B. W. wrote:Gman, your last post directed at me, well proves my point...
No point in commenting on your comments needed. Best I can add is, balance... That is all.
1 Co 10:29-33 "Conscience," I say, not your own, but that of the other. For why is my liberty judged by another man's conscience? But if I partake with thanks, why am I evil spoken of for the food over which I give thanks? Therefore, whether you eat or drink, or whatever you do, do all to the glory of God. Give no offense, either to the Jews or to the Greeks or to the church of God, just as I also please all men in all things, not seeking my own profit, but the profit of many, that they may be saved. NKJV
We are also to judge correctly. And correction is not judgment nor condemnation. What does the Bible say about rebuking?
John 7:24 "Stop judging by mere appearances, but instead judge correctly.”
1 Timothy 5:20 But those elders who are sinning you are to reprove before everyone, so that the others may take warning.
2 Timothy 4:2 Preach the word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage—with great patience and careful instruction.
Titus 2:15 These, then, are the things you should teach. Encourage and rebuke with all authority. Do not let anyone despise you.
B. W. wrote:Col 2:16-17, "So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths, which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ." NKJV
Sorry... This just doesn't fly on many levels.. In the context of Colossians 2 we can clearly see in verse 8 that false teachers had engaged the Colossians to change G-d's laws into their own deceitful doctrine and theology.
Colossians 2:8 See to it that no one takes you captive through hollow and deceptive philosophy, which depends on human tradition and the elemental spiritual forces of this world rather than on Christ.
Therefore we can clearly see that Paul was WARNING the Colossians of the false teachers that would judge them in Colossians 2:16-17. The Biblical festivals and Sabbaths were certainly not human tradition. They were ordained by G-d.
Therefore don't let a false teacher judge YOU when you observe a sabbath day or festival which is the future of what to come... And we can CLEARLY see from scripture that in the future that all mankind will bow before G-d EVERY Sabbath..
Ezekiel 44:24
In any dispute, the priests are to serve as judges and decide it according to my ordinances. They are to keep my laws and my decrees for all my appointed festivals, and they are to keep my Sabbaths holy.
Isaiah 66:24
“As the new heavens and the new earth that I make will endure before me,” declares the LORD, “so will your name and descendants endure. 23 From one New Moon to another and from one Sabbath to another, all mankind will come and bow down before me,” says the LORD.
The sabbath was always a PERMANENT covenant.. Everlasting...
Leviticus 16:31
It is a day of sabbath rest, and you must deny yourselves; it is a lasting ordinance.
Leviticus 23:39-41
So beginning with the fifteenth day of the seventh month, after you have gathered the crops of the land, celebrate the festival to the LORD for seven days; the first day is a day of sabbath rest, and the eighth day also is a day of sabbath rest. 40 On the first day you are to take branches from luxuriant trees—from palms, willows and other leafy trees—and rejoice before the LORD your God for seven days. 41 Celebrate this as a festival to the LORD for seven days each year. This is to be a lasting ordinance for the generations to come; celebrate it in the seventh month.
B. W. wrote:Rom 14:4-8, "Who are you to judge someone else's servants? Whether they are faithful or not is their own master's concern. They will be faithful, because the Lord has the power to make them faithful. Some people consider one day to be more holy than another. Others think all days are the same. Each person should be absolutely sure in his own mind. Those who think one day is special do it to honor the Lord. Those who eat meat do it to honor the Lord. They give thanks to God. Those who don't eat meat do it to honor the Lord. They also give thanks to God. We don't live for ourselves alone. And we don't die all by ourselves. If we live, we live to honor the Lord. If we die, we die to honor the Lord. So whether we live or die, we belong to the Lord. NIrV
Each person must be absolutely sure in his own mind" does NOT equate to "Do whatever you like." Being convinced in your own mind is dealing with doctrinal and practical disputes. Where scripture give a clear word, personal opinion must give way.. But where the Word of G-d is subject to various possible interpretations, let each be persuaded in his own mind while at the same time having respect for one another.
Paul never abrogated G-d's law... In fact he even teaches the dietary laws and other commandments in Acts 15...
Acts 15:20-21 Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood. 21 For the law of Moses has been preached in every city from the earliest times and is read in the synagogues on every Sabbath.”
B. W. wrote:I am happy for you that you desire to keep the mechanical aspects of the law to the letter. Have at it. I am also including a copy from the post on the law thread that applies here as well too..
---> Here are some interesting points to consider from the bible:
Romans 3:21, 22, "But now God has shown us how to become right with him. The Law and the Prophets give witness to this. It has nothing to do with obeying the law. 22 We are made right with God by putting our faith in Jesus Christ. That happens to all who believe. It is no different for the Jews than for anyone else." NIrV
Actually what this verse seems to be implying is that G-d's righteousness has nothing to do with obeying G-d's commandments which is something that I've been trying to convey to you since the beginning.. Obedience is always a product of faith.
