Evidence for God from Science

Posted: **Tue Apr 01, 2014 3:13 pm**

Danieltwotwenty wrote:
RickD wrote:
Danieltwotwenty wrote:I actually can't wait to see it, I never expected an accurate portrayal of the story so I have no illusions of what it will be like.
I think it will be a good thing, even though it is not accurate, it still opens up dialogue between believers and non-believers which is all ways a good thing.

Ken Ham is at his usual best, trying to spread fear, the persecution complex and dare I say hatred.

When he comes out and says:

"Friends, last night I watched the Hollywood (Paramount) movie Noah. It is much, much worse than I thought it would be - much worse. The director of the movie, Darren Aronofsky, has been quoted in the media as saying that Noah is 'the least biblical biblical film ever made,' and I agree wholeheartedly with him. I am disgusted. I am going to come right out and say it: this movie is disgusting and evil --- paganism!

Do you really want your family to see a pagan movie that portrays Noah as a psychopath who says that if his daughter-in-law's baby is a girl then he will kill her as soon as she's born? And when two girls are born, bloodstained Noah (the man the Bible calls 'righteous' in <a data-purpose="bible-reference" data-version="nasb95" data-reference="Genesis 7.1" href="http://biblia.com/bible/nasb95/Genesis%207.1" class="rtBibleRef">Genesis 7:1</a>) brings a knife down to the head of one of the babies to kill her-and at the last minute doesn't do it. And then a bit later, Noah says he failed because he didn't kill the babies. How can we recommend this movie and then speak against abortion? Psychopathic Noah sees humans as a blight on the planet and wants to rid the world of people. ... Oh, and it is also a boring movie-yes, boring! Worst movie I think I've ever seen.

The movie begins with (and also states later on), 'In there beginning there was nothing.' However, the Bible states, 'In the beginning God' (<a data-purpose="bible-reference" data-version="nasb95" data-reference="Genesis 1.1" href="http://biblia.com/bible/nasb95/Genesis%201.1" class="rtBibleRef">Genesis 1:1</a>). That really sums up the difference! ... I feel dirty-as if I have to somehow wash the evil off myself. I cannot believe there are Christian leaders who have recommended that people see this movie." ~ Ken Ham, Answers In Genesis
I have put in bold all the parts that I think are troubling, the vitriol coming from him is just astounding, I mean you can disagree with something without alienating, attacking and calling people names, where is the love and compassion of Christ in his words, where is the humbleness.
Daniel,

I reread the article, and I missed where Ken Ham was calling people names. In fact, I didn't even see any attacking.
The more I read this, the more I agree with Ham on this one.
If the filmmaker wants to twist scripture to make a movie he profits off of, he deserves all the backlash he gets.

Ken Ham called them Pagans, that's pretty much name calling if you ask me.

Read the below statement that I quoted from the AIG website, written on Ken Ham's blog.

http://blogs.answersingenesis.org/blogs ... -paganism/

Ok, I'm missing it. I read the article again, and I didn't see anyone calling anyone a Pagan. From the article:

I am disgusted. I am going to come right out and say it: this movie is disgusting and evil—paganism! Do you really want your family to see a pagan movie that portrays Noah as a psychopath who says that if his daughter-in-law’s baby is a girl then he will kill her as soon as she’s born?

He said the movie is Paganism. Yes, even "evil-Paganism".

Daniel,

I think you know I've been one of the most, if not the most outspoken critic on this forum, of Ken Ham. But, I really see nothing to criticize him on with this. Except for maybe a little dramatic flair in his article.

You took issue with this:

this movie is disgusting and evil --- paganism!

According to the director of the movie, Darren Aronofsky, he says his own movie is 'the least biblical biblical film ever made'.

You also took issue with this:

. I feel dirty-as if I have to somehow wash the evil off myself. I cannot believe there are Christian leaders who have recommended that people see this movie.

Other than being a little dramatic, I don't see the issue with this either. He thought it was a bad movie. He thought it was anti biblical.

And Daniel,

please don't tell Jac that I'm agreeing with Ken Ham. Jac will never let me live it down!

