Evidence for God from Science

No, my comment was not about gender. God is above gender. It speaks to your weak spiraitual ideas that you bring your "hipness" to define God. I wasn't interpreting *dude* to imply gender, but rather an idea that God, as a hip dude, would be cool with sin.

God is not nebulous or unknown. Who says that we are made in the image of God? You're darn right it's the Bible. YOur definition of God is not in scripture and, as HArry as brougth up, the scriptures are important to him. To one who earnestly struggles, you reply "Hey go for it, God is a dude too".

And my reply was simply to point out, your comment has absolutely nothing to do with any sort of CHristianity.

zoegirl wrote:..God is not nebulous or unknown. Who says that we are made in the image of God? You're darn right it's the Bible. YOur definition of God is not in scripture and, as HArry as brougth up, the scriptures are important to him. To one who earnestly struggles, you reply "Hey go for it, God is a dude too".

And my reply was simply to point out, your comment has absolutely nothing to do with any sort of CHristianity.

Ditto !!!!

You Zoe Girl
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NIK wrote:Why don't you try making love to a Man and then decide? You can always repent. We are all equal in the eyes of God even if you do like a bit of **** once in a while. What says people were made in the image of God? The bible. So stop worrying and get a sex life. No one knows what God will say when you meet him. Maybe He'll enlighten you and tell you to be yourself. God is a dude man.

I wasn't talking about sex; I specifically addressed that in the OP. Oh, and I belive the Bible is the infallible word of God, so the whole 'no one knows what God will say' statement doesn't ring true for me; if I 'made love' (read 'committed sodomy') with a man, I can make a pretty astute guess as to what God will have to say on the issue.

Hi, Harry!
Sorry I'm just coming into this conversation.
First let me say that I am a heterosexual Christian male, happily married. I have had homosexual sex prior to my salvation and marriage, so I understand a lot of what Harry is going through. Lust is a difficult emotion for all of us and it's easy to equate lust and love...anyone will tell you. It is only through the grace of God, through Christ, that I am faithful to my wife and content with my marriage. Temptation stalks all of us, every day.
Harry, you seem to have your situation fully understood (not looking for sex; looking for love) and the responses here are supportive and right on target. Thinking back, I realize I was looking for love and acceptance -- obviously somethings that can be found through Christ. Once I turned my will over to Him, fully, those "needs" to be loved by someone (anyone) diminished.
Then, and only then, did I meet the woman (also a Christian) who became my wife. It is a process. It does not happen overnight.
I will pray for you and your conflict.
That's the best I can offer. If you have any questions, please ask!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qkCkXU0e75k

Hey rodyshusband!

Thank you for your kind words. I need to be reminded that Christ can fulfill my needs, but in a Church full of married couples holding hands lovingly, this becomes hard to swallow at times. But onwards and upwards, you know!

You said you engaged in homosexual sex... but did you used to be an actual homosexual like me? I would like to ask you some follow up questions about your experiences, if you don't mind.

Harry12345 wrote:Hey rodyshusband!

Thank you for your kind words. I need to be reminded that Christ can fulfill my needs, but in a Church full of married couples holding hands lovingly, this becomes hard to swallow at times. But onwards and upwards, you know!

You said you engaged in homosexual sex... but did you used to be an actual homosexual like me? I would like to ask you some follow up questions about your experiences, if you don't mind.

Any sincere question that you need for clarification is welcomed!
I would have to ask: what is your definition of "homosexual"?...I presume it refers to one who is predisposed to being gay, sexually attracted to a member(s) of the same sex.
I can only speak for myself:
I wanted to be loved, by anyone. I also hated myself and believed I had to settle for whatever I could get. This applied to me and could apply to anyone, hetero or homo. I thought I wanted to be loved by a man but discovered that no man...or woman...could give me the love I needed. Once I realized this, I let go of all "needs" for a relationship.
Please note this carefully: I still hold many of my old "gay" traits: I care about how I look, I love Broadway shows, love to cook, cry at movies and see the differences between attractive and less attractive men (I know these are "stereotypes", but in all honesty, they are perpetuated by homosexuals themselves). The confusion, the sadness, the emptiness, the longing...all gone. The sexual desires, gone. My intimate times with my wife (who I find incredibly attractive), are beyond description. She is also my best friend. My point is, God has changed me, taken away the "negative" aspects of the homosexuality but kept my personality intact, brought my talents and gifts to the forefront.
I would be glad to answer your questions.

One comment about your post: Many of those married couples you see in church, smiling, holding hands and beaming at each other, are not necessarily fulfilled...don't be too jealous!

