Evidence for God from Science

OK, your from MA. You're very passionate about your team. Great. I'm not. But I do admire their achievements. And really, I think it was made into a far bigger deal than it should have been. But as to the question, I still think Brady lied.

From info in your link:

So, Brady and his equipment guys realize there is a big stink being made by the NFL over supposed deflation of game balls. AND the NFL investigators have in their possession a text from one of the two key equipment guys a "text message in which he calls himself “the Deflator.” How odd, eh? Ever known anyone to refer to themselves like that? And so after the uproar, there is a flurry of texts and emails between the equipment guys and Brady afterward, in which it is presumed they were discussing the situation over the deflation accusations. Further, instead of having to turn over his phone, "Ted Wells offered at one point to simply accept a collection of potentially relevant text messages and emails sent by Brady on his phone in lieu of examining the actual device." But he refused to do so. So, here a storm is brewing that questions the very integrity and honesty of Brady and the Patriots' equipment guys, in which A) turning over ONLY the relevant phone messages, if innocent, could have easily have eliminated such suspicion, but B) by refusing to, simply intensified it. Brady's integrity is on the line, has info available that, if innocent, could have revealed so. But what does he do? "Instead of accepting the offer and giving Wells a limited slice of the information Brady had sent and received (which, obviously, would have allowed Brady and Yee to conceal any incriminating messages, if they so desired), Brady persisted in his refusal to give Wells anything — and that decision greased the skids for the four-game suspension." And, Rick, THAT is why I still think he lied.

That's fine.

To me, he may or may not have lied. I just don't have any evidence that would be enough for me to call him a liar. I try not to call someone a liar, if I don't know for sure. People's reputations get ruined from stuff like that.

OK, to be fair, I will back up and say that while I think he lied, he might not have. But it just looks very bad when you have an opportunity to clear suspicions, in which refusing that opportunity will only intensify them, particularly given the possible negative repercussions. And it did more than that, it cost him and the Patriots four games. But the entire thing was bungled by the NFL, was handled very badly.

Wow, Rick, you're really into the Patriots - didn't see you as the sporting type.

Maybe, one day, on his tombstone, that equipment guy will have inscribed, "My balls were always correctly inflated."

Philip wrote:OK, to be fair, I will back up and say that while I think he lied, he might not have. But it just looks very bad when you have an opportunity to clear suspicions, in which refusing that opportunity will only intensify them, particularly given the possible negative repercussions. And it did more than that, it cost him and the Patriots four games. But the entire thing was bungled by the NFL, was handled very badly.

Wow, Rick, you're really into the Patriots - didn't see you as the sporting type.

Maybe, one day, on his tombstone, that equipment guy will have inscribed, "My balls were always correctly inflated."

That's the thing philip, he may or may not have lied. But, for Goodell to do what he did without any evidence is horrible. The players association basically agreed that he has the power to lay down punishment however he sees fit. Even without actual evidence. Remember, when Brady appealed Goodell's decision, the court basically laughed the case away on lack of evidence. So, in a court he was not guilty. But in the court of Goodell the god, he doesn't have to be proven guilty to be suspended, and have the team fined, and lose draft picks.

And yes Philip, the Patriots passed the Red Sox as my favorite team. But, I'm still a baseball fan.

I don't understand why there's even a rule about how much the regular balls have to be inflated. Why not just let every QB decide for himself? That's the definition of fair. Having them really hard gives an arbitrary advantage to the guys who like to throw a harder football. That's silly, especially since it's supposedly being done in the name of fairness.

Either way, that was an amazing Superbowl, and the Patsies are an incredible dynasty. That they've managed that level of success in the age of parity makes it even more amazing. And then add in that they lost a first round draft pick and lost Brady for 4 games but still went 14-2 and won the championship...

Wow.

And Phil, screw letting the lowly Falcons win one. For most of my life the lowly Pats were getting their butts kicked all over the field. Last I checked they were still under .500 as a franchise. So no, no mercy for the lowly anybody. Go Pats! Win another one!

edwardmurphy wrote:I don't understand why there's even a rule about how much the regular balls have to be inflated. Why not just let every QB decide for himself? That's the definition of fair. Having them really hard gives an arbitrary advantage to the guys who like to throw a harder football. That's silly, especially since it's supposedly being done in the name of fairness.

Either way, that was an amazing Superbowl, and the Patsies are an incredible dynasty. That they've managed that level of success in the age of parity makes it even more amazing. And then add in that they lost a first round draft pick and lost Brady for 4 games but still went 14-2 and won the championship...

Wow.

And Phil, screw letting the lowly Falcons win one. For most of my life the lowly Pats were getting their butts kicked all over the field. Last I checked they were still under .500 as a franchise. So no, no mercy for the lowly anybody. Go Pats! Win another one!

Are you a Pats fan?

RickD wrote:

edwardmurphy wrote:I don't understand why there's even a rule about how much the regular balls have to be inflated. Why not just let every QB decide for himself? That's the definition of fair. Having them really hard gives an arbitrary advantage to the guys who like to throw a harder football. That's silly, especially since it's supposedly being done in the name of fairness.

Either way, that was an amazing Superbowl, and the Patsies are an incredible dynasty. That they've managed that level of success in the age of parity makes it even more amazing. And then add in that they lost a first round draft pick and lost Brady for 4 games but still went 14-2 and won the championship...

Wow.

And Phil, screw letting the lowly Falcons win one. For most of my life the lowly Pats were getting their butts kicked all over the field. Last I checked they were still under .500 as a franchise. So no, no mercy for the lowly anybody. Go Pats! Win another one!