Signed,

Anonymous

Posted: **Tue Apr 01, 2014 3:37 pm**

Rick if you called something pagan then logically it follows that the person who made it would be a pagan.

I think you misunderstanding what I am saying, I don't take issue with Ken Ham speaking out against it, I take issue with the way he does it.

I just don't see any need for the hatred, name calling and general incitement his words produce.

I guess we will have to agree to disagree, but I assure you his words have already had a negative effect on people I know personally by causing that us and them mentality.

Posted: **Tue Apr 01, 2014 3:51 pm**

Rick if you called something pagan then logically it follows that the person who made it would be a pagan.

Danieltwotwenty wrote:Rick if you called something pagan then logically it follows that the person who made it would be a pagan.

I think you misunderstanding what I am saying, I don't take issue with Ken Ham speaking out against it, I take issue with the way he does it.

I just don't see any need for the hatred, name calling and general incitement his words produce.

I guess we will have to agree to disagree, but I assure you his words have already had a negative effect on people I know personally by causing that us and them mentality.

And again, I've had an issue with what Ken Ham writes. I just can't see the issue with this one.

I think you're grasping at straws with this one.

If a movie maker can twist scripture as a means to promote a message, or make money off the misrepresentation of scripture, then I think we as Christians need to bring it to light. And if there's any hatred in Ham's article, it's pretty clear the hatred is directed at the movie. He said it's the worst movie he's ever seen. Apparently Ham has never seen Skyline, or Pain and Gain.

Posted: **Tue Apr 01, 2014 4:06 pm**

RickD wrote:I think you're grasping at straws with this one.

There is no straw grasping, I have seen first hand the attitudes of some Christians I know after they read the blog, it has created a further divide between them and the secular crowd, this whole us vs them attitude is not going to bring people to Christ.

If a movie maker can twist scripture as a means to promote a message, or make money off the misrepresentation of scripture, then I think we as Christians need to bring it to light.

As I have said quite a few times now (don't know why you keep repeating it) I totally agree, I just don't agree with Ken Ham's execution of that.

And if there's any hatred in Ham's article, it's pretty clear the hatred is directed at the movie.

I don't think it is clear at all, when you call something someone has made as evil and pagan that is a reflection of the person or people who made it, it creates an us vs them attitude.
I think Proverbs says it all.
Proverbs 15:1

Posted: **Tue Apr 01, 2014 4:29 pm**

Daniel,
This was supposed to be about Ham's response to the movie. Now I feel I have to point out how you are speaking out of both sides of your mouth. On one hand, you agreed with me that these biblical misrepresentations need to be brought to light, when you responded to me here:

RickD wrote:
If a movie maker can twist scripture as a means to promote a message, or make money off the misrepresentation of scripture, then I think we as Christians need to bring it to light.

Daniel responded:

As I have said quite a few times now (don't know why you keep repeating it) I totally agree, I just don't agree with Ken Ham's execution of that.

And out of the other side of your mouth, you said responding to Ivellious here:

Ivellious wrote:

I feel like I have to ask, what did anyone expect from this movie that makes them so upset that the film includes "artistic liberties" to make it more appealing to the audience? After all, if the film actually followed the biblical story verbatim, with no alterations or additions, it would be a dreadfully boring movie with dull (if not totally nonexistent) characters, and most of the film would involve literally nothing more than some people building a big boat...Either that or the whole film would be 15 minutes long.

I can't imagine even the most diehard Christian movie fans getting excited for a movie that followed the biblical story without any liberties taken.

And your response(I took the liberty to bold the part that I'm referring to)

:

Exactly Ivellious, I already expected the to be liberties taken, it was never meant to be a Christian movie.

People are up in arms for absolutely no reason, nothing to see here folks.

So, we should as Christians, bring to light any scriptural misrepresentations...

And at the same time, when people get upset about those biblical misrepresentations, and bring them to light, you respond by saying:

People are up in arms for absolutely no reason, nothing to see here folks.

Daniel,

I'm all for opening up dialog between believers and non-believers. But for the love of God man, grow a set of cojones* and stop waffling!!!

