Evidence for God from Science

Couldnt the birds easily just fly away from a flooded river?

Audie wrote:Couldnt the birds easily just fly away from a flooded river?

We're possibly talking about an area hundreds of thousands of sq km in size. Not just a flooded river.

RickD wrote:

Audie wrote:Couldnt the birds easily just fly away from a flooded river?

We're possibly talking about an area hundreds of thousands of sq km in size. Not just a flooded river.

It be what I been wonderin' , what could you posdibly be talking about?

Describe svp the actual area involved?

We're not gonna drown
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9EXRxHPEpWc

Audie wrote:

RickD wrote:

Audie wrote:Couldnt the birds easily just fly away from a flooded river?

We're possibly talking about an area hundreds of thousands of sq km in size. Not just a flooded river.

It be what I been wonderin' , what could you posdibly be talking about?

Describe svp the actual area involved?

Nobody knows the actual area. One theory is that the Mesopotamian basin was the area.

Others think it was where the Caspian Sea is today.
http://www.oldearth.org/articles/flood_location.htm

Nothing to falsify

Audie wrote:Nothing to falsify

See, you can be reasonable.

RickD wrote:What I guess I'm looking to find out, is if the only people to die in the flood were restricted to a local flood area, and there were others throughout the globe that weren't affected, what does that do theologically, if anything?

What do you mean theologically?

RickD wrote:

Audie wrote:Nothing to falsify

See, you can be reasonable.

Can you (not) be tiresome?

PaulSacramento wrote:

RickD wrote:What I guess I'm looking to find out, is if the only people to die in the flood were restricted to a local flood area, and there were others throughout the globe that weren't affected, what does that do theologically, if anything?

What do you mean theologically?

What I'm asking is what the ramifications are theologically, if only the line of Adam died in the flood. For those who believe there were preexisting modern humans throughout the globe at the time of the flood that weren't affected, what's the message/meaning of the flood narrative?

For comparison, some young earthers think the gospel is compromised if there was death before the fall. If Noah's flood didn't kill all of humanity, does that do anything to the gospel? Or does it do anything at all for that matter?

RickD wrote:

Audie wrote:

RickD wrote:

Audie wrote:Couldnt the birds easily just fly away from a flooded river?

We're possibly talking about an area hundreds of thousands of sq km in size. Not just a flooded river.

It be what I been wonderin' , what could you posdibly be talking about?

Describe svp the actual area involved?

Nobody knows the actual area. One theory is that the Mesopotamian basin was the area.

Others think it was where the Caspian Sea is today.
http://www.oldearth.org/articles/flood_location.htm

Wherein I find this bit of weirdness..

1. The basin has no geological deposits which would qualify as flood deposits.5 Morton himself answers this in another of his articles. In critiquing the Mesopotamian flood scenario, Morton states that "To completely erode flood sediments takes more than 20,000 years. In the progressive creationist time frame for the flood, it could not have occurred prior to 35,000 years ago. Most likely it was about 50,000 years ago. Thus, we have twice the amount of time that Morton allows for completely eroding away any flood sediments. Given this vast amount of time, we cannot expect to find any flood sediments from Noah's Flood. -

Anything you notice about that?

RickD wrote:

PaulSacramento wrote:

RickD wrote:What I guess I'm looking to find out, is if the only people to die in the flood were restricted to a local flood area, and there were others throughout the globe that weren't affected, what does that do theologically, if anything?

What do you mean theologically?

What I'm asking is what the ramifications are theologically, if only the line of Adam died in the flood. For those who believe there were preexisting modern humans throughout the globe at the time of the flood that weren't affected, what's the message/meaning of the flood narrative?

For comparison, some young earthers think the gospel is compromised if there was death before the fall. If Noah's flood didn't kill all of humanity, does that do anything to the gospel? Or does it do anything at all for that matter?

I don't think there is any doctrine that is based on the flood being a global event...
Or any doctrine based on the flood at all ( other than the covenant with Noah).
I mean, the lesson of the flood is that God WILL punish those that do not repent and WILL save those that do, even if it means punishment for MANY and salvation for few.
I don't think the lesson changes if the flood is local VS global.

Audie wrote:

RickD wrote:

Audie wrote:

RickD wrote:

Audie wrote:Couldnt the birds easily just fly away from a flooded river?

We're possibly talking about an area hundreds of thousands of sq km in size. Not just a flooded river.

It be what I been wonderin' , what could you posdibly be talking about?

Describe svp the actual area involved?

Nobody knows the actual area. One theory is that the Mesopotamian basin was the area.

Others think it was where the Caspian Sea is today.
http://www.oldearth.org/articles/flood_location.htm

Wherein I find this bit of weirdness..

1. The basin has no geological deposits which would qualify as flood deposits.5 Morton himself answers this in another of his articles. In critiquing the Mesopotamian flood scenario, Morton states that "To completely erode flood sediments takes more than 20,000 years. In the progressive creationist time frame for the flood, it could not have occurred prior to 35,000 years ago. Most likely it was about 50,000 years ago. Thus, we have twice the amount of time that Morton allows for completely eroding away any flood sediments. Given this vast amount of time, we cannot expect to find any flood sediments from Noah's Flood. -

Anything you notice about that?