Any sincere question that you need for clarification is welcomed!
I would have to ask: what is your definition of "homosexual"?...I presume it refers to one who is predisposed to being gay, sexually attracted to a member(s) of the same sex.

To me, 'homosexual' means someone who is sexually attratced ONLY to members of the same sex.

I wanted to be loved, by anyone. I also hated myself and believed I had to settle for whatever I could get.

Woah! Where did you get those feelings, do you know? I think there are two ways people can be homosexual:
1) Lack of father figure or abuse as a child
2) Hormonal imbalance
I think I fall into the latter category, as my family was quite tightly knit when I was growing up. My parents have been happily married for 20+ years!

This applied to me and could apply to anyone, hetero or homo. I thought I wanted to be loved by a man but discovered that no man...or woman...could give me the love I needed. Once I realized this, I let go of all "needs" for a relationship.

That's my problem. I keep forgetting Christ can fulfill my needs. MUST remember that, no matter how hard!

Please note this carefully: I still hold many of my old "gay" traits: I care about how I look, I love Broadway shows, love to cook, cry at movies and see the differences between attractive and less attractive men (I know these are "stereotypes", but in all honesty, they are perpetuated by homosexuals themselves).

Ah, this is where I'm sure my homosexuality is purely a chemical and not emtional thing! I don't care about how I look (I comb my hair and that's it!) I don't like Broadway shows, cooking's boring and I don't really cry at anything. Of course I know the difference between a attractive man and a homely man.

The confusion, the sadness, the emptiness, the longing...all gone. The sexual desires, gone. My intimate times with my wife (who I find incredibly attractive), are beyond description. She is also my best friend. My point is, God has changed me, taken away the "negative" aspects of the homosexuality but kept my personality intact, brought my talents and gifts to the forefront.

That's so inspiring! If God can change you, he can definately change me. However, what I have to remain aware of is the fact that I didn't come to Jesus Christ for heterosexuality, I came for him. If He wants to change me, He will. If He doesn't he won't. I'm actually not that fond of the idea of marriage. I'd much rather focus on God, the Church and my career.

I would be glad to answer your questions.

Thanks!

One comment about your post: Many of those married couples you see in church, smiling, holding hands and beaming at each other, are not necessarily fulfilled...don't be too jealous!

How do you know this?

Harry12345 wrote:

Any sincere question that you need for clarification is welcomed!
I would have to ask: what is your definition of "homosexual"?...I presume it refers to one who is predisposed to being gay, sexually attracted to a member(s) of the same sex.

To me, 'homosexual' means someone who is sexually attratced ONLY to members of the same sex.

I wanted to be loved, by anyone. I also hated myself and believed I had to settle for whatever I could get.

Woah! Where did you get those feelings, do you know? I think there are two ways people can be homosexual:
1) Lack of father figure or abuse as a child
2) Hormonal imbalance
I think I fall into the latter category, as my family was quite tightly knit when I was growing up. My parents have been happily married for 20+ years!

This applied to me and could apply to anyone, hetero or homo. I thought I wanted to be loved by a man but discovered that no man...or woman...could give me the love I needed. Once I realized this, I let go of all "needs" for a relationship.

That's my problem. I keep forgetting Christ can fulfill my needs. MUST remember that, no matter how hard!

Please note this carefully: I still hold many of my old "gay" traits: I care about how I look, I love Broadway shows, love to cook, cry at movies and see the differences between attractive and less attractive men (I know these are "stereotypes", but in all honesty, they are perpetuated by homosexuals themselves).

Ah, this is where I'm sure my homosexuality is purely a chemical and not emtional thing! I don't care about how I look (I comb my hair and that's it!) I don't like Broadway shows, cooking's boring and I don't really cry at anything. Of course I know the difference between a attractive man and a homely man.

The confusion, the sadness, the emptiness, the longing...all gone. The sexual desires, gone. My intimate times with my wife (who I find incredibly attractive), are beyond description. She is also my best friend. My point is, God has changed me, taken away the "negative" aspects of the homosexuality but kept my personality intact, brought my talents and gifts to the forefront.

That's so inspiring! If God can change you, he can definately change me. However, what I have to remain aware of is the fact that I didn't come to Jesus Christ for heterosexuality, I came for him. If He wants to change me, He will. If He doesn't he won't. I'm actually not that fond of the idea of marriage. I'd much rather focus on God, the Church and my career.

I would be glad to answer your questions.

Thanks!

One comment about your post: Many of those married couples you see in church, smiling, holding hands and beaming at each other, are not necessarily fulfilled...don't be too jealous!

How do you know this?

