Evidence for God from Science

Tanyan wrote:I ask you to read this article by a Former LDS member now Evangelical Professor/Scholar who is critical of the standard witnessing techniques /Literature put out by evangelicals against LDS see: http://www.communiosanctorum.com/?p=19. May Grace Rain on you this Day.

Interesting... So are you trying to say some of the Teachings of the Book or Mormon are wrong? That article is great but the things in that article do not address the Question.

Tan, do you believe Jesus Christ is really Lucifer/Satan's brother?

ochotseat wrote: I respect the Mormon people, but I find some of their beliefs unsettling. Christians may be more receptive toward them if some of their beliefs were a bit closer to the Protestant/Roman Catholic/Orthodox Church or Messianic Judaism.

I can't believe I'm in agreement with Ocho.

I lived in Idaho for a time and some of the beliefs of the Mormon church just seem out there. For example, we were told that you get your own planet based on your work here on Earth. Where is this even implicitly stated in the Bible?

Most of you have noticed, and some of you have commented on the subtle name changes and definition modifications that the LDS engages in. There are quite a few, and I'll label a couple of them here:

Lord of Life
In His Debt -- Joseph Smith?
Celestial kingdom - Heaven (as I understand LDS doctrine, there are many levels)
sons of perdition
The Great Apostasy
Restoration of all things
Holy Priesthood - say what?

arretium wrote:I lived in Idaho for a time and some of the beliefs of the Mormon church just seem out there. For example, we were told that you get your own planet based on your work here on Earth. Where is this even implicitly stated in the Bible?

If my track record on keeping a fish-tank up and running is any indication, God's too smart and loving to give me my own planet.

Grace, Peace to all. For the record when I end my posts with the Phrase :"In His Debt" or use the Title's : "LORD OF LIFE", "Master" I am reffering to JESUS CHRIST, NOT JOSEPH SMITH. So please no more hints/suggestions that these phrases mean something other than they were intended. As to the web site I reffered you all to was in hopes of showing you a different perspective from a LDS critic who states that LDS do not have a different JESUS. As to Jesus/satans relationship yes there was a relationship but when satan was cast out of Heaven all ties were aborted and relationships severed. I suggest you obtain LDS Proffessor Robert Millet new book by eerdsmans Publisher entitled: Another Jesus ?, The Christ of the Latter Day Saints. It is my hope and prayer that Grace Rains on you all this Day/Night. In His Debt, Tanyan.[/u]

Tanyan wrote:Grace, Peace to all. For the record when I end my posts with the Phrase :"In His Debt" or use the Title's : "LORD OF LIFE", "Master" I am reffering to JESUS CHRIST, NOT JOSEPH SMITH. So please no more hints/suggestions that these phrases mean something other than they were intended. As to the web site I reffered you all to was in hopes of showing you a different perspective from a LDS critic who states that LDS do not have a different JESUS. As to Jesus/satans relationship yes there was a relationship but when satan was cast out of Heaven all ties were aborted and relationships severed. I suggest you obtain LDS Proffessor Robert Millet new book by eerdsmans Publisher entitled: Another Jesus ?, The Christ of the Latter Day Saints. It is my hope and prayer that Grace Rains on you all this Day/Night. In His Debt, Tanyan.[/u]

So there was a Brother Relationship? How can this be if Jesus/God Created Satan? I throughly Enjoyed reading that Website and thanks for Posting it. I am trying to understand your Thoughts on Mormonism. If the Website is correct then some of the Mormon Beliefs are not what All Mormons Believe. Is this Correct? What do you believe then?
I will leave my questions at that

Thanks for your reply in adavance

Grace and Peace be with you

In Christ

bizzt, Grace to you. I see it as the Father as the Creator of Lucifer, If Jesus created him then Jesus is the spirit Father of Lucifer. Both are Bene-ha-elohiem [Hebrews for Sons of GOD] . Which web site are you reffering to ?. There are those LDS who have been members all there life/Half there life/part of there life that do not know/understand LDS Doctrine/Thought/Teaching/Practice and do not present it correctly. Even after almost 30 yrs as being LDS I am still a work in progress. Anyway its late, ask me/remind me to tell what I believe as a LDS member. May GOD watch over you this night, In His Debt, Tanyan.

Tanyan wrote:I ask you to read this article by a Former LDS member now Evangelical Professor/Scholar who is critical of the standard witnessing techniques /Literature put out by evangelicals against LDS see: http://www.communiosanctorum.com/?p=19. May Grace Rain on you this Day.

This is what it says:

2) Because of the allowance of certain heresies within the Mormon religion, such as the denial of strict monotheism, redefinition of the Trinity, rejection of the eternal reality of God's divine status, Pelagian and semi-Pelagian soteriologies, and blurring of the Creator/creature distinction (errors which thankfully are not embraced by all Mormons, or not to the same degree) and because the Mormons do not validly baptize their converts (non-Trinitarian baptisms being invalid in the view of most Christians), I view Mormons the same way I view all unbaptized people who claim faith in Christ. They may well be saved according to God's secret decree, but they do not profess the true religion, and hence are not members of the visible Church (outside of which there is no “ordinary” possibility of salvation, as affirmed in the Westminster Confession of Faith). In short, my problem with the Mormons is not that they don't believe in the “real” Jesus (whatever that means), but that they are not baptized, professing members of the visible Church. And whereas people outside the visible Church may well be among the elect (and even regenerate in the secret individual sense), they are not outwardly recognizable as true Christians.

So according to your own source, Mormons are not "true Christians" if they don't completely adhere to the Bible.

arretium wrote: I can't believe I'm in agreement with Ocho.