Considering that I have no idea how long it takes for flood deposits to erode, no.

RickD wrote:

Audie wrote:

RickD wrote:

Audie wrote:

RickD wrote: We're possibly talking about an area hundreds of thousands of sq km in size. Not just a flooded river.

It be what I been wonderin' , what could you posdibly be talking about?

Describe svp the actual area involved?

Nobody knows the actual area. One theory is that the Mesopotamian basin was the area.

Others think it was where the Caspian Sea is today.
http://www.oldearth.org/articles/flood_location.htm

Wherein I find this bit of weirdness..

1. The basin has no geological deposits which would qualify as flood deposits.5 Morton himself answers this in another of his articles. In critiquing the Mesopotamian flood scenario, Morton states that "To completely erode flood sediments takes more than 20,000 years. In the progressive creationist time frame for the flood, it could not have occurred prior to 35,000 years ago. Most likely it was about 50,000 years ago. Thus, we have twice the amount of time that Morton allows for completely eroding away any flood sediments. Given this vast amount of time, we cannot expect to find any flood sediments from Noah's Flood. -

Anything you notice about that?

Considering that I have no idea how long it takes for flood deposits to erode, no.

Recognizing you've had no geology, you can still use a little thought.
"Flood deposits" could dry to a fine film of dust that blows away in minutes,
or it could involve boulders, and potentially last more or less forever.

The flood deposits along the Tibris Euphrates valley that have been cited as
evidence for a Noah flood are layered deposits, from successive floods. The
deeper they get buried, the less they seem inclined to erode away.

There are to be found various sorts of "flood deposits" in strata many tens of millions of years old.

The 20K figure has no basis.

ALSO, as the flood deposit in question would be at the bottom of a lake, how
could it erode away?

Saying we cannot expect to find sediments from the flood is correct, but not for the reason given. Well, I guess some do expect to find them. But they never do.

For those who like a world wide flood, there is no world wide "flood" marker.

Sure it would disappear in some places, others it would be there like it was yesterday.

There is no indication that the Caspian Sea suddenly flooded at any appropriate date.

I'd imagine people have done sediment cores aplenty there, as it is an oil producing area.

The Black Sea would have shown a fairly rapid rise in level at the end of the last ice age, but not at any dramatic rate. As the Mediterranean rose, it
overtopped the high point on the channel, and water would have poured over at high tide, then steadily, months or years later.

There are buried houses from the old lake shore. But one scarcely could have needed a boat to get away from such a leisurely flood.

Audie wrote:

RickD wrote:

Audie wrote:

RickD wrote:

Audie wrote:
It be what I been wonderin' , what could you posdibly be talking about?

Describe svp the actual area involved?

Nobody knows the actual area. One theory is that the Mesopotamian basin was the area.

Others think it was where the Caspian Sea is today.
http://www.oldearth.org/articles/flood_location.htm

Wherein I find this bit of weirdness..

1. The basin has no geological deposits which would qualify as flood deposits.5 Morton himself answers this in another of his articles. In critiquing the Mesopotamian flood scenario, Morton states that "To completely erode flood sediments takes more than 20,000 years. In the progressive creationist time frame for the flood, it could not have occurred prior to 35,000 years ago. Most likely it was about 50,000 years ago. Thus, we have twice the amount of time that Morton allows for completely eroding away any flood sediments. Given this vast amount of time, we cannot expect to find any flood sediments from Noah's Flood. -

Anything you notice about that?

Considering that I have no idea how long it takes for flood deposits to erode, no.

Recognizing you've had no geology, you can still use a little thought.
"Flood deposits" could dry to a fine film of dust that blows away in minutes,
or it could involve boulders, and potentially last more or less forever.

The flood deposits along the Tibris Euphrates valley that have been cited as
evidence for a Noah flood are layered deposits, from successive floods. The
deeper they get buried, the less they seem inclined to erode away.

There are to be found various sorts of "flood deposits" in strata many tens of millions of years old.

The 20K figure has no basis.

ALSO, as the flood deposit in question would be at the bottom of a lake, how
could it erode away?

Saying we cannot expect to find sediments from the flood is correct, but not for the reason given. Well, I guess some do expect to find them. But they never do.

For those who like a world wide flood, there is no world wide "flood" marker.

Sure it would disappear in some places, others it would be there like it was yesterday.

There is no indication that the Caspian Sea suddenly flooded at any appropriate date.

I'd imagine people have done sediment cores aplenty there, as it is an oil producing area.

The Black Sea would have shown a fairly rapid rise in level at the end of the last ice age, but not at any dramatic rate. As the Mediterranean rose, it
overtopped the high point on the channel, and water would have poured over at high tide, then steadily, months or years later.

There are buried houses from the old lake shore. But one scarcely could have needed a boat to get away from such a leisurely flood.

Audie,

Why debate something that never happened? Could I ever convince you that a flood happened that fits any biblical interpretation of Noah's flood?