Re: Our supposed qualities
Posted: Tue Jan 01, 2013 2:23 pm
Correct.RickD wrote:So KBC, What you're saying is it's not your belief what you posted?
Correct. Imagine that you have never heard about evolution before this moment and I tell you go read the site that explains evolution and then give me short synopsis of your understanding. Wouldn't it be correct for me to ssume that what you will write will not be what you believe but rather what you understood was being said?RickD wrote:It's kinda like you were thinking out loud, and typing what you understood from reading the text? Like you were and are working your way through, to try to see what's really being said?
Imagine for a moment that once you did write your understanding that I come in and state that they are your beliefs. How would that strike you? Woundn't you be a bit taken back and say something like "those aren't my beliefs they are just what I understand about the subject of evolution"
Presenting myself in text is not my strong suit. I'm a bio-engineer and not a writer so I do my best to clarify my position often just to ensure I don't talk past others.RickD wrote:The reason why I thought it was what you actually believe, is because you stated it so matter- of-factly.
Your posts are no different than any other posts by others, including myself, that are stated to show what we believe. Your posts weren't written like a scientist would write when conducting an experiment.
In the case of biblical testing of concept there is no set scientific method for testing. I'm essentially winging this and hoping I can present it in a way that will make sense to non scientists. My expectation is that most will not be scientists. So my method is this;
1) I read the bible
2) I draw logical understandings / conclusions based on the verses
3) I write down what these conclusions are and then seek to compare them with what others have concluded.
4) I try to define the rationales others have used to make their conclusions
5) Once I have enough of a variety of others conclusions and their rationales I will then decide what is the most believable
So far I have only been able to directly eliminate Catholocism, Jehovah witnesses, mormonism and a few others I can't think of at the moment. However, I have at least 8 different other denominations that are still in the running (so to say) that aren't just straight discernable bunk.
In each case for each sect I have written my understanding and then they define where we are different in understanding and then they define how they reached their differing conclusions. At this point I am still researching a ton of foundational points and some that I never thought to check such as "repent" This would be the last one that goes into being researched and it is there because of you. I had always assumed it meant the same to all, ha what do I know right?.
I would assume as an intelligent being that you read and comprehend and then decide what you are willing to believe. Many people have their hand held by missionaries or preaches etc. who direct how they are to comprehend what they read and for some they believe what they are told and others like me realise that the truth can be subjective. Remember how I keep saying there are a multitude of Christian sects / denominations? This is because I realise that each sect has their own unique foundationl understandings and beliefs based on those understanding. However, as I have also stated "they all can't be right" so In my mind I have to somehow divide error from truth. Thus, I formed a method of testing. Probably not foolproof and I may even err in the end but God directed in his word to test everything. This is the least I can do and hope that he will guide me to the correct end.RickD wrote:Now I think this is a pretty good reason why I misunderstand you. For me, what I understand about scripture is what I believe. That's not to say that my understanding won't change, and so by belief about certain things would change as well. I just don't separate my understanding from my belief. Maybe it's just how my brain works.
We were all created equal in standing before God but from my understanding we all have differing gifts. This to me is the beauty of Gods creation, there is just no end to all the variety in everything he made including each of us. I know people that cannot stand to have one thing out of place on their desk, I know others that have everything scattered and yet somehow they all manage to get where they need to go. I have accepted that I am just one out of billions of unique entities that God gave existence to and I have to assume that I will not see eye to eye with all or even many of them.RickD wrote:Now that's different than how I see things as well. Maybe you don't really establish a belief until you see it in a system. Or in this case, a theological system. My mind is much less organized than yours. I really don't have any theologies that I hold to. I guess that's because if I hold to a theology, I feel like I would have to hold to the whole system the way it is.
I came here to find unique individuals such as yourself who have already made their choices on biblical fundmentals because by rights you should be able to not only define how our understandings may differ but also to define how you rationalised your understanding (which I assume is the foundation for your belief, I do assume some things until someone rattles my cage, such as "repent")
Rick I am sorry for being horribly crippled in my ability to convey what I mean in the correct context it is meant. Like Moses I need a mouthpiece to convey understanding for me. I know whats in my heart and I know how I want to proceed and I definitely don't intend to cause others grief as I wade through my mess of understandings in search of truth.RickD wrote:KBC, I honestly can't remember anyone else posting like they were posting their beliefs, but they were actually posting their understanding only. Like I said before, I don't separate understanding from belief. Now I think I understand what you're saying, and I will go on your word that you are working through this, and you don't have an established set of beliefs yet.
It is indeed a joyfull day if you do comprehend what I'm after. this would mean that even as crippled as I am I have somehow convey the right meaning in the right way to another unique being.
RickD wrote:And I sincerely apologize for completely misunderstanding you. I hope you will forgive me, and I would like it if you would stay, and continue learning, and helping others as well.
Rick You were forgiven before you asked. I wrote it off as my fault for not being able to convey myself properly and prayed that someday God would help me with my infirmity. I had confidence that if you could really understand me that you would have treated me differently since ultimately you are here because of your love for God and those coming to find him. Unlike evo's who I know love to hate, my base assumtion is that you are exactly the opposite of them regardless of where this would have ended.
There is only a small bit of truth I can give to others and it is entirely wrapped up in my mechanical knowing. I have no reservations within that realm that have not been tested to nth degree and I would be entirely pleased to keep giving in that way. In that realm understanding and belief have become one.
On the other hand I am entirely walking through a minefield when it comes to religious foundational understandings and beliefs. The only thing I can say that I have a firmly established belief in is that God exists and I have accepted and believe that Christ is the only way to get from where I am to be with God.
It may be a long road of gathering and learning and accepting before I reach a final determination about everything I want to understand in the subtle points of Christian beliefs but the fact is that finding out is always in the forefront of my mind and it will not go away so I keep reaching out and hope to find some truths among those who profess to already be where I am intending to go.
If there is ever a question in your mind about my exact position on any point you can always ask me what my belief is on it and you will get one of three possible answers 1) thats how I understand the subject 2) This is what I believe or 3) this is what I understand and believe. The third one will basicaly mean I am not changing my position ever. 1 and 2 are both what I consider standing on one foot,
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If by chance you can think of a way I can form a better wording to convey my position so it would be easier for others to understand this would be helpful so that future interactions with others can be clarified from my end easier.
Thank God we have made it to the same page of understanding
I appreciate your working to understand me Rick