?

Congratulations, you're evolving.

Tanyan wrote:bizzt, Grace to you. I see it as the Father as the Creator of Lucifer, If Jesus created him then Jesus is the spirit Father of Lucifer. Both are Bene-ha-elohiem [Hebrews for Sons of GOD]

Being a father and brother aren't the same thing.

Tan, check out this site:
http://www.lifeafter.org/
As a child of God, I'm trying as much as I can to accept Mormons as fellow Christians. But it's hard, because the LDS Church doctrines clash with Christian dogma.

ochotseat, peace to you and youres, thank you for your reply. LDS Doctrines/Teachings/Thought/Practice are "Christian" by my my lights and several million others inside the LDS Faith and many outside the LDS Faith. My Father was my brother also,as would be if I had a son he would be my brother as well [ Through Adam, and spiritualy if we both believed in the LORD OF LIFE CHRIST JESUS as well] . JesusChrist and satan are/were bene-hha-elohiem= sons of GOD, Jesus The Bright and Morning Star, satan a star of the morning.
I appriciate the time you took to read the article . LDS are Baptized by water [ In The Name of The Father, Son, Holy Ghost]as a similitude of the sacrifice of Jesus Christ to symbolicaly wash away our sins . Hands are layed on our heads to recieve the Gift of the Holy Ghost to clean/purge our inner vessel of sin and to have the Holy Ghost as our constant companion on conditions of worthiness. Thank you for the web site you reffered me to but once again all of the criticisms have been answered/responded to via Books/Journals/Working papers/Tracts/DVD'S/Videos/C.Ds/Cassette Tapes, Web sites such as http://www.shields-research.org. Perhaps you would be interested in attending one of our LDS apologetics confrences in the future. LDS critics are welcomed to attend, we have had 6 so far I believe and another is scheduled in the near future. Go to the http://F.A.I.R.org web site to see articles from past confrences and upcoming speakers and the papers/topics they will be addressing. Perhaps you and a friend can attend.
As a side note where are you from originaly and currently ?. Anyway must go now. I hope and pray that you have a Blessed day. Jesus is the Christ, The LORD OF LIFE, My Lord,Savior,God,King,Master. In His Debt, Tanyan

Oops !, the above link is incorrect for F.A.I.R, lets try this one : http://www.fairlds.org

Okay ""that" link works !. Go to the advertisement for the conference, click and see the speakers/topics. You can also read/download past papers. You may also wish to petition to be able to post on our message board to ask your questions and make statements/comments as long as they are within the rules guidlines [Which you would have to read and agree to before you were allowed to post]. Take care. In His Debt, Tanyan.

Tanyan Wrote

"Even after almost 30 yrs as being LDS I am still a work in progress"


Tanyan,

It's time you began to eat some meat. Most of all of your other posts, which pointed to many websites as answers to all of our questions, led me to believe you were a babe in joe smith.

After 30 years, you need to be able to tell us what YOU feel, not point us to a website.

What if someone I met asked me about my faith, do you think I'm gonna share Christ with him or tell him to go to a website.

Maybe that's the difference between mormonism and real Christianity.

We're all a work in progress, but we need to be learning what we believe, I'm not sure you have formulated your own ideas yet.

In the name of Jesus

Tanyan wrote:bizzt, Grace to you. I see it as the Father as the Creator of Lucifer, If Jesus created him then Jesus is the spirit Father of Lucifer. Both are Bene-ha-elohiem [Hebrews for Sons of GOD] . Which web site are you reffering to ?. There are those LDS who have been members all there life/Half there life/part of there life that do not know/understand LDS Doctrine/Thought/Teaching/Practice and do not present it correctly. Even after almost 30 yrs as being LDS I am still a work in progress. Anyway its late, ask me/remind me to tell what I believe as a LDS member. May GOD watch over you this night, In His Debt, Tanyan.

So did the Father Create Jesus? The Last Website you linked to that had a Criticism of Mormon Belief.

Reminder to tell me what You believe as a LDS member

Thanks

In Christ

Tim

Tan,
I've always been a Christian. After finding out about Mormons, they seem more pagan than Christian in some of their beliefs.
Your father is not your brother. Look in the dictionary if you cannot accept this. Out of 2.1 billion Christians worldwide, Mormons make up about 10 million, because the LDS Church tenets are too different for most Christians to accept.

CountryBoy wrote:Tanyan Wrote

"Even after almost 30 yrs as being LDS I am still a work in progress"


Tanyan,

It's time you began to eat some meat. Most of all of your other posts, which pointed to many websites as answers to all of our questions, led me to believe you were a babe in joe smith.

After 30 years, you need to be able to tell us what YOU feel, not point us to a website.

What if someone I met asked me about my faith, do you think I'm gonna share Christ with him or tell him to go to a website.

Maybe that's the difference between mormonism and real Christianity.

We're all a work in progress, but we need to be learning what we believe, I'm not sure you have formulated your own ideas yet.

In the name of Jesus

I've noticed that too. Tan needs to share her personal opinions instead of listing site after website.

ochotseat wrote:Tan,
I've always been a Christian. After finding out about Mormons, they seem more pagan than Christian in some of their beliefs.
Your father is not your brother. Look in the dictionary if you cannot accept this. Out of 2.1 billion Christians worldwide, Mormons make up about 10 million, because the LDS Church tenets are too different for most Christians to accept.

If my Father Knew Christ then he would be a Brother through Christ would he not. He is my Earthly Father but my Spirtual Brother. I don't know if that makes sense but hope it does