Evidence for God from Science

PaulSacramento wrote:The comparison between God and "other Gods" is done when people don't fully understand the Christian concept of God.
The Christian understanding of WHAT and WHO God is means that God MUST exist because if He didn't, nothing would exist.

What non believers know about the Christian God is usually the result of what the Bible says about him and what his followers say about him. The problem with your claim is that In the eyes of the non believer, the Christian God is described in a way that he is NOT required to exist in order for everything else to exist.

Ken

Kenny wrote:

PaulSacramento wrote:The comparison between God and "other Gods" is done when people don't fully understand the Christian concept of God.
The Christian understanding of WHAT and WHO God is means that God MUST exist because if He didn't, nothing would exist.

What non believers know about the Christian God is usually the result of what the Bible says about him and what his followers say about him. The problem with your claim is that In the eyes of the non believer, the Christian God is described in a way that he is NOT required to exist in order for everything else to exist.

Ken

This shows either a complete lack of comprehension or a deliberate attempt at obfuscation. All I have to say is ... err.. WHAT? Are you even serious with that? You must be joking, please tell me you're joking.

Ken: What non believers know about the Christian God is usually the result of what the Bible says about him and what his followers say about him. The problem with your claim is that In the eyes of the non believer, the Christian God is described in a way that he is NOT required to exist in order for everything else to exist.

Ken

Huh???!!! What does that even mean?

[quote="RickD"][quote]
[Not true. God is not complex.

Ok, you know that about the undetectable.

I challenge you to read

a line, if not a good one.
But you'll probably decline. Stating some excuse about this or that.

I'd hope this sort of cheap dig would be unworthy of you, but clearly it is not.

Give it a read. You might open yourself up to the truth. What are you afraid of Audie?


I already knew you had a knack for cliches and subtext. No need to strut such tacky stuff.

"Afraid" "open yourself" "excuse" "truth" Give yourself a break even if you dont have any respect for me, try some self respect.

As for jac, estimable gentleman as he may be, I would not go looking for "truth' about
the deep nature of reality from a person who used to the same tools to arrive at the belief that YEC is anything but vapid and childish.

Kenny wrote:

PaulSacramento wrote:The comparison between God and "other Gods" is done when people don't fully understand the Christian concept of God.
The Christian understanding of WHAT and WHO God is means that God MUST exist because if He didn't, nothing would exist.

What non believers know about the Christian God is usually the result of what the Bible says about him and what his followers say about him. The problem with your claim is that In the eyes of the non believer, the Christian God is described in a way that he is NOT required to exist in order for everything else to exist.

Ken

No Ken, non-believers fabricate what they THINK The Bible says about God.

The bible states that God is the creator and sustainer of all and without God, there is no life.
Colossians 1:17
1 Corinthians 8:6

That all the exists is of God.
Without God, ultimately, there would not be anything.

The issue is that non-believers think of God as they do "other gods", simply because they don't realize that the Christian understanding of God means that God IS existence and as the creator of all AND the sustainer of all, without God there is nothing.

That is why comments like "I don't believe in Zeus either" or ' I just believe in one less god than you" are comments of ignorance about God.

Audie wrote:...I already knew you had a knack for cliches and subtext. No need to strut such tacky stuff.

"Afraid" "open yourself" "excuse" "truth" Give yourself a break even if you dont have any respect for me, try some self respect.

As for jac, estimable gentleman as he may be, I would not go looking for "truth' about the deep nature of reality from a person who used to the same tools to arrive at the belief that YEC is anything but vapid and childish.

Star Trek: This Side of Paradise
From http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0708483/quotes

Dr. McCoy: Well, that's the second time man's been thrown out of paradise.

Captain James T. Kirk: No, no, Bones, this time we walked out on our own. Maybe we weren't meant for paradise. Maybe we were meant to fight our way through, struggle, claw our way up, scratch for every inch of the way. Maybe we can't stroll to the music of the lute. We must march to the sound of drums.

... Audie are you not following the beat of the drum of some sort of ism yourself???
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Byblos wrote:

Kenny wrote:

PaulSacramento wrote:The comparison between God and "other Gods" is done when people don't fully understand the Christian concept of God.
The Christian understanding of WHAT and WHO God is means that God MUST exist because if He didn't, nothing would exist.

What non believers know about the Christian God is usually the result of what the Bible says about him and what his followers say about him. The problem with your claim is that In the eyes of the non believer, the Christian God is described in a way that he is NOT required to exist in order for everything else to exist.

Ken

This shows either a complete lack of comprehension or a deliberate attempt at obfuscation. All I have to say is ... err.. WHAT? Are you even serious with that? You must be joking, please tell me you're joking.

Naww bro; I ain't jokin' the fact that there are people who study astronomy who know a lot more about it than you and I combined yet they do not believe in the Christian God should tell you that it is possible for someone to conclude the God as described in the Bible is not necessary on order for everything to exist.

Ken

Naww bro; I ain't jokin' the fact that there are people who study astronomy who know a lot more about it than you and I combined yet they do not believe in the Christian God should tell you that it is possible for someone to conclude the God as described in the Bible is not necessary on order for everything to exist.

Ken

Kenny, the God as described in the bible ( and if you are of the mind, tradition) MUSt exist by the very simpel fact that He IS existence.
As the creator and sustainer ( first cause and prime mover), if He did not exist then the universe would have NOT come to be OR be able to continue to exist.
IF there is even JUST one "law" of physics or even just ONE "necessary element" then God MUST exist.

