Evidence for God from Science

DannyM wrote:

Gman wrote:To make a cell out of nothing? Tell me... Where are the instructions coming from to form it? How is it formed from inorganic matter and please provide sources.. Show me.. I want details.

Facundo wrote:Oh, so you think the abiogenesis theory states that nothing formed a cell? You're confusing the scientific abiogenesis theory with creatonism, that DOES say everything came out of a wizard's hat. Look the theory up.

Gman wrote:What's the matter, can't answer my questions? Scientific abiogenesis? Ok prove it... Because of the obvious problems abiogenesis is, at best, myth of modern science. At worst, abiogenesis is the lie we tell ourselves so we can pretend to know more about the origin of life than we actually do, we are fooling ourselves.

Gman, that's unfair...He can't answer your questions. He's tripped himself up already. He's a "critical thinker," Gman, and like most self-proclaimed "critical thinkers" he isn't actually thinking straight.

Nice christian virtues there! Very constructive critical analysis of the subject of the post! Keep it up, deluded one.

Facundo wrote:

DannyM wrote:

Gman wrote:To make a cell out of nothing? Tell me... Where are the instructions coming from to form it? How is it formed from inorganic matter and please provide sources.. Show me.. I want details.

Facundo wrote:Oh, so you think the abiogenesis theory states that nothing formed a cell? You're confusing the scientific abiogenesis theory with creatonism, that DOES say everything came out of a wizard's hat. Look the theory up.

Gman wrote:What's the matter, can't answer my questions? Scientific abiogenesis? Ok prove it... Because of the obvious problems abiogenesis is, at best, myth of modern science. At worst, abiogenesis is the lie we tell ourselves so we can pretend to know more about the origin of life than we actually do, we are fooling ourselves.

Gman, that's unfair...He can't answer your questions. He's tripped himself up already. He's a "critical thinker," Gman, and like most self-proclaimed "critical thinkers" he isn't actually thinking straight.

Nice christian virtues there! Very constructive critical analysis of the subject of the post! Keep it up, deluded one.

Please explain your 'objection'... And what's to criticise - you've come with nothing!

“The complexity of the simplest known type of cell is so great that it is impossible to accept that such an object could have been thrown together suddenly by some kind of freakish, vastly improbable, event. Such an occurrence would be indistinguishable from a miracle.”

Michael Denton, Evolution: A Theory in Crisis.

Ah, so you do believe in the m word?

Furstentum, where did you get the part about athiests being "stupid"? I checked my Bible, and couldn't find that. Did God tell you that personally? I would think that many athiests are very intelligent, and that may be why they don't believe in God. They are their own god, and don't want to answer to anyone but themselves. That is usually what man does without the presence of the Holy Spirit.

Facundo,

You might want to read over our Discussion Board guidelines before you go any further.

1. Right now, they have not been able to show that any sort of basic cell forms under conditions such as those proposed for early earth. At most, they have shown that some very basic organic molecules can form from some very strict conditions (and basic is an understatement), RNA can self-assemble and act as enzymes, and membranes can self-assemble (although this is hardly a surprise since their very chemistry would cause them to do so). No self-replicating membrane bound organism as yet has been made. (And for the record, why would this disprove the existence of God were they to do so??? All they would successfully show is that life requires some very strict conditions to be designed....a recipe, if you will, a...oh my goodness....a design!!

2. You have some awfully bizarre ideas of creationism if you suppose that it is simply the same as "pulling it out of a hat" and it reveal ignorance on your part. You want to come here and blast everyone for being ignorant and yet you reveal your very own ignorance in some very typical atheist rants about what they think Christianity and creationism is about.

3. And for the record, Christian values does not exclude pointing out fallacies in a person's thinking. Do you suppose we would simply roll over and wag our tails and lick your hands for your ignorant ideas about Christians?!?!??!

Speaking about getting personal, I wouldn't mind if someone would go up to that little machine talking God basher and just jiggle his plug (not pull his plug) but jiggle his plug (you know the plug that controls his little wheelchair thingy, laptop thingy, and that generator thingy that keeps the monster ALIVE! . Again not pull the plug, just lightly and ever so politely jiggle it just to show him that they mean business.

The End.

What?!?!??!

Talking about SH Zoe

I know that!! Still....What/??!??!

DannyM wrote:

Facundo wrote:

DannyM wrote:

Gman wrote:To make a cell out of nothing? Tell me... Where are the instructions coming from to form it? How is it formed from inorganic matter and please provide sources.. Show me.. I want details.

Facundo wrote:Oh, so you think the abiogenesis theory states that nothing formed a cell? You're confusing the scientific abiogenesis theory with creatonism, that DOES say everything came out of a wizard's hat. Look the theory up.

Gman wrote:What's the matter, can't answer my questions? Scientific abiogenesis? Ok prove it... Because of the obvious problems abiogenesis is, at best, myth of modern science. At worst, abiogenesis is the lie we tell ourselves so we can pretend to know more about the origin of life than we actually do, we are fooling ourselves.

Gman, that's unfair...He can't answer your questions. He's tripped himself up already. He's a "critical thinker," Gman, and like most self-proclaimed "critical thinkers" he isn't actually thinking straight.

Nice christian virtues there! Very constructive critical analysis of the subject of the post! Keep it up, deluded one.

Please explain your 'objection'... And what's to criticise - you've come with nothing!

