Only 2 daughters in 70 souls?

[RickD]

Hana, look at these translations of the verse your friend is questioning:
http://bible.cc/genesis/2-7.htm

God breathed into man's nostrils, and he became a living soul, or being, or person, or creature.
The text isn't saying that God breathed a "soul" into man. Man is a soul. Our souls are what we are. The soul is our mind, will, and emotions.

[1over137]

My friend says, he breathed into Adam and not into Eve. That's it. He also says that in the past priests claimed that woman has no soul because of Genesis 2.

[Jac3510]

You should ask him why on earth he thinks that being made from Adam's rib would mean she didn't have a soul. That's one heck of a leap. There are also philosophical reasons for thinking that a human without a soul is a self-contradiction, but you don't need to get into positive arguments at this stage.

He says that God did not breathed 'the breath of life' into her.

But how does it follow from that, that Eve had no soul? Why does he think that in order to have a soul, the text must say that God "breathed the breath of life" into them? How did he come to that conclusion?

[PaulSacramento]

My friend says, he breathed into Adam and not into Eve. That's it. He also says that in the past priests claimed that woman has no soul because of Genesis 2.

Priests can be dumber than door knobs.
Any priest that would claim this fall under that category.

[RickD]

Hana, let's take your atheist friend's interpretation, a little further. If God breathed a soul into Adam, and not into Eve, it also stands to reason, that every other person after Eve, has no soul either. So, under your friend's interpretation, it's not only all women that don't have souls, all men after Adam don't either.

[1over137]

Hana, let's take your atheist friend's interpretation, a little further. If God breathed a soul into Adam, and not into Eve, it also stands to reason, that every other person after Eve, has no soul either. So, under your friend's interpretation, it's not only all women that don't have souls, all men after Adam don't either.

And that's a contradiction with rest of the Bible and Bible cannot be true ...

[RickD]

Hana, according to you, your friend's argument was this:

My atheist friend says that God breathed into Adam the breath of life and woman created from his bone. Therefore man has soul whereas woman not. Thoughts?

My point is that according to your friend's logic, that women don't have souls, nobody except Adam has a soul. Because, Adam was the only one who God breathed into. So, if Eve doesn't have a soul(because God didn't breathe into her nostrils), then none of us, man nor woman, has a soul either, because God didn't breathe into our nostrils. So, by your friend's faulty argument, he would have to logically conclude that nobody who ever lived has a soul, except Adam. Do you see how ridiculous that is?

The problem is that your friend's interpretation is flawed from the beginning. A soul is made up of mind, will, and emotions. Hana, do you have a mind, will, and emotions? I know I do. So, you do have a soul.

[Icthus]

He also says that in the past priests claimed that woman has no soul because of Genesis 2.

Actually, I'm not sure if this is quite true. While I do know of some instances several centuries ago in which this was seriously argued, it was argued by a small minority and was strongly opposed by the established Churches (Catholicism, The Church of England, Eastern Orthodox, etc). It never, even unofficially, became part of Christian teaching for any significant group that I am aware of, and the most famous essay claiming that women don't have souls was, if I recall, a parody.

[Jac3510]

Her friend has no logic. He's assuming that breathing the breath of life into Adam is what gave Adam a soul. There is no basis for that assertion. And even if you could make the case (which you can't) it's an argument from silence. Just because the text doesn't say God didn't breathe the breath of life into Eve, it does not follow that He did not do so.

Anyway, all of this even further makes same major assumptions about the soul that may not even be biblical. We don't even know what her friend means by "soul." Does he mean some ghosty thing that lives inside of the body? If so, then I'd agree that Eve has no soul. I'd go further and say that Adam didn't. The OT doesn't view souls that way. If that is what he means by soul (and it sounds like it), then he's just taking a Greek concept and reading it back into the text. Yay for yet ANOTHER problem with this so-called "argument."

There's a reason I don't take many non-theists seriously anymore. Most are more interested in playing "gotcha" and trying to play genuinely silly games than they are in having real conversation.

I know that last sentence comes across as harsh. And it is. But some atheists (NOT ALL) really are just silly. I wouldn't say that to their face (well, maybe I might). That's just rude. But it's why I have a hard time taking some of them seriously. I should also add that it doesn't make Christians silly for interacting with them on such silly games. Imprudent, perhaps, but not silly. It takes a little bit of time before you can learn to recognize honest and genuine difficulties with Scripture (and they exist) from the ridiculous ones. This, though, is just an example of the latter, and that on multiple levels.

Hana, I go back to my original advice. Don't argue with him (because he's not interested in having a discussion). Ask him a few simple questions. How does it follow that breathing the breath of life into Adam gave him a soul? How does it follow that the text not explicitly saying God did so with Eve that therefore He did not? What does he even mean by 'soul'? Where did he get that concept? He hasn't come anywhere near constructing an argument for us to respond to, much less a solid one we need to bother trying to refute. Don't do his work for him.

[1over137]

Jac, I am the one to help him with his work. (He is little silly, yes). I asked him your questions and rather will not continue in it but ask the following:

All: do you know of some passage from OT from which it follows that women have soul?

[PaulSacramento]

All: do you know of some passage from OT from which it follows that women have soul?

Hmmm, I don't recall a specific passage that states women have souls, or that Jesus has one either for that matter, LOL !
I don't recall any passage that states that women have a vagina but I think there is a pretty good chance they did in the bible !

[1over137]

[1over137]

Hannah had for example soul:
1Sa 1:15-16.
Also see 1Samuel 1:10 (NKJV)
"10 And she was in bitterness of soul, and prayed to the Lord and wept in anguish."

[Jac3510]

Jac, I am the one to help him with his work. (He is little silly, yes). I asked him your questions and rather will not continue in it but ask the following:

All: do you know of some passage from OT from which it follows that women have soul?

Sure. Here's a few:

Cf. 1 Pet 3:20 with Gen. 7:7. See also Gen 35:18; Num 30:4-12 (every verse except 9 refers to the woman's soul); 1 Sam 1:10, 15, 26; 2 Ki 4:27

Hannah had for example soul

Appropriate, isn't it?

[1over137]

Hannah had for example soul

Appropriate, isn't it?

And today is my nameday.