The issue is that you don't seem to grasp what is being stated is an undisputable fact about the universe that exists.

B. W. wrote:

Audie wrote:...I already knew you had a knack for cliches and subtext. No need to strut such tacky stuff.

"Afraid" "open yourself" "excuse" "truth" Give yourself a break even if you dont have any respect for me, try some self respect.

As for jac, estimable gentleman as he may be, I would not go looking for "truth' about the deep nature of reality from a person who used to the same tools to arrive at the belief that YEC is anything but vapid and childish.

Star Trek: This Side of Paradise
From http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0708483/quotes

Dr. McCoy: Well, that's the second time man's been thrown out of paradise.

Captain James T. Kirk: No, no, Bones, this time we walked out on our own. Maybe we weren't meant for paradise. Maybe we were meant to fight our way through, struggle, claw our way up, scratch for every inch of the way. Maybe we can't stroll to the music of the lute. We must march to the sound of drums.

... Audie are you not following the beat of the drum of some sort of ism yourself???
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I was not addressing you, but if you want to address me, you could try being on topic?

PaulSacramento wrote:

Naww bro; I ain't jokin' the fact that there are people who study astronomy who know a lot more about it than you and I combined yet they do not believe in the Christian God should tell you that it is possible for someone to conclude the God as described in the Bible is not necessary on order for everything to exist.

Ken

Kenny, the God as described in the bible ( and if you are of the mind, tradition) MUSt exist by the very simpel fact that He IS existence.
As the creator and sustainer ( first cause and prime mover), if He did not exist then the universe would have NOT come to be OR be able to continue to exist.
IF there is even JUST one "law" of physics or even just ONE "necessary element" then God MUST exist.

The issue is that you don't seem to grasp what is being stated is an undisputable fact about the universe that exists.

I understand what is claimed about God, I just don't agree with it. If what were said of him were an undisputable fact, then absolute proof would have been given by now.

Ken

Ken: I understand what is claimed about God, I just don't agree with it. If what were said of him were an undisputable fact, then absolute proof would have been given by now.

Ken

Ken, let's say that the God of the Bible is proven to exist, that He is the ONLY God, and that nothing would exist without Him bringing it into existence. What would be your response to that knowledge?

Kenny wrote:

PaulSacramento wrote:

Naww bro; I ain't jokin' the fact that there are people who study astronomy who know a lot more about it than you and I combined yet they do not believe in the Christian God should tell you that it is possible for someone to conclude the God as described in the Bible is not necessary on order for everything to exist.

Ken

Kenny, the God as described in the bible ( and if you are of the mind, tradition) MUSt exist by the very simpel fact that He IS existence.
As the creator and sustainer ( first cause and prime mover), if He did not exist then the universe would have NOT come to be OR be able to continue to exist.
IF there is even JUST one "law" of physics or even just ONE "necessary element" then God MUST exist.

The issue is that you don't seem to grasp what is being stated is an undisputable fact about the universe that exists.

I understand what is claimed about God, I just don't agree with it. If what were said of him were an undisputable fact, then absolute proof would have been given by now.

Ken

So, the fact that you exist and I exist and the universe exists, that isn't enough proof of the existence of God?
Is it because you don't agree that God MUST exist for their to be something?

Kenny wrote:

PaulSacramento wrote:

Naww bro; I ain't jokin' the fact that there are people who study astronomy who know a lot more about it than you and I combined yet they do not believe in the Christian God should tell you that it is possible for someone to conclude the God as described in the Bible is not necessary on order for everything to exist.

Ken

Kenny, the God as described in the bible ( and if you are of the mind, tradition) MUSt exist by the very simpel fact that He IS existence.
As the creator and sustainer ( first cause and prime mover), if He did not exist then the universe would have NOT come to be OR be able to continue to exist.
IF there is even JUST one "law" of physics or even just ONE "necessary element" then God MUST exist.

The issue is that you don't seem to grasp what is being stated is an undisputable fact about the universe that exists.

I understand what is claimed about God, I just don't agree with it. If what were said of him were an undisputable fact, then absolute proof would have been given by now.

Ken

PaulSacramento wrote: So, the fact that you exist and I exist and the universe exists, that isn't enough proof of the existence of God?

Correct.

PaulSacramento wrote: Is it because you don't agree that God MUST exist for their to be something?

Correct.

K

Philip wrote:

Ken: I understand what is claimed about God, I just don't agree with it. If what were said of him were an undisputable fact, then absolute proof would have been given by now.

Ken

Ken, let's say that the God of the Bible is proven to exist, that He is the ONLY God, and that nothing would exist without Him bringing it into existence. What would be your response to that knowledge?

For such a hypothetical; I don't know what my response would be.

Ken

Kenny wrote:

Philip wrote:

Ken: I understand what is claimed about God, I just don't agree with it. If what were said of him were an undisputable fact, then absolute proof would have been given by now.

Ken

Ken, let's say that the God of the Bible is proven to exist, that He is the ONLY God, and that nothing would exist without Him bringing it into existence. What would be your response to that knowledge?

For such a hypothetical; I don't know what my response would be.

Ken

I can imagine some few things that would be involved. I think that what would settle out
after a while would be an intense sense of joy and excitement.