Evidence for God from Science

there is the same underlying affirmation in all orthodox Christian denominations surrounding the nature of God, Christ, humanity, sin and forgiveness.

I certainly can't agree with that statement although I wish it were true.

I am one that thinks denominationalism was exactly what Jesus did not want to occur. I believe He wanted us to be one in a much greater sense than the route man took. We are so geared to our rights to be individuals and quite intolerant of other believers that we seek out groups that are closest to the way we think rather than working together to keep Christianity and the true church as being an obvious, distinct, collection of people who are not of this world but belong to another Kingdom and love one another despite certain differences in understandings. Paul tried to put down denominationalism upstarts in the early church but somehow man just had to make someone else the head of the church and not Christ. Much about denominationalism, IMO, comes from man's ego problem and there is a lot of Phariseeism embedded in the dictinctions that believers have made between themselves. There is a joke we probably all have heard about the two guys on a bridge that discussed their similar beliefs and finally when they reached a point of difference, the one shoved the other off the bridge. I think too many denominationally minded people have done something similar and have taken pride in their denomination, some as an idol, to the extent where they look down their nose at believers in other denominations. I really wonder what Jesus thinks of denominationalism ?

But I'm not sure either what Katabole means exactly by not keeping the Word. We all have varying beliefs don't we about what this means ? How does this keep unity if we can't agree on what keeping the Word means ? I think Paul was referring more to keeping Christ as the head of the church and in this regard I think denominations grew to the thousands they are today because they did not keep the Christ of scriptures as the head. When Christ is the head, oneness becomes a reality amongst those born again. When man becomes the head, divisions arise.

'So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God' - Rom 10:17

I have always had this verse presented to me as the way to grow my faith was to study the scriptures. However I think the 'word' here refers to the 'rhema' use of the word. So, I can study and memorize and meditate on the written word, and possibly not ever grow my faith if I have shut out the rhema word of God. Rhema, I believe, has to do with hearing the voice and sensing the Spirit by which the words are spoken. I can read scripture and use my own understandings from my biblical worldview or I can allow God to speak truths through whatever means He uses, including scripture, to grow my faith.

Not sure why I posted this but it was a thought that just struck me.

Sudsy wrote:'So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God' - Rom 10:17

I have always had this verse presented to me as the way to grow my faith was to study the scriptures. However I think the 'word' here refers to the 'rhema' use of the word. So, I can study and memorize and meditate on the written word, and possibly not ever grow my faith if I have shut out the rhema word of God. Rhema, I believe, has to do with hearing the voice and sensing the Spirit by which the words are spoken. I can read scripture and use my own understandings from my biblical worldview or I can allow God to speak truths through whatever means He uses, including scripture, to grow my faith.

Not sure why I posted this but it was a thought that just struck me.

The word in Roman 10:17 is Rhema and it's actually in the Greek (according to the Westcott and Hort version I looked up) actually "Rhematos Christou" or the Word of or about Christ. The context here when you read the whole passage around it relates to preaching or proclaiming the message verbally. That makes sense of course because the context of any Scripture that would be mentioned at this time would be the OT, not the NT which wasn't in extant (even though Romans itself would become part of it.)

It's another example, I think, although in this case not "logos" as a title for Christ of us using the terms here to refer to scriptures directly when it's talking about the message about Christ and how it was presented orally. A fine point perhaps, but I think it lines up with some of what I'm trying to say.

Bart,

Sorry for not responding sooner on this.. I have read some of your posts here but not all of it.. I think I can agree with most of what you have written. My understanding is that the Bible does not have all the answers for us nor will it probably ever will and therefore is not complete. However it does provide us a framework in which we can understand God and His motives.. In a nutshell is that what you are trying to say? I don't think you are implying that it is just man's words and nothing else.. Correct? Sorry I would read more, but my time is short..

No worries Gerald. I was actually saying more that the title "Word of God" is reserved to Jesus and that in evangelical circles there's been a tendency to take that term, even as it is used in the Scripture to apply to Jesus and misunderstand it as applied to scriptures. The Bible is subordinate to Christ and points to Him. No, I am not questioning the inspiration of scripture. I'm stopping short of the deification of scripture. Many claim not to be doing that, but when you look closely at how the terminology is used and how a christian walk is modeled, it's happening more than people realize.

Canuckster1127 wrote:No worries Gerald. I was actually saying more that the title "Word of God" is reserved to Jesus and that in evangelical circles there's been a tendency to take that term, even as it is used in the Scripture to apply to Jesus and misunderstand it as applied to scriptures. The Bible is subordinate to Christ and points to Him. No, I am not questioning the inspiration of scripture. I'm stopping short of the deification of scripture. Many claim not to be doing that, but when you look closely at how the terminology is used and how a christian walk is modeled, it's happening more than people realize.

Oh absolutely.. I think it can come in many forms. I think even subconsciously we endanger ourselves with it.. People say the words God, Jesus, or quote from the Bible all the time and think this somehow gives their words a spiritual status. I'm often reminded of Matthew 7:22-23 when I hear that.