Evidence for God from Science

Stu wrote:

PeteSinCA wrote:This is just putting the article Seraph linked & quoted into other words, but ...

We really cannot compare modern earthquake frequency data to what we "knew" even as recently as a century or two ago. Modern instruments are far more sensitive and ubiquitous: we now get data for remote unpopulated and sparsely areas from which we did not (either for lack of observation or lack of communication); modern instruments record many, many earthquakes that are so minor that human observers don't notice them, even when awake and at rest.

To this, add the fact that communications and records technology and the subsistence culture of large parts of the world means that our knowledge of as recently as a century ago is very incomplete, and we don't know how great that gap really is.

Speaking personally: 1.) I am not denying that Jesus will return; 2.) I do not deny that Jesus might return tomorrow (or even before I finish typing this post, which might be tomorrow, ). ALL I am saying is that we do not have the ~2000 years of knowledge necessary to say that recent earthquake data are or are not evidence that Jesus will be returning soon.

And I try hard not to think about whether the tone of the OP in this thread would incline or disincline a non-believer toward Christ.

The Bible doesn't talk about frequency of earthquakes.
It talks about earthquakes in diverse places. It's about where they take place.

OK, and do we know places that have never before had earthquakes are now experiencing them? Or that the number and/or intensity and/or location of the earthquakes that occurred in 1013 is substantially different from those in 2013? Again, our knowledge base is not sufficient for such a claim.

neo-x wrote:Well, I am glad DRDS that you think I am fullfilling some kind of prophecy. You're words kind of startled me.

Even Paul wondered if christ was going to return in Paul's own lifetime...so I don't blame you, but I think that you are taking it quite ahead without much to back it up. I think you need good christian fellowship. People of faith who can give you a comfort zone, really I think that would help you. Remember Christ's words, we do not know the day nor the time...let that sink in please. Even Christ said only the father knew. Revelations for all that it is, is not even fully described...there are a couple of times within that book where the author is called to "not write" certain things and omit them...what are those things and how long is that period, we do not even know.

I put my faith in christ, whether he comes tommorow or 10000 years from now, I know I am with him, so I have no worries and I don't care when he comes. We should have faith in his promises!

Again, Neo, I wasn't directly referring to you, I was referring to some "others" that are being unnecessarily dogmatic about their view that "all is well" and that we are not even close to being in the end times and perhaps never will be. But as far as joining a institutional church I've been in and out of that sort of thing a long time ago, it's too much to go into as far as details, but if you want my main reasons for staying away it has to do with the fact that I think we are currently in the Ladeocian church age, the fact that most people in my area are two faced self righteous lying hypocrites who paint the picture of God being a hateful genocidal maniac, and the fact I've found much more fulfillment in my walk with God on the web formally from places like this and with more direct contact with people such as bippy who I talk with frequently on facebook.

But if you want to dig much deeper, I tend to share the same views on the modern day institutional church like what Canuckster1127 holds to, you can ask him since he's done much more work and write ups on this topic than I have. But pretty much his views and my views are one and the same.

DRDS, Bart and I share some of that too. I left the church for the same reasons.

I'm not judging none for not congregating because I have been there and done that myself, but I do think it wrong to go and separate oneself from the multitude of believers who happen to have all the same ills as sinners. You all were once young babes in Christ, and if it wasn't for there being a body of faithful worshipers, it just might of not prompted you to learn more about what is and what isn't Biblical as fast as you rose to the spirit that you're in presently. Just my opinion., Peace.


And as to the earthquake part, hell man, I lived in California all my life., earthquakes happen every day and every night somewhere over here., most of them we don't even feel them, and the ones we do, we just measure them to see what we're gonna do., go outside or stay in bed., i don't really know how they can say that there's more earthquakes in this century more so that in prior millenia since there were no record keeping back then., I read that ~> like the news on serial killers, where nowadays we tend to think (especially the 70's) that there's a whole lot of them, but if you where to go back and do some research on the subject, you'd come to find out that there were a ton of them back in the last (1900) century as well., hell, people back then thought that the were living in the end times; hence the reason for the millerites, the campbellitess, the russelites, the mormons, adventists and a whole series of restoration movement era folks., end times theological philosophy continues on year after year, decade after decade, century after century., there's no end for it, and we look for the signs; we look to see what we can discern, but after all is said and done, we're still here., personally I don't understand why spend so much time tying to find out the end time when the end time for oneself can come like a thief in the night, no? .. But it does make for entertaining conversations., maybe that's why the tube has so many shows about it on the regular., good entertainment.

The comments on this thread have startled me, at how many of you know people that are becoming faithless, even your own loved ones.

From what I have observed in earthquakes occurring in Australia, New Zealand and Malaysia over the past 10 years, it shows an increase in magnitude, frequency and occurrence in new locations, that are not associated with earthquake or volcanic activity.

Some people probably don't understand that, end time predictions in the Bible have a context of long times, not just a few decades, but centuries.
The book of Daniel deals with thousands of years, including all the major world powers right until the end.
But as we get closer to the end, in the context of those major times, the number of predictions, and the details of events, increases with the shortening of time.
Also the people in the last days have the "spirit of prophecy" Rev 19:10. They are aware of the long times and short times and how they all fit in. But they also don't know everything that's predicted, they have a knowledge of what the Bible says, and "when it happens." as Jesus said, "you will know" which scripture is being fulfilled.

Some people put all prophecies into the last section of time, others put it all into the past, and others symbolize everything away into nothing but notions.

But a careful view will consider all the signs and put them into context with each other, as well as with the time lines given. The number of signs and prophecies increases from the dusk of the 18th century to the end. Perhaps this is what is meant by "knowledge shall increase."

Some of the mistakes made in the past over prophecies, have been to rush ahead with events foretold and apply them to the immediate generation, while others have misapplied the whole lot and placed them into some time in the future or far away into the past. But it does not change what has been written, nor does it invalidate scripture. Some of those misunderstandings were made by God's own people, such as the disciples not understanding the predicted resurrection, causing them to suffer bitter disappointment. But making those mistakes did not condemn them or remove them from God's care.

The confusion that Satan has ensured about prophecies will cause the faithless to mock and stumble.
The theory of evolution with its eons of time and the misunderstanding of prophecies, have caused many Christians to say, "where is the promise of His coming?" - things have not changed since the beginning of time. II Peter 3:4-10. And Jesus said "when the Son of man returns, shall He find faith?"

The apparent delay does not diminish what God has predicted, it took Noah 120 years to build the ark. But some people count the long-suffering of God, who is not willing to end things or that any should perish, as slackness.