Animals Complex Emotions

Ark~Magic · Post by **Ark~Magic** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 5:05 am

I don't think that Ape Art 1 was a product of random stabbing/stroking.

Neither do I think it was the product of some brilliantly guided plan. Have you ever seen an ape evolve into a picasso or van gogh? I don't even think those images are what you're suggesting.

numeral2_5 · Post by **numeral2_5** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 5:07 am

Random is completely senseless like Robin William's humor.

numeral2_5 · Post by **numeral2_5** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 5:09 am

I would rank the ape's art as below Picasso but above alot of abstract in terms of randomness.

Ark~Magic · Post by **Ark~Magic** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 5:09 am

You could make anything out of that art, whether it be brilliant or stupid.

numeral2_5 · Post by **numeral2_5** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 5:11 am

I think that the first ape painting in quality is above that of a middle income year and a half old kid.

Believer · Post by **Believer** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 5:14 am

numeral2_5, clearly we are going in circles getting nowhere. Again, what is the point you are bringing up? That monkeys are very smart? Yes, smart. Smart as we really think they are? No.

numeral2_5 · Post by **numeral2_5** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 5:16 am

I don't in a million years think that they are as smart as us; I just think they are capable of complex emotion and abstract thought.

Believer · Post by **Believer** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 5:23 am

numeral2_5 wrote:I don't in a million years think that they are as smart as us; I just think they are capable of complex emotion and abstract thought.

Perhaps, but is there proof, let alone evidence of COMPLEX emotion and abstract thought?

numeral2_5 · Post by **numeral2_5** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 5:27 am

Thinker wrote:
numeral2_5 wrote:I don't in a million years think that they are as smart as us; I just think they are capable of complex emotion and abstract thought.
Perhaps, but is there proof, let alone evidence of COMPLEX emotion and abstract thought?

Perhaps, but is there proof, let alone evidence of COMPLEX emotion and abstract thought in people; you've never seen a brain of a chimp but you know it is there.

CLARIFICATION: The brain thing is an analogy. I'm sorry.

Believer · Post by **Believer** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 5:36 am

numeral2_5 wrote:
Thinker wrote:
numeral2_5 wrote:I don't in a million years think that they are as smart as us; I just think they are capable of complex emotion and abstract thought.
Perhaps, but is there proof, let alone evidence of COMPLEX emotion and abstract thought?
Perhaps, but is there proof, let alone evidence of COMPLEX emotion and abstract thought in people; you've never seen a brain of a chimp but you know it is there.

CLARIFICATION: The brain thing is an analogy. I'm sorry.

I'm sorry, this doesn't work, we can examine this through human nature and human expression, monkeys on the other hand do not exhibit these COMPLEXITIES.

numeral2_5 · Post by **numeral2_5** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 5:38 am

Thinker wrote:
numeral2_5 wrote:
Thinker wrote:
numeral2_5 wrote:I don't in a million years think that they are as smart as us; I just think they are capable of complex emotion and abstract thought.
Perhaps, but is there proof, let alone evidence of COMPLEX emotion and abstract thought?
Perhaps, but is there proof, let alone evidence of COMPLEX emotion and abstract thought in people; you've never seen a brain of a chimp but you know it is there.

CLARIFICATION: The brain thing is an analogy. I'm sorry.
I'm sorry, this doesn't work, we can examine this through human nature and human expression, monkeys on the other hand do not exhibit these COMPLEXITIES.

I think that they exibit these particular complexities but to a lesser degree than that of humans.

kateliz · Post by **kateliz** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 5:46 am

In what ways have apes expressed abstract thought?

numeral2_5 · Post by **numeral2_5** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 5:49 am

Chimpanzee, orangutans, and gorillas have had to think outside of the box; in the wild they have used sticks to fish bugs out of a whole, gauge water depth, understand the principle of leverage, as well as make hats and umbrellas.

This stuff is not instinct.

CLARIFICATION: I don't mean complex mechanical umbrellas.

kateliz · Post by **kateliz** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 5:55 am

But can they fathom the concept of a god? That's my test for abstract thought!

numeral2_5 · Post by **numeral2_5** » Sat Nov 26, 2005 5:58 am

kateliz wrote:But can they fathom the concept of a god? That's my test for abstract thought!

Ther are many people who cannot fathom the concept of a god they are called atheists and agnostics. That's why agnostics become agnostics.

Evidence for God from Science

Animals Complex Emotions

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