*For the record, there is no hatred intended in this joke.

Posted: **Tue Apr 01, 2014 4:37 pm**

I said people are up in arms for no reason, which I mean't people are getting overtly aggressive for no good reason.

I am not speaking out of both sides of my mouth, I agree with both Ivellious and yourself, I agree with Ivellious's point about people getting their noses way out of joint over something fairly minor and I agree with yours also that we should come out and say that it does not line up with the Biblical account.

Albeit in a much more Christ like manner, unlike what Ken Ham has done.

grow a set of cojones* and stop waffling!

The only waffling is coming from you, I have stayed on point the whole time, you however try to distract and misdirect the conversation, twisting what I say to mean what I did not intend.

I am standing up against the bully boy tactics of some Christians.

Posted: **Tue Apr 01, 2014 4:48 pm**

Daniel,

You have got me defending Ken Ham. That's something that I don't think anyone else has been able to do.

I think I'm going to go donate to Answers in Genesis now, to show my support for Mr. Ham. In fact, I'm going to make a donation and attach this bible verse to my donation:

20 Daniel said,

“Let the name of God be blessed forever and ever,
For wisdom and power belong to Him.

Posted: **Tue Apr 01, 2014 4:53 pm**

I dare you to buy a plank for the Ark.

Posted: **Tue Apr 01, 2014 9:42 pm**

Here is another opinion http://drbrianmattson.com/journal/2014/ ... -the-devil

Posted: **Tue Apr 01, 2014 9:49 pm**

Interesting stuff Hana, they should have called it Gnostic Noah.

Posted: **Wed Apr 02, 2014 5:18 am**

Danieltwotwenty wrote:I dare you to buy a plank for the Ark.

That sounds tempting because Ken Ham personally signs every plank! How can I resist?

I may buy a plank and put it in honor of Danieltwotwenty and Puffing Billy!!

Posted: **Wed Apr 02, 2014 2:16 pm**

http://biologos.org/blog/the-noah-movie
I think this is a better review of the movie, much more balanced and some interesting insights into the inspiration behind the story.

Posted: **Wed Apr 02, 2014 3:58 pm**

Danieltwotwenty wrote:I dare you to buy a plank for the Ark.

That sounds tempting because Ken Ham personally signs every plank! How can I resist?

And don't forget to stop by the Creation Museum's gift shop and get yourself a personal, Ham-autographed Barney the purple dinosaur (a hot seller, I'm told). It'll be easy to find, as it's right next to the "Little Tyke's Miniature Planetarium Kit (comes with its own fake starlight

).

Posted: **Wed Apr 02, 2014 4:17 pm**

Who would have thought, the EVIL movie Noah has help and atheist get closer to God.

Posted: **Wed Apr 02, 2014 4:43 pm**

Danieltwotwenty wrote:

Who would have thought, the EVIL movie Noah has help and atheist get closer to God.

Daniel,

You are trying soooo hard to find something positive in this movie.

The author only seems to understand his doubts about "god" better than before. In that article, he never mentioned being any closer to God.

Daniel,

You might find it easier to read the article if you take off your rose colored glasses.

I do admire your determination to try to find something good that came from that movie. Keep looking. I'm sure something will come along.

Evidence for God from Science

Ken Ham on Russell Crowe Noah Film

Re: Ken Ham on Russell Crowe Noah Film

Re: Ken Ham on Russell Crowe Noah Film

Re: Ken Ham on Russell Crowe Noah Film

Re: Ken Ham on Russell Crowe Noah Film

Re: Ken Ham on Russell Crowe Noah Film

Re: Ken Ham on Russell Crowe Noah Film

Re: Ken Ham on Russell Crowe Noah Film

Re: Ken Ham on Russell Crowe Noah Film

Re: Ken Ham on Russell Crowe Noah Film

Re: Ken Ham on Russell Crowe Noah Film

Re: Ken Ham on Russell Crowe Noah Film

Re: Ken Ham on Russell Crowe Noah Film

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Re: Ken Ham on Russell Crowe Noah Film

Re: Ken Ham on Russell Crowe Noah Film