B. W. wrote:Romans 3:23, 24, 25, 26, "Everyone has sinned. No one measures up to God's glory. 24 The free gift of God's grace makes all of us right with him. Christ Jesus paid the price to set us free. 25 God gave him as a sacrifice to pay for sins. So he forgives the sins of those who have faith in his blood. God did all of that to prove that he is fair. Because of his mercy he did not punish people for the sins they had committed before Jesus died for them. 26 God did that to prove in our own time that he is fair. He proved that he is right. He also made right with himself those who believe in Jesus." NIrV
Yes. But we are also commanded to stop sinning..
Romans 6:1-2,
“What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin that grace may abound? Certainly not! How shall we who died to sin live any longer in it?”
Romans 6:15-18
What then? Shall we sin because we are not under the law but under grace? By no means! 16 Don’t you know that when you offer yourselves to someone as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one you obey—whether you are slaves to sin, which leads to death, or to obedience, which leads to righteousness? 17 But thanks be to God that, though you used to be slaves to sin, you have come to obey from your heart the pattern of teaching that has now claimed your allegiance. 18 You have been set free from sin and have become slaves to righteousness.
B. W. wrote:Romans 3:27, "Where then is boasting? It is excluded. By what kind of law? Of works? No, but by a law of faith." NASB
Romans 3:28, "We firmly believe that people are made right with God because of their faith. They are not saved by obeying the law." NIrV
Again.. I have never advocated that working or doing G-d's commandments makes you righteous. This is clearly evident throughout scripture.
Ephesians 2:8-10
For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast. 10 For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.
It's how they viewed His commandments and CHANGED them into legalism. But G-d's laws or commandments are NOT legalism themselves..
Romans 9:30-32 What then shall we say? That the Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have obtained it, a righteousness that is by faith; 31 but the people of Israel,
who pursued the law as the way of righteousness, have not attained their goal.
32 Why not? Because they pursued it not by faith but as if it were by works. They stumbled over the stumbling stone.
We know that G-d's laws are actually good... Not a curse when followed out correctly.
Romans 7:12, “Therefore the law is holy,
and the commandment holy and just and good.”
B. W. wrote:Romans 3:29, 30, 31c, "After all, is God the God of the Jews only? Isn’t he also the God of the Gentiles? Of course he is. 30 There is only one God, and he makes people right with himself only by faith, whether they are Jews or Gentiles. 31 Well then, if we emphasize faith, does this mean that we can forget about the law? Of course not! In fact, only when we have faith do we truly fulfill the law." NLT
Again.. Having faith DOES NOT mean now that we destroy G-d's law... This is what satan wants us to do... Now go down to verse 31. Paul clearly states that we must ESTABLISH G-d's laws.
Romans 3:31, “Do we then make void the law through faith? Certainly not!
On the contrary, we establish the law.”
B. W. wrote:Romans 3:20 clarifies how the law is fulfilled / established / Confirms / aids the standing - purpose (of Torah Law) which is verified in Romans chapters 7, 9, and 10
"For no one can ever be made right with God by doing what the law commands. The law simply shows us how sinful we are." Romans 3:20 NIrV
Abraham - was he made righteous in God's sight by not eating pork - when was he made righteous – before circumcision or after?
Answer – before the Moses Law ever came. The Law was to lead people to their need for a savior, not to keep folks tied up with fear of breaking the mechanical aspects of Moses’ Law.
After all, a Gefilte Fish, lettuce, and tomato sandwich is not too appealing… but if one’s conscience wishes to not eat pork, no condemnation from me – go ahead and enjoy! I respect that. Keep the Saturn’s day Sabbath too – with blessings. No problem.
Again Bryan.. I have never advocated that obeying G-d's commandments makes you righteous.. I have been always stating that obedience to G-d's commandments is the EVIDENCE or RESULT of faith in Christ.
B. W. wrote:But if a person thinks eating pork (bacon, lettuce, and tomato sandwich) will send you to hell and not doing a mandatory Saturn’s day rest ensures one’s eternal d-mnation, then we have a problem.
That is how the law exposes what true sin is within the deceptive heart of human beings…
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I don't believe that eating pork or obeying the sabbath is an issue of salvation... I never have. Do you really think we are going to impress G-d on judgement day by not eating pork? I wouldn't think so, but we obey regardless.
And truly, I never really liked that fatty pork anyway and I'm lazy by nature and like my days off so now I have a great excuse for both...