Are you a Pats fan?

Congrats Rick, as much as it pains me to say it, Brady and the Pats cemented their legacy as a dynasty equal to none, best of the best. I just have one question to ask you, what do you call the team that beat the best of the best, twice? I know, I know, lucky, right? As if luck had nothing to do with any of the Pats wins. I am so happy I am a Giants fan.

The ONLY pro sports team I have ever really go into was the Larry Bird era Celtics. I was fanatic about those games. Those series against the Lakers, after each game, I would be totally spent. Baseball is too slow. I like to watch the NFL and college football playoffs. College and pro basketball playoffs. But I view sports as entertainment. So seeing some team get killed year in and out - really, that's poor quality entertainment. But as for pros, the expansion of so many new franchises, players moving constantly, it's more difficult to identify as closely - unless you live very close to a pro team's home.

Byblos wrote:
Congrats Rick, as much as it pains me to say it, Brady and the Pats cemented their legacy as a dynasty equal to none, best of the best. I just have one question to ask you, what do you call the team that beat the best of the best, twice? I know, I know, lucky, right? As if luck had nothing to do with any of the Pats wins. I am so happy I am a Giants fan.

As a sports fan, it's really unbelievable what the Pats have done. In this age of free agency, I never thought this could happen.

As for the Giants, the 2007 team was a really good Giants team. They won something like their last 9 road games in a row, going into the Super Bowl. And Eli just played out of his a$$ that game.

I guess Eli played the same way in the other one they won too.

Philip wrote:The ONLY pro sports team I have ever really go into was the Larry Bird era Celtics. I was fanatic about those games. Those series against the Lakers, after each game, I would be totally spent. Baseball is too slow. I like to watch the NFL and college football playoffs. College and pro basketball playoffs. But I view sports as entertainment. So seeing some team get killed year in and out - really, that's poor quality entertainment. But as for pros, the expansion of so many new franchises, players moving constantly, it's more difficult to identify as closely - unless you live very close to a pro team's home.

In the 1980's, the celtics were my favorite team. I slowly lost interest in basketball after Bird retired. Then I completely lost interest when Jordan retired from the Bulls.

It is discouraging to have favorite players, only to have them leave for another team. I still have a Curtis Martin Patriots jersey I got when the Pats went to the Super Bowl against the Packers. Martin was my favorite player. Then the Pats didn't resign him, and he bolted for the hated Jets.

The era of "showtime" in the NBA was probably one of the greatest era in sports.
Giants played the Game and knew it was a game and understood how blessed they were to get paid to play a game.

It ended with Jordan leaving and players being more interested in their tattoos.

To me what really hurt the NBA was when the "slam dunk" mentality really took over, and a lot of young (but talented) hotdogs (Yep, like Koby) influenced the mindset of young pro athletes to far more desire making the news on a highlight footage than to play a top notch team game. Jordan kind of started that mindset, partially because he HAD to - he played on many bulls teams that sucked. The result, constant hotdogging, taking bad shot selections, ball-hogging, poor defense, always thinking first to go for the slam. And so the old school mentality - distribute the ball, look for the open man, be a selfless player - started to go away. The hotdog game began to be greatly influenced by guys like Jordan who could sometimes score a 50-point game. But that kind of basketball is star-dependent and rarely wins consistently long term.

The Bird/Ainge/McHale/Parish/DJ lineup - those guys were very talented, but far from the most athletic, but they won and WON! It's because, as good as they were, as they were considerably slower and less athletic than some other teams, yet were nonetheless likely the smartest pro basketball team to ever lace them up! Their ball rotation and movement was simply superb. They'd split the floor and pass all those young rockets into cardiac arrest, LOL! They NEVER quit. They had great shooters, rebounding and excellent defense. And Bird - I swear that guy had eyes in the back of his head - he could predict a pass before even the passer knew he was going to send it. But the Lakers and Magic/Kareem/Worthy - those guys were always a worthy opponent. What a joy those Laker/Celtic playoff games were! Crap - that was over 32 years ago. Yikes!

Yeah, I'm a Pats fan - born in CT, grew up in ME, and came back to NH about 12 years ago. I spent many Sundays at my grandparents' place watching the Pats come close and lose - the 3 and 9 team you didn't want to play, or so we told ourselves.

The Celtics - Lakers rivalry is another one of my cherished childhood memories. I watched a lot of games, and all of the playoff games, sitting on my grandparents' living room floor - there was never room on the furniture for kids. My aunt would turn down the sound on the TV and replace it with Johnny Most's radio call. That guy was great. He was the ultimate homer and he turned every game into an epic battle with Larry, Danny, Kevin, DJ, and the Chief facing down the forces of evil. Man, those were the days.

Ed: Man, those were the days.

You said it!

edwardmurphy wrote:Yeah, I'm a Pats fan - born in CT, grew up in ME, and came back to NH about 12 years ago. I spent many Sundays at my grandparents' place watching the Pats come close and lose - the 3 and 9 team you didn't want to play, or so we told ourselves.

The Celtics - Lakers rivalry is another one of my cherished childhood memories. I watched a lot of games, and all of the playoff games, sitting on my grandparents' living room floor - there was never room on the furniture for kids. My aunt would turn down the sound on the TV and replace it with Johnny Most's radio call. That guy was great. He was the ultimate homer and he turned every game into an epic battle with Larry, Danny, Kevin, DJ, and the Chief facing down the forces of evil. Man, those were the days.

A New England liberal...is there anything worse?