Harry, please understand that anyone can change. Many have left the gay lifestyle and have changed their orientation, with the help and love of God through Jesus Christ. That's the good news.
However, for reasons unknown to us, change may take time. Many times, it is a process. For reasons known only to Him, He works on us on His time..not ours. That's the bad news (we can't always have what we want and need on our time table). As we know, God transcends our time..but He does continue to love us and understands our pains and confusion. he only asks that you trust Him completely. In today's day and culture, we are in a hurry, we are impatient and our faith is constantly being challenged, questioned and often, persecuted. He has changed me dramatically, but I still hold on to some of my old ways (impatience, opinionated at times when I should hold my tounge, etc.)..
I send you a PM, if that's okay.

Guess what they're showing in the UK:

http://www.e4.com/rickandsteve/



First 'Make Me a Christian' and now this... if it weren't for desperate housewives I would NOT watch E4.

Is this thread a joke? If you want love from a man, then go seek love from a man. Stop allowing this delusion of some non-existent "entity" to literally dictate and control your life. Your human emotions are the REALITY and they are useful guides to follow when considering moral correctness.

baneofchristianity wrote:Is this thread a joke? If you want love from a man, then go seek love from a man. Stop allowing this delusion of some non-existent "entity" to literally dictate and control your life. Your human emotions are the REALITY and they are useful guides to follow when considering moral correctness.

Very insightful, bane. Your wisdom is evidently ancestrally propagated. Too bad you had to leave.

baneofchristianity wrote:Is this thread a joke? If you want love from a man, then go seek love from a man. Stop allowing this delusion of some non-existent "entity" to literally dictate and control your life. Your human emotions are the REALITY and they are useful guides to follow when considering moral correctness.

Wow, let's hope some nutcase's emotions don't guide him/her to rape you or steal from you or murder you. According to your worldview this is perfectly acceptable and moral

Hi Harry12345 !

I do not see anything wrong with having a relationship with someone else (whatever gender they are). I had a deep, wonderfull and very beneficial relationship with another man in my youth, between 15 and 18 years of age. We never had sex together. He was/is homosexual and I am heterosexual. I was the first one to whom he had been able to declare his homosexuality, while at the time it was very difficult to speak about it. His father dismissing him and so on. We where very close.

If you do so, establish rules between the two of you and do not forget that what you ask always comes with the package.

Hoping I dont sound to moralistic, Here is a little story (and scuse my english I am a french native):

I had been asked by a friend (girl) to chaperone her in a kind of blind date she had been invited to. She felt secure knowing that I was somewhere in the bar watching what was going on with this guy who asked her for a date. I dont know if you ever happen to be in that kind of situation, but it must be one of the most boring thing to do in a life time After a drink or two I spotted a girl/woman at the other end of the bar. Everything around me stopped existing. The chaperon responsibility, my girlfriend I was supposed to protect, the guy who invited her, the bar, the world, the universe. She was the universe. I stared at her for hours. She was with other people but she did look at me here and then. I smiled at her few times, she smiled at me few times. The whole world was a marvelous place to live.

Suddenly, she puts her coat on and begin to walk in my direction. Whyle walking she did not a single time looked at me. And when almost in front of me, I realized that she never looked at me once and never smiled at me neither! It had been all in my imagination. So I grabbed her kindly by the arm and asked her stupidly:
- Where are you going?
She looked at me stunned:
- I am going to say bye to a friend and go home.
More stupidly I said:
- Can I go with you?
She said:
Sure!

So I followed her... to the table where this guy was sitting, to realize that he was in fact... her chaperon!

It was about 12 at night and here in Quebec the bars closes at 3am. So I figured out that I had plenty of time to talk to her, invite her for a few dances and, mostly, get rid of the chaperon. After a while... She got rid of him. At the time, then, it was very indecent to invite a woman to sleep with you the first night. So I told her:
- I would like you to come sleep in my house but just to sleep. I would like to have breakfast with you tomorrow morning at a little restaurant a few blocks from my place. I would like you to come with me for supper tomorrow night and then we will go to the cinema. I was truely and deeply sincere.
She said:
- Ok but we do not make love.
I said:
Ok

We made love untill noon! Had breakfast at the little restaurant, had supper and went to the cinema.
Our children are grownups now, a boy 27 and a girl 20.

We do a lot of thimgs together. We are very close and still very in love. Sex is still part of it. Tenderness is the most part of it.

What you ask always comes with the package.

Cheers,

Zebulon




.

David certainly had a close and intimate relationship with Jonathon, the son of King saul.


David laments his death saying, "I am distressed for you, my brother Jonathan; greatly beloved were you to me; your love to me was wonderful, passing the love of women." (2 Sam. 1:26).