certain holidays, including Christmas. It was an essential part though, rather than the main goal. If Stalin could use Christianity to gain power and promote Communism he would have done that instead.
The initial goal was not "destroy religion", it was "create a communistic world and gain power". Of course, the idea immediately and logically followed that you must destroy current ideology, loyalty and culture.
Perestroika means overcoming the stagnation process, breaking down the braking mechanism, creating a dependable and effective mechanism for acceleration of social and economic progress and giving it greater dynamism.
Perestroika means mass initiative. It is the conference of development of democracy, socialist self-government, encouragement of initiative and creative endeavor, improved water and disciplined, more glasnost, criticism and self-criticism in all spheres of our society. It is utmost respect for the individual and consideration for personal dignity.
Perestroika is the all-round intensification of the Soviet economy, the revival and development of the principles of democratic centralism in running the national economy, the universal introduction of economic methods, the renunciation of management by injunction and by administrative methods, and the overall encouragement of innovation and socialist enterprise.
Perestroika means a resolute shift to scientific methods, an ability to provide a solid scientific basis for every new initiative. It means the combination of the achievements of the scientific and technological revolution with a planned economy
Perestroika means priority development of the social sphere aimed at ever better satisfaction of the Soviet people's requirements for good living and working conditions, for good rest and recreation, education and health care. It means unceasing concern for cultural and spiritual wealth, for the culture of every individual and society as a whole.
Perestroika means the elimination from society of the distortions of socialist ethics, the consistent implementation of the principles of social justice. It means the unity of words and deeds, rights and duties. It is the elevation of honest, highly-qualified labor, the overcoming of leveling tendencies in pay and consumerism. . . .
I stress once again: perestroika is not some kind of illumination or revelation. To restructure our life means to understand the objective necessity for renovation and acceleration. And that necessity emerged in the heart of our society. The essence of perestroika lies in the fact that it unites socialism with democracy and revives the Leninist concept of socialist construction both in theory and in practice. Such is the essence of perestroika, which accounts for its genuine revolutionary spirit and its all-embracing scope.
The goal is worth the effort. And we are sure that are effort will be a worthy contribution to humanity's social progress.
[Source: Mikhail Gorbachev, Perestroika (New York: Harper Collins, 1987), quoted in Mark Kishlansky, ed., Sources of the West: Readings in Western Civilization, 4th ed., vol. 2 (New York: Longman, 2001), p. 322.]
Rules for Radicals
By Saul Alinsky - 1971
5. "Ridicule is man's most potent weapon. It is almost impossible to counteract ridicule. Also it infuriates the opposition, which then reacts to your advantage."
Notes on Saul Alinsky and Neo-Marxism:
Alinsky's tactics were based, not on Stalin's revolutionary violence, but on the Neo-Marxist strategies of Antonio Gramsci, an Italian Communist. Relying on gradualism, infiltration and the dialectic process rather than a bloody revolution, Gramsci's transformational Marxism was so subtle that few even noticed the deliberate changes.
Like Alinsky, Mikhail Gorbachev followed Gramsci, not Lenin. In fact, Gramsci aroused Stalins's wrath by suggesting that Lenin's revolutionary plan wouldn't work in the West. Instead the primary assault would be on Biblical absolutes and Christian values, which must be crushed as a social force before the new face of Communism could rise and flourish. Malachi Martin gave us a progress report:
"By 1985, the influence of traditional Christian philosophy in the West was weak and negligible.... Gramsci's master strategy was now feasible. Humanly speaking, it was no longer too tall an order to strip large majorities of men and women in the West of those last vestiges that remained to them of Christianity's transcendent God."
From this link: http://www.crossroad.to/Quotes/communism/alinsky.htm