Evidence for God from Science

Ivellious wrote:Grace, what Rick just said is exactly the point I made earlier. You can't say Muslims worship a different God on the grounds that they don't accept Jesus as their lord, because that is essentially the only difference between Christians and Jews (Judaism does not accept Jesus as the Messiah). By saying that "Allah" is never mentioned in our Bibles, you must also reconcile with the fact that Jews call their God a name other than "God" (there are several spellings). Just because different people call it something different doesn't automatically change what it is. It's just a difference in language.

God is absolute! He is not just a name and He is found only in the Bible and never in the Koran.

The next poster says that Allah means god in Arabic. That does not make him Jehovah. Language does not make a person who he is, He is who He is. He says,

"I Am that I Am" so there is no argument that God is God absolutely, semantics do not change that.

I think if a person was really interested they could compare the works of Allah in the Koran and the works of God in the Bible. They will not equate.

For Christians this is important, for non Christians it does not matter.

Actually, you are wrong on one point. The Koran does specifically name Allah as the same God as the Jews and the Christians worship. It does in fact make that statement.

The ultimate question, as raised earlier, is the varying interpretations of God. Each of the three religions absolutely says they worship a monotheistic "God." Christians and Jews certainly agree that they worship the same God. The main difference in interpretation is that Judaism does not accept Jesus as God's son, the Messiah. Now, Islam claims to worship the same God as the "people of the book," albeit they do portray this God in a different way. Like Jews, they also disagree with Christians regarding Jesus's place as the Lord.

It's interesting, even Christians and Jews are divided on the matter of whether Islam worships the same God as them. I read one Jewish leader in the US who said he believed Islam does indeed worship the same God, but that they worship Him and interpret Him differently, and in his faith it was "wrong." He made it clear that he felt exactly the same about Christianity. Interestingly, he was very non-confrontational about it. He saw it less as a matter of salvation and was open about how even though he believed Christians and Muslims were wrong on the details, they were still absolutely viable methods of forming a spiritual connection with God. The way both he and I see it, all three religions can look at the other two and clearly say "Yes, you say you worship the same God as me, but I think you are wrong about who God is."

Ivellious wrote:The Koran does specifically name Allah as the same God as the Jews and the Christians worship.

You are right here but the Koran is a book of lies. To wit,

They do blaspheme who say,
''Allah is Christ the son
Of Mary.'' But said Christ:
''O Children if Israel!
Worship Allah my Lord
And your Lord.'' ...

They do blaspheme who say:
''Allah is one of three
In a Trinity'': for there is
No god except One God.
... (exepts from sura 5:72-73, The Holy Qur'an, translated by 'Abdullah Yusuf Ali.)

My Koran is a study Koran and the footnotes on the above explain that Mary never claimed to be the ''Mother of God'' or that her son was God, neither did Jesus for that matter. Jesus always maintained that he was a Messenger in need of Allah's forgiveness. Footnote #784 is almost funny:

''Note how logically the argument has led from Jewish backslidings [into idolatry] and want of faith, to blasphemies associated with the names of Jesus and Mary [that they are God and Mother of God]...Allah is One; His Message is One; yet how people's perversity transforms truth into falsehood, religion into superstition!''

The Christians who read footnote 784 will appreciate the subtle mixing of truth with a lie. Truly, the Koran is the work of a Master Liar.

FL

So what you say is, the footnotes lie. Big deal. The source material says what it says. It highlights that Muslims believe it is a lie to say that Jesus was the son of God, and it is a lie that Jesus was God. You disagree because you are Christian. Again, Jews believe the same thing as Muslims on that point. Does that make their beliefs "lies"?

I think you are getting away from the point. I say all three religions worship the same God, but believe different things about who or what God is and how to worship Him.

http://www.letusreason.org/islam6.htm

According to the Encyclopedia of Religion, Allah corresponded to the Babylonian god Baal, and Arabs knew of him long before Mohammed worshipped him as the supreme God. Before Islam the Arabs recognized many gods and goddesses, each tribe had their own deity. There were also nature deities. Allah was the god of the local Quarish tribe, which was Mohammed's tribe before he invented Islam to lead his people out of their polytheism. Allah was then known as the Moon God, who had 3 daughters who were viewed as intercessors for the people into Allah. Their names were Al-at, Al-uzza, and Al-Manat, which were three goddesses; the first two daughters of Allah had names which were feminine forms of Allah. Hubal was the chief God of the Kaaba among the other 360 deities. Hubal was the chief God of the Kaaba among the other 360 deities. Hubal was a statue likeness of a man whose body was made of red precious stones whose arms were made of gold. (Reference Islam George Braswell Jr.)

As a Christian I know who it is that I worship. I can say without any doubt that it is not Allah. It is the One who claims this:

Revelation 22:13
I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.

First of all, referencing Christian websites (likely with heavy anti-Islam agendas) that reference things written by non-Muslims is a really shaky argument to base your history on.

Tell me Grace, why is it so frightening to you to fathom that some non-Christians out there might also believe in your God? Or even worship your God? You act as if it is some offense, or that it threatens you personally.

Ivellious,
I would welcome non Christians and those who worship Allah into the family of my God. "Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved." Acts 4:12

"For God (not Allah) so loved the world that he gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes on Him should not perish but have everlasting life. John 3:16 (my parenthesis)

Ivellious wrote:Jews believe the same thing as Muslims [regarding Jesus]. Does that make their beliefs "lies"?

It makes their beliefs regarding Jesus wrong.

Ivellious wrote:I think you are getting away from the point. I say all three religions worship the same God, but believe different things about who or what God is and how to worship Him.

It makes sense that someone who does not know God would say such a thing.

FL