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Re: CAIN'S WIFE
Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 5:46 pm
by Byblos
Seraph wrote:Byblos wrote:Seraph wrote:I'll duck for cover in addition to Byblos since I don't really believe in original sin in the traditional sense. I don't think sin works like an STD, I think it's a necessary product of our free will. It doesn't necessarily have to be "spread" from a single originator a long time ago. I think sin is an abstract (but real) part of human nature, not a physical thing or supernatural force that physically spreads. I think I'm responsible for and the originator of my own sin, not Adam.
And I think that the Holy Spirit changes us when we're saved by improving our character and personality and makes us more like God, rather than physically washing out original sin like you would wash a dirty pair of pants.
My own opinion anyway.
But how did you get this sinful nature? How did it start?
Well Adam committed the first sin and so was the first one to introduce sin (as in, expose people to it's influence and effects). But I think the possibility of sin has been present as far back as we've had the ability to disobey God, which was before Adam ate the fruit.
If people are sinners purely because of original sin, how did Adam choose to sin against God before he introduced original sin by sinning?
By an act of the will.
Re: CAIN'S WIFE
Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 5:54 pm
by Echoside
Seraph wrote:It is my understanding that God judges people by their OWN sin, not the sin of their great great (x400) grandparents. And as long as we're free to choose, we will all inevitably sin.
Adam was the one who first broke the ice as Romans says, but I think other humans would've sinned whether Adam sinned or not.
The words "free to choose" and "inevitably" seem to me to strike a contradiction. Is there a logical reason why all will sin, given the choice?
Re: CAIN'S WIFE
Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 6:29 pm
by Seraph
By an act of the will.
But he hadn't eaten from the tree yet, so he didn't have original sin. I think it shows that sin originates from having free will. Or more specifically it comes from having the choice God laid out in front of us (life vs death) Deut 30:19.
The words "free to choose" and "inevitably" seem to me to strike a contradiction. Is there a logical reason why all will sin, given the choice?
I'd say no human (aside from Jesus, but He had the advantage of being the sinless God) is strong enough to overcome sin at every single point in their life where they are tempted, which is consistent with Romans 3:23. So in that way every human will inevitably sin at some point, even though they have free choice. God realized this or He wouldn't have had to have Jesus come to die.
Re: CAIN'S WIFE
Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 7:17 am
by PaulSacramento
The eating from the tree was a symbolic act of his sin, which was wanting to be like God, independent from God, the sin of believing He didn't need God and could be God, ie: pride.
The sin was there BEFORE he ate from the tree or he never would have eaten from it.
Re: CAIN'S WIFE
Posted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 9:20 am
by ROBE
Genesis 5:4 mentions Adam fathering unnamed sons and daughters.
Moses intoduced the law banning brother and sister marriage.
Abraham was married to his half sister and Lot got his daughters pregnant (okay he was drunk).
Humans started of perfect and over time more and more nasty mutations occured which made having a child with a close relative risky.
Cain and his sister or niece would have been near perfect so no risk to their children, by Moses time there was a danger so God banned it. Simples!