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Re: Romans 5:18-21
Posted: Mon Jul 23, 2012 9:35 pm
by 1over137
Furstentum Liechtenstein wrote:1over137 wrote:So, also Adam has hardened his heart that much? At the beginning he was made perfect. Then he sinned and then he hardened his heart.
I agree with the middle sentence in
boldface but have reservations about the other two. I'll deal only with the middle sentence tonight:
The Bible doesn't specifically say that Adam was made perfect - like Lucifer - but Adam's perfection can certainly be inferred from the text. Adam, like Lucifer, represent God's highest creations in their respective realms. That they were created perfect and yet went against God's will. In Adam's case, he was created intelligent, immortal, had the Spirit of God within him, and he walked and talked with God face-to-face. (This brief description is remarkably similar to what the Eternal State will be like.) The only motivation for Adam's sin is a freewill choice on his part to go against God's will.
Since this subject seems to interest you, I suggest you get yourself a copy of Augustine's
City of God. Adam's original sin and its imputation to all his descendents is masterfully explained by Augustine. Here are my suggestions:
City of God, Book XII, Chapter 21, dealing with the imputation of sin to all of Adam's descendents.
City of God, Book XXI, Chapter 12, dealing with the nature of the original sin and explaining why eternal punishment is due to all who are not covered by the Savior's grace.
FL
I found the book here:
http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf102/Page_Index.html
The two chapters start at page 241 and 463. Gonna read it.
Re: Romans 5:18-21
Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 10:43 am
by 1over137
from City of God, Book XXI, Chapter 12:
"But eternal punishment seems hard and unjust to human perceptions, because in the weakness of our mortal condition there is wanting that highest and purest wisdom by which it can be perceived how great a wickedness was committed in that first transgression. The more enjoyment man found in God, the greater was his wickedness in abandoning Him; and he who destroyed in himself a good which might have been eternal, became worthy of eternal evil. Hence the whole mass of the human race is condemned; for he who at first gave entrance to sin has been punished with all his posterity who were in him as in a root, so that no one is exempt from this just and due punishment, unless delivered by mercy and undeserved grace;"
What do you think about the part in bold? Adam had good in himself and after doing the sin, there was no more good in him? Seems like he really hardened his heart.
Re: Romans 5:18-21
Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 3:45 pm
by Furstentum Liechtenstein
1over137 wrote:What do you think about the part in bold? Adam had good in himself and after doing the sin, there was no more good in him? Seems like he really hardened his heart.
From a divine perspective, once you do wrong, you are no longer good. This is why the Psalmist says, ''there is no one who does good, not even one.'' (Ps 14:3) So, you are correct when you say that there was no more good in Adam. If you turn to
The City of God, Book XII, Chapter 3, you'll see that Augustine seems to have come to the same conclusion you have, in that man hardens his own heart by disobeying God. The introductory sentence of this chapter is,
That the enemies of God are so, not by nature, but by will, which, as it injures them, injures a good nature; for if vice does not injure, it is not vice.
In modern English, this would be,
Those who hate God hate Him by an act of will. As this hatred hurts them, it damages their very nature; for if vice does not pervert, it is not vice.
Well, 1/137, thanks for showing me all of this!
FL