“The complexity of the simplest known type of cell is so great that it is impossible to accept that such an object could have been thrown together suddenly by some kind of freakish, vastly improbable, event. Such an occurrence would be indistinguishable from a miracle.”

Michael Denton, Evolution: A Theory in Crisis.

Ah, so you do believe in the m word?

I already explained the concept of miracle I'm using in one of my previous posts. Read, then talk.

RickD wrote:Furstentum, where did you get the part about athiests being "stupid"? I checked my Bible, and couldn't find that. Did God tell you that personally? I would think that many athiests are very intelligent, and that may be why they don't believe in God. They are their own god, and don't want to answer to anyone but themselves. That is usually what man does without the presence of the Holy Spirit.

Actually, the bible itself basically says you're a fool if you don't believe. But it also says crushing your enemies's sons into rocks is acceptable, so go figure.

zoegirl wrote:Facundo,

You might want to read over our Discussion Board guidelines before you go any further.

1. Right now, they have not been able to show that any sort of basic cell forms under conditions such as those proposed for early earth. At most, they have shown that some very basic organic molecules can form from some very strict conditions (and basic is an understatement), RNA can self-assemble and act as enzymes, and membranes can self-assemble (although this is hardly a surprise since their very chemistry would cause them to do so). No self-replicating membrane bound organism as yet has been made. (And for the record, why would this disprove the existence of God were they to do so??? All they would successfully show is that life requires some very strict conditions to be designed....a recipe, if you will, a...oh my goodness....a design!!

2. You have some awfully bizarre ideas of creationism if you suppose that it is simply the same as "pulling it out of a hat" and it reveal ignorance on your part. You want to come here and blast everyone for being ignorant and yet you reveal your very own ignorance in some very typical atheist rants about what they think Christianity and creationism is about.

3. And for the record, Christian values does not exclude pointing out fallacies in a person's thinking. Do you suppose we would simply roll over and wag our tails and lick your hands for your ignorant ideas about Christians?!?!??!

1. So we've succesfully formed aminoacides and phospholypids, the basic structures of cells. Self-replicating RNA's not too far away and membranes spontanteously assemble. And we did all that in a 4 months experiment. Is it a leap to say, that even if the event itself is improbable it could potentially happen lots of times, given a million years?

Aminoacides were even found on comets, so an aminoacid supply could have fallen from the sky at one point in the history of earth meteor rain. And you're basically arguing that unsupervised abiogenesis doesn't prove god exists, while saying it's specific nature of formation implies god exists. Quite a contradiction there :/

2. Explain to me, then, the rational creation process of man according to creationism. Last time I checked, god wished for it. Awesome, all-explaining theory that is.

3. Well if you were so sure your ideas are the right ones, you could simply "wait for me to be ready to embrace (insert random religion concept)", or you could try and "help me", knowing that I'm going to hell and all that bullcrap. But instead, you choose to direct ad hominem attacks, avoid my arguments and ask me for proving negatives. You don't follow your own religion precepts of love and compassion. Christians = Hypocrites.

derrick09 wrote:Speaking about getting personal, I wouldn't mind if someone would go up to that little machine talking God basher and just jiggle his plug (not pull his plug) but jiggle his plug (you know the plug that controls his little wheelchair thingy, laptop thingy, and that generator thingy that keeps the monster ALIVE! . Again not pull the plug, just lightly and ever so politely jiggle it just to show him that they mean business.

The End.

Yeah, christians tend to do that, and it's only natural you think that way. The concept's also called witch hunt, scientific prosecution, holocaust, etc.

Facundo wrote:I already explained the concept of miracle I'm using in one of my previous posts. Read, then talk.

Nope, couldn't find that! Try to deflect attention from your folly all you want.... I found this though,

Facundo wrote:And I know that if not for religious indoctrination you wouldn't be a believer. Everyone's born an atheist.

Everyone is actually without any belief. You're talking about babies, right? One cannot be born and be agnostic, atheist or theist, since it would require considered thought to arrive at any of the three. I trust you now realise what an absurd statement you have made here? And talking of indoctrination, at what age were you indoctrinated into atheism?

Facundo wrote:Yeah, christians tend to do that, and it's only natural you think that way. The concept's also called witch hunt, scientific prosecution, holocaust, etc.

Oh dear, we have another one ...

DannyM wrote:

Facundo wrote:I already explained the concept of miracle I'm using in one of my previous posts. Read, then talk.

Nope, couldn't find that! Try to deflect attention from your folly all you want.... I found this though,

Facundo wrote:And I know that if not for religious indoctrination you wouldn't be a believer. Everyone's born an atheist.

Everyone is actually without any belief. You're talking about babies, right? One cannot be born and be agnostic, atheist or theist, since it would require considered thought to arrive at any of the three. I trust you now realise what an absurd statement you have made here? And talking of indoctrination, at what age were you indoctrinated into atheism?

Facundo wrote: Hawkings used the word "accident" refering to an improbable event, something perhaps you didn't quite get. Given millions of years, any improbable event will happen at least once. And that's how life emerged. Chemistry laws permit it.

There you go! Wasn't so hard was it? Oh, you looked for the word miracle? Gotta learn to read better eh? =)

When you are born, you don't believe in deities. Babies are atheists.

Personal gods require rationalizations and explanations (specifically as to WHY THEY DON'T SHOW THEMSELVES IN ANY WAY). The absence of belief in them is only natural, because there's no good reason to believe.