Evidence for God from Science

zacchaeus wrote:I've read all that before and would have to again, but saying stuff like... 'The bible only said herbs and seeds were for food... For animals, but it didn't say animals couldn't eat meat, or other aninals', you can't make assumptions for what isn't said, isn't there- that's at the point one reads into the scripture. The exact same verbage and use of words is used for humans... So if following that logic and rule of thumb it must be accepted to imply cannibalism on the same grounds you introduce carnivores... And you'd have to agree one would have to read that into the scriptures, that clearly isn't there

When GOD created everything it was perfect, and it was good... The tree not allowed to eat from was 'knowledge' of 'good and Evil'. They didn't even know they were naked- come on.

And what's been the goal from day 1- to eventually get everything back to how it was in the garden, where the lion lays with the lamb, and the serpent plays with the boy, and they do no harm to one another.

Are these not the basics, 101, you defer to

melanie wrote:We honestly do not have all the answers.
One way or the other.
Whether that be an entirely secular understanding of the origins of life or from a creationists standpoint and all the differing opinions therein.
It's speculation and interpretation.
What remains certain, not one of us knows for certain and from a Christian perspective I don't think that's an accident.
Do we throw our arms in the air and not bother to understand better, scientifically and/or scripturally of course not but every generation uncovers more of what was not known previously.
A dance for Christians between Intellectual honestly and scriptural interpretation.
There has to a balance otherwise the integrity of our faith is at stake. Not at a believers level because the truth of the gospel is found deeply rooted in a spiritual understanding but it has to tie in with what we know, which can be problematic because what we know no matter how cocky we get is limited and the intricacies go beyond our understanding.
But yet however limited our understanding is there is a need for science and scripture to not be in contradiction. Limited man with limited knowledge and understanding with imperfect interpretation trying to interpret the origins of life.
Never the best outcome for unified or correct understanding. But the pursuit of such is inspiring and necessary.

zacchaeus wrote:There's no mind to change- I haven't decided one way or the other, but its obvious I absolutely lean one way. However, I've been taught and sat under teachings of OEC by way of finnis Jennings dake doctrine for four years.

zacchaeus wrote:Too many questions, all of the above... Not a fan of science unless Scripture compliments it, and not a poplar going guy- just lead by the spirit on the teachings of His word!

B. W. wrote:Bumping the thread up...

Topic of creation days Has come up on the -- Do YECs accept "ordinary days"? Thread...

http://discussions.godandscience.org/vi ... &start=150

So to add to it here, again let us look at the 6th creation day account:

Genesis chapter Two concerning Adam and Eve creations, duties etc, all logically happened on the 6'th day of creation because the 7 day of creation had not come about due to the work going on and none resting.

So if this were are real 24 hour earth day period, then lets look at what happened.

The creation days all begin in the evening and end the following sundown. Therefore, this follows the narrative that God made animals and Adam sometime in the evening hours of the sixth day. He next brings all the animals before Adam to name.

How many of these species were there then? 10 or 50? or thousands upon thousandths? Well there are about 8.74 million animal species in today's world

http://news.discovery.com/earth/plants/ ... 110823.htm

You do the math. Back in creation say there were only one million, how long would it take to name them all?

Has this been considered by YEC's?

Maybe so but explained away in various ways no doubt.

As I mentioned prior:

The Six Day of creation, if it were a real 24 hour day then during those 24 hours, Adam would have named all the animals, been put to sleep and operated on, and woman made...

Now men, if there was the perfect women, and you gals, saw the perfect man before you - what would you be thinking?

Hubba hubba - Adam says .. a WOMAN and Eve says A MAN! Hubba hubba what's this I see let's.... hmmmm edited...

Imagine that God would intervene during this time and say, only have 24 hours, lot of animals to name, No you two back to work, all hanky panky later after the seventh day that is...

So during the evening hours, God made the Animals and Adam. Had Adam name these in the dark, then put him is deep sleep, make Eve, before dawn or at least by midday... There are how many species of animals around and could these be named in a 24 hour day as well as trending and keeping the Garden of Eden as well too?

Whew, I can't get that all done in one day - can you?

Then see your mate for the first time and all the yearning too?

.. Come on now, that was one heck of a 24 hour period wasn't it?

How many animals could Adam have named during a 24 hour day with the only rest being put to sleep by God and operated on by God then Eve?

Toss n the fall of man in the mix and what a heck of a day!

This defies logic. Yes, one can pass it off as a miracle and Adam was superman and Eve Lois Lane but that simply defies all logic of even miracles. Even if God made the sun to stand still, then the 24 hour day was much longer than 24 earth hours.

So explain how could all animals be named (character assigned is more likely than a mere name like elephant) in a 24 hour day, be put to sleep, operated on, and finding your perfect mate naked before you as well as tending too and keeping a really big garden all happen in a literal 24 hours?

So, how long then were all God's creation days?

zacchaeus wrote:Sorry, didn't see or remember your question about replenish/replete or male/mala I believe... Which means to fill, and in context says be 1)fruitful 2)multiply and 3)replenish (fill).

Now you may say I'm reading into the text when I say it doesn't say be ye re-fruitful, or re-multiply but context is king... And I don't see drawing a complete doctrine from a single word; seems dangerous.

The word used when Noah is commanded to replenish (meaning fill or even refill) would be appropriate in context, be it to fill, or refill considering we know there were people pre-noah.

Also... Other than maybe 5-6 translations, every other translation (20+) render the correct word 'fill' including my favorite the YLT.

Also "replenish" is wholly derived from Old French "repleniss-". And we didn't have an English word "plenish" to derive it from.

zacchaeus wrote:I feel like your flustered, lets regroup. I'm with you.

In context I think the law of first mention is,“And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so. And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good.” (Genesis 1:11-12 KJV) which seems to be a law and command of reproduction maybe?

so important that God seemingly establishes another law to help enforce it. Ye shall keep my statutes. Thou shalt not let thy cattle gender with a diverse kind: thou shalt not sow thy field with mingled seed: neither shall a garment mingled of linen and woollen come upon thee. (Leviticus 19:19 KJV)

However, I can't help but think of a cherbium...
In which I believe that everything created is already created in Heaven. In other words, everything is created after somethings image in heaven that already exists.

Though it seems like a diverting tactic, as you've quickly moved onto something else... I don't see the relevance of when angels were created, but find importance in why they were created. They witnessed creation but were obviously created outside of time, which again is a measurement for us. There's simply no speculation to the proposal especially when focus is on Gods dealings with mankind- not angels.